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[74.188.249.136]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j14sm1553893otk.27.2020.05.02.02.54.04 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 02 May 2020 02:54:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] 32GB RAM and Swap To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org References: <5EACAC3B.7010406@youngman.org.uk> <3047718.aeNJFYEL58@lenovo.localdomain> From: Dale Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=rdalek1967@gmail.com; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFxc7MgBEAC+zrgEdqJJiDe/UDAB+ScmferXWfJTVjbVT2T4DQ7jiLrgP9aNUo1HioNF mrU3JPOCR32gvZyTbY1+niO5+VSo/+pSqQ785h6ZDj1klMkrg6tEzGnf2MNBpBj4houZwxQ+ WDKKTg2M9F+lv8wTIdR/JQn+hSviktLMtrghQlyLhpapsLXWLA6gMFebpQYwxUwemvan8ddX lQvJe9FGyFYvBi0dp1gl10F2O+DVZJxvX8xkX+yImVlhVJiC31gXHRcj+Qlo7gprlU7TIieF Uow6/ZvYKJ26pztVdFCg5w0rMJkF/x8Zd4A6wnuptiAPmWaQ1+YKgYDonbDUgwqFSx5/lN5z DGZ4LlioxeUTTPVvZsqBIeDz6jNFA583OYbo1/S26dqrvTFf2DKlsvoDpVfAhNlwJPjoixs0 X3FNqPv+M10n4kq5Iz7Q9E3O4s/nfFIYGocEslVka7zZPkXSaHbsn+KJlY8XV6qxtCEdh0/V XX1+1aU2J74M0JikWhpwxTZ1dP5aOyWSPPEgFFIRW6xwwC02SoRH9a7mggfGYp/YjPlONNaT SCL8sgRfvmq3D0XTbLyTjSbExxkfKDmbePQagawDE3TlI/oivHf1JaAcbwMb3LZuU4TGcOIl 5D+x7q0MUIeCop0ZFOwAnqW3AVVNvsBkv2KN+IHJryWAf0/iMQARAQABtBtEYWxlIDxyZGFs ZWsxOTY3QGdtYWlsLmNvbT6JAk4EEwEIADgWIQTZ7suruPBaS60bCYXvEM/XWu+ZnAUCXFzs yAIbIwULCQgHAgYVCgkICwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAKCRDvEM/XWu+ZnN+7D/4/1dNG4aCz0+v+ 0dcjV5tY1feYEWCdHKyDzxWBxlCpd/0NPRQeNY4VMjbCl/sq7GkXi/c2SbfWDQ5BQRkkExG1 pSwuXSIehGok/4fpTi3HDAguRvzdCqlKPt7me05FyiC/WnpY5GOlJ3ruGw2qABv/RmV2q5b/ tkq7h1y1f16DTNr3/nsj8HzHcrHdXdL4kaYChSOe/dbQR9Stqak7eMyR+iwvrJMNF/CGl70P 2x5ybsXMDzRVOqNcpa5ZdhEMTVh6+vC1SOmm1BFMF8XCqBEvBbcHWDQmGYTdNCsS/ADm8CBl gvjJgLdIsAzoMu4WHQDFnzXAoArqFWgAf53isOS4AWrv29tF9b8Aa1vb7h5JEa+ArcMsA6Gl X38+GY6WXXaxKI9n3PTCWu9tPGnRh7mABjnwEosDDqmzw8aTAYECb3avDuGY2rmcjgh4H6RE w08d63j1T4d5J9wlm4TGtW/VHgbUFkATEdH3Acl/EjFiyqTiX7p8kU6Reu5enIkogA93xoQh Rmy7ZiST/5LN+ZkaOdyjIw0L+5KalslN9SKt809YxgJ6kPo657LNTFPiFvFA46/SEWcBYrzq Xk0wEW0gBRWf+BqN0qRhU0/EQ+QfRdLLFg2xtUePwlheYLXxfyDLrdCCOLWYpkzbjCZHLS4u 69smbvR9S9KBDNzJybxEWrkCDQRcXOzIARAA5IGRWTqaM44IJgBYghZg2fGj0Am7KWPhE7V7 T/EEe7vVSUEFqHtlHzI4ZK6Q0AZ9uAEjE8IJIQ7KoTjzNqAtabP0vp3s0szgtJlsZ+8vGKlQ my7fvzSrdoQL0Xn7CEwJYFXJ1EMUcYIQeoHG1cUAaXx73k9BFbjwjnUeMrqlV/ZovQlg7duW nESfQ7HZu5NrtYyY3jPMUouxiO9WQPh+IHxZbt1absF2VcvRAymD32RxGvMPbw6ChMRD/p9O 4PH7M5rXaxr78NXQX9E48vrI00f1cYb9NSN1HnSV8cW3jKObVjdBk6jPQwrMvdpgdQhUB9aZ HS/9mC9mmAgiXKyCpzXe7FPB6QznSfn4GIaC/luy1e6SLUkJhRK/niB+gq+Mfxg2zXNuDUTI cMGmpDCp3kgUoorkaltk8RW09io95BkXrGhcDNuSGZfAParBc7RXyYpbIcax8St7tEAd2oFh 4seYOPUlzuhGrPpqR/91wrFc4E1260GKauSr4UhMJv6tygBwyC0mmBMKi+ZXw6ZdZxA5fg7y 35P3TILjznCXXTDgRHq9A3NknKRMcgFacX6eIhANkMFo6oJVjuEgy1dvu1wFfDq7c+i8GAHu L4pYzyXYu6PporlNNU0xSwdVgzM/uuK0lt+UxCimgC+YR3IezgDcbfudb7h9dGIwL+bbPL0A EQEAAYkCNgQYAQgAIBYhBNnuy6u48FpLrRsJhe8Qz9da75mcBQJcXOzIAhsMAAoJEO8Qz9da 75mcXZ4P/1YXgWDZek7mhzrf6uaQzMxa92P89HeWz4PlgB/32symeEFAV04WazzBZffI8AYY rGA1Xmu/2VaB9+FOODyKhUWBc2UL0NRWBk6POwboyTdKlclmpixaN9zLcBt0YLejoRfN1B/5 aQf9/lUDZMnAiCyz0FgeqEMUshldmwWC35RqnjrCbbuk2vIqSH6BLDIXU6jQrLHE1DF0ai41 wLtQFAFXPhn45n0ZwYhVs4Z32z4sjXrIvgBgCaXa4HM+L1Klne0KiNM8ReFTTpTE0SgyDOSZ O3MOa2n77i6JbVtsbiFYnNeP3J9S/l3jevGpZEtNQOKrIm1MW8jGuHWtsDeMkT/mCcSodlkt PxIo+mMK9GpGvG2hW80LiohqNfUbNwAmr3blOYY4URPXPRnEnPs4pmTmL5owjw2dkg145i9I