[gentoo-user] No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[gentoo-user] No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

I'm doing an install using the quick-install doc and this weeks
stage3 snapshot, and I find I can't use scp or ssh once I've
chroot'ed.  Is that normal?

  livecd linux # scp 192.168.2.4:/usr/src/linux/.config .
  PRNG is not seeded

I noticed the same thing in the install I did a few days ago.
Later in that install grub failed to install and after
rebooting, my /dev directory was missing just about everything.

Here's the /dev directory in the chroot'ed environment I got
using stage3-i686-20090114.tar.bz2:

  livecd linux # ls -l /dev 
  total 12
  lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root   15 Jan 20 21:30 MAKEDEV -> ../sbin/MAKEDEV
  -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   75 Jan 20 21:49 null
  drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Jan 13 19:29 pts
  drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Jan 13 19:29 shm

I checked the contents of stage3-i686-20090114.tar.bz2, and
this is all that's there:

   $ tar tvf stage3-i686-20090114.tar.bz2 | fgrep ./dev
   drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/
   -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/null
   lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/MAKEDEV -> ../sbin/MAKEDEV
   -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/.keep
   drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/
   -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/.keep
   drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/
   -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/.keep

In contrast, stage3-i686-2008.0.tar.bz2 has a fully populated
/dev/ tree:

   $ tar tvf stage3-i686-2008.0.tar.bz2 | fgrep ./dev | wc -l
   5181
   
I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
recent stage3 snapshots?

-- 
Grant

[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-21, Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> wrote:

> I noticed the same thing in the install I did a few days ago.
> Later in that install grub failed to install and after
> rebooting, my /dev directory was missing just about everything.
>
> Here's the /dev directory in the chroot'ed environment I got
> using stage3-i686-20090114.tar.bz2:
>
>   livecd linux # ls -l /dev 
>   total 12
>   lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root   15 Jan 20 21:30 MAKEDEV -> ../sbin/MAKEDEV
>   -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   75 Jan 20 21:49 null
>   drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Jan 13 19:29 pts
>   drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 Jan 13 19:29 shm

It looks like stage3-i686-20090114.tar.bz2 is broken.

The stage3 tar files for the previous two weeks are missing
(the DIGEST and CONTENTS files are on the mirrors, but no
tar.bz2).

stage3-i686-20081224.tar.bz2 seems to have the proper /dev
entries.

> I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
> installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
> recent stage3 snapshots?

I guess the additional step is to not use a broken stage3
tarball.

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Dirk Heinrichs]

Am Mittwoch, den 21.01.2009, 04:04 +0000 schrieb ext Grant Edwards:

> I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
> installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
> recent stage3 snapshots?

One usually bind-mounts /dev, /proc and /sys into the chroot, like

mount --bind /dev /newinstall/dev # dito for /proc, /sys
chroot /newinstall

If this isn't documented, you should file a bug.

HTH...

	Dirk

Re: [gentoo-user] No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Nickolas Fortino]

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On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 11:52 PM, Dirk Heinrichs <dirk.heinrichs.ext@nsn.com
> wrote:

> Am Mittwoch, den 21.01.2009, 04:04 +0000 schrieb ext Grant Edwards:
>
> > I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
> > installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
> > recent stage3 snapshots?
>
> One usually bind-mounts /dev, /proc and /sys into the chroot, like
>
> mount --bind /dev /newinstall/dev # dito for /proc, /sys
> chroot /newinstall
>
> If this isn't documented, you should file a bug.
>
> HTH...
>
>        Dirk
>
>
>
The best gentoo chroot guide I know of is:
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/howtos/index.xml?part=1&chap=2

Obviously, throw out any 32-bit specific stuff if you aren't doing 32-bit on
a 64-bit machine.

Nick

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[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-21, Dirk Heinrichs <dirk.heinrichs.ext@nsn.com> wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, den 21.01.2009, 04:04 +0000 schrieb ext Grant Edwards:
>
>> I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
>> installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
>> recent stage3 snapshots?
>
> One usually bind-mounts /dev, /proc and /sys into the chroot, like
>
> mount --bind /dev /newinstall/dev # dito for /proc, /sys
> chroot /newinstall


> If this isn't documented, you should file a bug.

That's docuemented in the "normal" install doc, but not in the
quick install doc.

But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
with problems such as no console during startup.

-- 
Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow! RELATIVES!!
                                  at               
                               visi.com            

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Nick Cunningham]

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2009/1/21 Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com>

> On 2009-01-21, Dirk Heinrichs <dirk.heinrichs.ext@nsn.com> wrote:
> > Am Mittwoch, den 21.01.2009, 04:04 +0000 schrieb ext Grant Edwards:
> >
> >> I'm a little confused. Is there supposed to be an additional
> >> installation step to populate the /dev directory when using
> >> recent stage3 snapshots?
> >
> > One usually bind-mounts /dev, /proc and /sys into the chroot, like
> >
> > mount --bind /dev /newinstall/dev # dito for /proc, /sys
> > chroot /newinstall
>
>
> > If this isn't documented, you should file a bug.
>
> That's docuemented in the "normal" install doc, but not in the
> quick install doc.
>
> But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
> reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
> with problems such as no console during startup.
>
> --
> Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow! RELATIVES!!
>                                  at
>                               visi.com
>
>
>
IIRC thats because  /dev should be populated on startup by udev so i would
check that udev is installed and working properly, if you use openrc then
this could be the cause as openrc now starts udev through normal scripts i
think, sometimes on upgrade from baselayout 1 they may not be automatically
added to the right runlevels.

- Nick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:50:17 +0000, Nick Cunningham wrote:

> > But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
> > reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
> > with problems such as no console during startup.

> IIRC thats because  /dev should be populated on startup by udev so i
> would check that udev is installed and working properly, if you use
> openrc then this could be the cause as openrc now starts udev through
> normal scripts i think, sometimes on upgrade from baselayout 1 they may
> not be automatically added to the right runlevels.

You still need /dev/console in the dev directory of the root partition,
along with /dev/null. Anything else is a waste of disk space and inodes
as the static /dev/devices are hidden as soon as udev starts. If the
tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but it is also broken
if it contains thousands of device entries. 


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Do not merely believe in miracles; rely on them. * Finagle

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[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-21, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:50:17 +0000, Nick Cunningham wrote:
>
>>> But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
>>> reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
>>> with problems such as no console during startup.
>
>> IIRC thats because  /dev should be populated on startup by udev so i
>> would check that udev is installed and working properly, if you use
>> openrc then this could be the cause as openrc now starts udev through
>> normal scripts i think, sometimes on upgrade from baselayout 1 they may
>> not be automatically added to the right runlevels.
>
> You still need /dev/console in the dev directory of the root
> partition, along with /dev/null. Anything else is a waste of
> disk space and inodes as the static /dev/devices are hidden as
> soon as udev starts. If the tarball doesn't contain
> /dev/console it is broken, but it is also broken if it
> contains thousands of device entries. 

Then all the stage3 tarballs I've ever seen are broken.  They
either contain 5000+ entries, or nothing but these:

drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/
-rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/null
lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/MAKEDEV -> ../sbin/MAKEDEV
-rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/.keep
drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/
-rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/.keep
drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/
-rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/.keep

What I do know is that using a stage3 with 5000+ entries allows
you to install using either the normal or quick install
instructions.  Using one with just the above /dev entries
causes problems either way -- more so if using the quick
install instructions since there is no step where you mount
udev to /mnt/gentoo/dev.

-- 
Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow! I'm sitting on my
                                  at               SPEED QUEEN ... To me,
                               visi.com            it's ENJOYABLE ... I'm WARM
                                                   ... I'm VIBRATORY ...

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Dirk Heinrichs]

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Am Mittwoch, 21. Januar 2009 17:48:27 schrieb Grant Edwards:

> Then all the stage3 tarballs I've ever seen are broken.  They
> either contain 5000+ entries, or nothing but these:

Yes they are. Having 5000+ entries in there while udev is in used is just 
stupid. I'm glad they've fixed that know.

> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/
> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/null
> lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/MAKEDEV ->
> ../sbin/MAKEDEV -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/.keep
> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/
> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/.keep
> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/
> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/.keep

Yes, that's broken as well. All you need, as Neil wrote, is null and console.

> What I do know is that using a stage3 with 5000+ entries allows
> you to install using either the normal or quick install
> instructions.

And forcing you to remove them later, since they just waste inodes (on an 
inode based fs, of course).

> Using one with just the above /dev entries
> causes problems either way -- more so if using the quick
> install instructions since there is no step where you mount
> udev to /mnt/gentoo/dev.

So you need to file two bug reports ;-)

Bye...

	Dirk

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[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-21, Dirk Heinrichs <dirk.heinrichs@online.de> wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, 21. Januar 2009 17:48:27 schrieb Grant Edwards:
>
>> Then all the stage3 tarballs I've ever seen are broken.  They
>> either contain 5000+ entries, or nothing but these:
>
> Yes they are. Having 5000+ entries in there while udev is in
> used is just stupid. I'm glad they've fixed that know.
>
>> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/
>> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 21:20 ./dev/null
>> lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/MAKEDEV ->
>> ../sbin/MAKEDEV -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/.keep
>> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/
>> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/shm/.keep
>> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/
>> -rw-r--r-- root/root         0 2009-01-13 19:29 ./dev/pts/.keep
>
> Yes, that's broken as well. All you need, as Neil wrote, is
> null and console.
>
>> What I do know is that using a stage3 with 5000+ entries allows
>> you to install using either the normal or quick install
>> instructions.
>
> And forcing you to remove them later, since they just waste
> inodes (on an inode based fs, of course).
>
>> Using one with just the above /dev entries causes problems
>> either way -- more so if using the quick install instructions
>> since there is no step where you mount udev to
>> /mnt/gentoo/dev.
>
> So you need to file two bug reports ;-)

Yup, I'll put them on my list of things to do:

 1) bug report for quick-install

 2) bug report for 2008.0 stage3 (too many useless /dev entries)

 3) bug report for weekly autobuild stage3 (missing /dev/console) 

-- 
Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow! I'm ZIPPY the PINHEAD
                                  at               and I'm totally committed
                               visi.com            to the festive mode.

[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-21, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:50:17 +0000, Nick Cunningham wrote:
>
>>> But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
>>> reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
>>> with problems such as no console during startup.
>
>> IIRC thats because /dev should be populated on startup by udev
>> so i would check that udev is installed and working properly,
>> if you use openrc then this could be the cause as openrc now
>> starts udev through normal scripts i think, sometimes on
>> upgrade from baselayout 1 they may not be automatically added
>> to the right runlevels.
>
> You still need /dev/console in the dev directory of the root partition,
> along with /dev/null.

Try telling that to somebody in the Gentoo forum hiding behind
the screen name "desultory".  Sheesh.  I reported the issue to
the forum thread as requested by the article on www.gentoo.org,
and I got a very hostile reaction.  Bascially I got a snide,
insulting response, a complete denial that there was a problem
with the tarball in question, and a denial that either
/dev/console or /dev/null is needed at boot time.

That's the last time I waste my time with that forum.  I should
have known. Web forums all suck.  Web forum UIs are all
completely abominable, and they seem to be inhabited almost
exclusively by surly, unjustifiably arrogant junior-high kids
hiding behind stupid screen names and even worse avatars.

> Anything else is a waste of disk space and inodes as the
> static /dev/devices are hidden as soon as udev starts.

Yup.

> If the tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but
> it is also broken if it contains thousands of device entries. 