D42Tq+XZ6YtWt3SGzGbAYow6XwTwZ5NFAzV9UQuCGrDw4KWan6O6Z+VIYWsn0UMZlu1Obxna aocofkaUCbISK26kImuD1aA8juSHC18Qv1xUage6/UakbSxyDtACqt6hOVFKX3IA59ApdNRT +2x3iCmlvF9MJsGgFq6IpqL+Fk7iWV8Kjbz0wQOId6N9+JdQh3LrLaS7a1PowUm1z9DK5/O0 Yg+gpDnEOOFI7WM5u7a7FSM2Z/LXGVwel/0eWvLk9tN6 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 2 May 2020 04:54:02 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.1 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <3047718.aeNJFYEL58@lenovo.localdomain> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------4D386B52A9DB035B44CF8BF9" X-Archives-Salt: 40099c33-f879-4f36-b6b3-62359faa3aec X-Archives-Hash: 1c05f96c325d309c7b33c52958da4851 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------4D386B52A9DB035B44CF8BF9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Michael wrote: > On Saturday, 2 May 2020 09:53:06 BST Dale wrote: >> Wols Lists wrote: >>> On 01/05/20 21:29, Dale wrote: >>>> It gets really slow to respond when it uses swap but it beats crashing. >>>> Just set swapiness to a low number. I think mine is set to 10. >>>> >>>> Given the cheapness of hard drives, I'm not sure why having several >>>> gigabytes of swap space is of much concern. I have the same amount of >>>> ram as you and I have a 12GB swap space. I use LVM so I can grow it if >>>> needed or just add another swap space. I might add, I've seen times >>>> where it gets used. >>> That first paragraph is why too much swap space is bad - if an app goes >>> rogue it can kill system response and make regaining control of the >>> system a nightmare. >>> >>> Accidentally or on purpose, if a system runs out of ram and starts >>> thrashing, you're in big trouble if it's an app eating memory like no >>> tomorrow. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Wol >>> >>> . >> That's why I set swapiness to a low number. I don't want it to use swap >> unless it is to prevent a crash. If I set it to a higher number, it >> wants to use swap even when there is memory available. Once it starts >> using swap, it gets slow. The more it uses, the worse it gets. >> However, it beats it rebooting without umounting partitions and such. >> If nothing else, it may give me time to use the alt-sys sequence. >> >> I'm maxed out on memory at the moment but wish I could get and afford >> 64GBs, in a way. Still, I'd have a swap partition. >> >> Dale >> >> :-) :-) > I'd be interested to know as a comparison if Nikos' and Dale's I/O > unresponsiveness in swapping sees an improvement with the I/O scheduler for > spinning drives set to bfq; e.g.: > > echo bfq > /sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler This is its setting at the moment.  root@fireball / # cat /sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler noop deadline [cfq] root@fireball / # I know I can echo it in but where do I set that to that when booting?  Same as swappiness??  I'm willing to set it and see what it does next time swap pops into gear.  Given it is me, it may not be to long.  LOL  I have to say, while sddm-helper is still absorbing to much memory, it is holding steady at around 1GB or 3.3%.  It's nowhere near enough to test this theory, yet.  :/ Dale :-)  :-)  --------------4D386B52A9DB035B44CF8BF9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Michael wrote:
On Saturday, 2 May 2020 09:53:06 BST Dale wrote:

Wols Lists wrote:

On 01/05/20 21:29, Dale wrote:

It gets really slow to respond when it uses swap but it beats crashing.
Just set swapiness to a low number.  I think mine is set to 10.

Given the cheapness of hard drives, I'm not sure why having several
gigabytes of swap space is of much concern.  I have the same amount of
ram as you and I have a 12GB swap space.  I use LVM so I can grow it if
needed or just add another swap space.  I might add, I've seen times
where it gets used.

That first paragraph is why too much swap space is bad - if an app goes
rogue it can kill system response and make regaining control of the
system a nightmare.

Accidentally or on purpose, if a system runs out of ram and starts
thrashing, you're in big trouble if it's an app eating memory like no
tomorrow.

Cheers,
Wol

.

That's why I set swapiness to a low number.  I don't want it to use swap
unless it is to prevent a crash.  If I set it to a higher number, it
wants to use swap even when there is memory available.  Once it starts
using swap, it gets slow.  The more it uses, the worse it gets. 
However, it beats it rebooting without umounting partitions and such. 
If nothing else, it may give me time to use the alt-sys sequence. 

I'm maxed out on memory at the moment but wish I could get and afford
64GBs, in a way.  Still, I'd have a swap partition. 

Dale

:-)  :-)

I'd be interested to know as a comparison if Nikos' and Dale's I/O 
unresponsiveness in swapping sees an improvement with the I/O scheduler for 
spinning drives set to bfq; e.g.:

echo bfq > /sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler

This is its setting at the moment. 


root@fireball / # cat /sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler
noop deadline [cfq]
root@fireball / #


I know I can echo it in but where do I set that to that when booting?  Same as swappiness??  I'm willing to set it and see what it does next time swap pops into gear.  Given it is me, it may not be to long.  LOL  I have to say, while sddm-helper is still absorbing to much memory, it is holding steady at around 1GB or 3.3%.  It's nowhere near enough to test this theory, yet.  :/

Dale

:-)  :-) 
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