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Volker Armin Hemmann]

On Freitag 23 Januar 2009, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2009-01-21, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> > On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:50:17 +0000, Nick Cunningham wrote:
> >>> But, that doesn't really solve the problem, since after a
> >>> reboot the /dev directory will be empty again and you end up
> >>> with problems such as no console during startup.
> >>
> >> IIRC thats because /dev should be populated on startup by udev
> >> so i would check that udev is installed and working properly,
> >> if you use openrc then this could be the cause as openrc now
> >> starts udev through normal scripts i think, sometimes on
> >> upgrade from baselayout 1 they may not be automatically added
> >> to the right runlevels.
> >
> > You still need /dev/console in the dev directory of the root partition,
> > along with /dev/null.
>
> Try telling that to somebody in the Gentoo forum hiding behind
> the screen name "desultory".  Sheesh.  I reported the issue to
> the forum thread as requested by the article on www.gentoo.org,
> and I got a very hostile reaction.  Bascially I got a snide,
> insulting response, a complete denial that there was a problem
> with the tarball in question, and a denial that either
> /dev/console or /dev/null is needed at boot time.
>
> That's the last time I waste my time with that forum.  I should
> have known. Web forums all suck.  Web forum UIs are all
> completely abominable, and they seem to be inhabited almost
> exclusively by surly, unjustifiably arrogant junior-high kids
> hiding behind stupid screen names and even worse avatars.
>
> > Anything else is a waste of disk space and inodes as the
> > static /dev/devices are hidden as soon as udev starts.
>
> Yup.
>
> > If the tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but
> > it is also broken if it contains thousands of device entries.

I have a server running that hets that null/console missing message every boot 
- and it does not hurt it at any way.

[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-23, Volker Armin Hemmann <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:

>>> If the tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but
>>> it is also broken if it contains thousands of device entries.
>
> I have a server running that hets that null/console missing message every boot 
> - and it does not hurt it at any way.

You are still able to see the output from all the init scripts?

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Volker Armin Hemmann]

On Freitag 23 Januar 2009, Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2009-01-23, Volker Armin Hemmann <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >>> If the tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but
> >>> it is also broken if it contains thousands of device entries.
> >
> > I have a server running that hets that null/console missing message every
> > boot - and it does not hurt it at any way.
>
> You are still able to see the output from all the init scripts?

yes

[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-23, Volker Armin Hemmann <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Freitag 23 Januar 2009, Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2009-01-23, Volker Armin Hemmann <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> >>> If the tarball doesn't contain /dev/console it is broken, but
>> >>> it is also broken if it contains thousands of device entries.
>> >
>> > I have a server running that hets that null/console missing message every
>> > boot - and it does not hurt it at any way.
>>
>> You are still able to see the output from all the init scripts?
>
> yes

That's interesting, because on my systems, if /dev/console is
missing, then there is no non-kernel console output until most
of the way through the startup-process when udev starts.

-- 
Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow! Well, I'm INVISIBLE
                                  at               AGAIN ... I might as well
                               visi.com            pay a visit to the LADIES
                                                   ROOM ...

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Dirk Heinrichs]

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Am Freitag, 23. Januar 2009 15:48:48 schrieb Grant Edwards:
> On 2009-01-23, Volker Armin Hemmann <volkerarmin@googlemail.com> wrote:
> > On Freitag 23 Januar 2009, Grant Edwards wrote:
> >> You are still able to see the output from all the init scripts?
> >
> > yes
>
> That's interesting, because on my systems, if /dev/console is
> missing, then there is no non-kernel console output until most
> of the way through the startup-process when udev starts.

That reminds me of one thing: Are you still running baselayout 1? On a 
baselayout 2/openrc box udev is started at the very beginning of the userland 
boot process. Maybe that's the difference between Volker's and your system.

Bye...

	Dirk

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 05:55:10 +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:

> I have a server running that hets that null/console missing message
> every boot 
> - and it does not hurt it at any way.

A missing /dev/console stops the boot process here. It boots
without /dev/null, but only after udev spews out a load of messages.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Procrastinate now!

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[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-24, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 05:55:10 +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
>
>> I have a server running that hets that null/console missing
>> message every boot - and it does not hurt it at any way.
>
> A missing /dev/console stops the boot process here. It boots
> without /dev/null, but only after udev spews out a load of
> messages.

Ah, not to worry: I've been assured in the gentoo forum thread
that the problems we see when the root filesystem doesn't have
proper /dev/null and /dev/console nodes aren't really
happening:

  Neither /dev/null nor /dev/console are needed at boot-time,
  therefore their absence doesn't cause problems.

[You must admit the argument is flawless -- though I still
question the premise.]

In order to get rid of my problems that weren't happening, I
initially tried the "mount -bind" and "cp -a" commands that
show up in /etc/issue when your /dev directory is hosed.  That
didn't help: after setting /etc/issue back to the default file
and rebooting all the same problems still weren't happening
(and /etc/issue was again modified to tell me to do mount -bind
and cp -a to fix them).

Then I tried booting with root in rw mode and init=/bin/bash
and then doing a MAKEDEV generic-i386.  (I found that recipe in
an old mailing list somewhere.) MAKEDEV complained a lot about
not being able to read /proc/devices. When I rebooted, I still
had the all same problems not happening as before.

I finally booted from a minimal install CD, mounted my root
partition, removed its /dev directory completely and then
re-created it by untaring ./dev from a good stage3 tarball. Now
the system boots up smoothly. I feel like a bit of a fool
expending so much effort getting rid of problems that weren't
happening -- but, now the problems that weren't happening are
gone, so I'm happy.

;)

-- 
Grant

[gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Grant Edwards]

On 2009-01-25, Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> wrote:
> On 2009-01-24, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 05:55:10 +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
>>
>>> I have a server running that hets that null/console missing
>>> message every boot - and it does not hurt it at any way.
>>
>> A missing /dev/console stops the boot process here. It boots
>> without /dev/null, but only after udev spews out a load of
>> messages.
>
> Ah, not to worry: I've been assured in the gentoo forum thread
> that the problems we see when the root filesystem doesn't have
> proper /dev/null and /dev/console nodes aren't really
> happening:
>
>   Neither /dev/null nor /dev/console are needed at boot-time,
>   therefore their absence doesn't cause problems.

For posterity's sake, one of the problems that wasn't happening
was that my root partition always had to be recovered at
startup -- it apparently wasn't getting properly unmounted
during shutdown.  After re-creating the root partition's /dev
tree, that was cured.

This leads one to suspect that the block device node for the
root partition (/dev/hda3 in my case) is also required along
with /dev/null and /dev/console for proper start-up and
shut-down.

-- 
Grant

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: No /dev entries in recent stage3 snapshots?

[Dale]

Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2009-01-25, Grant Edwards <grante@visi.com> wrote:
>   
>> On 2009-01-24, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
>>     
>>> On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 05:55:10 +0100, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
>>>
>>>       
>>>> I have a server running that hets that null/console missing
>>>> message every boot - and it does not hurt it at any way.
>>>>         
>>> A missing /dev/console stops the boot process here. It boots
>>> without /dev/null, but only after udev spews out a load of
>>> messages.
>>>       
>> Ah, not to worry: I've been assured in the gentoo forum thread
>> that the problems we see when the root filesystem doesn't have
>> proper /dev/null and /dev/console nodes aren't really
>> happening:
>>
>>   Neither /dev/null nor /dev/console are needed at boot-time,
>>   therefore their absence doesn't cause problems.
>>     
>
> For posterity's sake, one of the problems that wasn't happening
> was that my root partition always had to be recovered at
> startup -- it apparently wasn't getting properly unmounted
> during shutdown.  After re-creating the root partition's /dev
> tree, that was cured.
>
> This leads one to suspect that the block device node for the
> root partition (/dev/hda3 in my case) is also required along
> with /dev/null and /dev/console for proper start-up and
> shut-down.
>
>   


Well just to confirm that this is not happening, I ran into the same
thing a good while back when I was transferring my system from one disk
to another.  I didn't copy /dev, /sys, /proc and something else.  I had
to reboot from the CD and copy all the /dev/stuff so I could boot.  At
the time I didn't know what I "didn't" have to have.

Note there is a bit of sarcasm there.  It appears that they are needed
but some just "think" we don't.  My rig, Abit NF7 mobo with a AMD 2500+
rig using udev like I guess everybody else is.

Weird.

Dale

:-)  :-)