[gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Jorge Almeida]

I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
(version 7.0-r1).
Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this normal?

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Jorge Almeida
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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Bo Ørsted Andresen]

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On Thursday 12 October 2006 00:56, Jorge Almeida wrote:
> I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
> (version 7.0-r1).
> Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
> I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this normal?

As has been mentioned before on this list you could still run your X programs 
with an external X server. Hence it's not that unlikely that nothing requires 
a local X server. To tell it you want to keep the local X server run:

# emerge --noreplace xorg-x11

-- 
Bo Andresen

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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Richard Fish]

On 10/11/06, Jorge Almeida <jalmeida@math.ist.utl.pt> wrote:
> I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
> (version 7.0-r1).
> Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
> I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this normal?

xorg-x11 is just a meta-build now with modular X, and nothing in the
tree is really supposed to depend on it.  Packages are supposed to
depend on those parts of x.org that they really use.  So unmerging
xorg-x11-7.0-r1 will not break anything:

carcharias rjf # equery files xorg-x11
[ Searching for packages matching xorg-x11... ]
* Contents of x11-base/xorg-x11-7.1:
/etc
/etc/X11
/etc/X11/xorg.conf
/usr
/usr/X11R6 -> ../usr

-Richard
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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Jorge Almeida]

On Wed, 11 Oct 2006, Richard Fish wrote:

> On 10/11/06, Jorge Almeida <jalmeida@math.ist.utl.pt> wrote:
>>  I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
>>  (version 7.0-r1).
>>  Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
>>  I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this normal?
>
> xorg-x11 is just a meta-build now with modular X, and nothing in the
> tree is really supposed to depend on it.  Packages are supposed to
> depend on those parts of x.org that they really use.  So unmerging
> xorg-x11-7.0-r1 will not break anything:
>
But wouldn't it add to entropy, next time I do a "emerge -NDu world"?
-- 
Jorge Almeida
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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Jorge Almeida]

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On Thu, 12 Oct 2006, Bo Ørsted Andresen wrote:

> On Thursday 12 October 2006 00:56, Jorge Almeida wrote:
>> I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
>> (version 7.0-r1).
>> Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
>> I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this normal?
>
> As has been mentioned before on this list you could still run your X programs
> with an external X server. Hence it's not that unlikely that nothing requires
> a local X server. To tell it you want to keep the local X server run:
>
> # emerge --noreplace xorg-x11
>
>
I don't understand: doesn't the "X" USE variable implies that a local
server is required?
-- 
Jorge Almeida

Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Alan McKinnon]

On Thursday 12 October 2006 10:28, Jorge Almeida wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2006, Bo Ørsted Andresen wrote:
> > On Thursday 12 October 2006 00:56, Jorge Almeida wrote:
> >> I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove x11-base/xorg-x11
> >> (version 7.0-r1).
> >> Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
> >> I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this
> >> normal?
> >
> > As has been mentioned before on this list you could still run your
> > X programs with an external X server. Hence it's not that unlikely
> > that nothing requires a local X server. To tell it you want to keep
> > the local X server run:
> >
> > # emerge --noreplace xorg-x11
>
> I don't understand: doesn't the "X" USE variable implies that a local
> server is required?

No, use.desc says the the X use flag means "adds support for X11". That 
definitely doesn't mean that it has to be a local X server. Support for 
X11 client libs is more like it.

It all makes perfect sense: if you want to install an X11 client app, 
then it will have the X flag set and link against the X11 client libs. 
Now the app can talk X11 and have it's output display on an X server, 
wherever that might be.

Now you decide you want a local X server. Cool - 'emerge xorg-x1' gives 
you one

alan

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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Alan McKinnon]

On Thursday 12 October 2006 10:18, Jorge Almeida wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Oct 2006, Richard Fish wrote:
> > On 10/11/06, Jorge Almeida <jalmeida@math.ist.utl.pt> wrote:
> >>  I did "emerge -p --depclean" and it would remove
> >> x11-base/xorg-x11 (version 7.0-r1).
> >>  Now, how can this be? (No, I don't run a X-less workstation!)
> >>  I know --depclean  is not to be blindly trusted, but is this
> >> normal?
> >
> > xorg-x11 is just a meta-build now with modular X, and nothing in
> > the tree is really supposed to depend on it.  Packages are supposed
> > to depend on those parts of x.org that they really use.  So
> > unmerging xorg-x11-7.0-r1 will not break anything:
>
> But wouldn't it add to entropy, next time I do a "emerge -NDu world"?

No, if you look inside the xorg-x11 ebuild, you'll it depends on 
xorg-server (the actual X server itself), a bunch of common apps 
(xauth, xhost, xrandr, etc), 10 or so libs and 4 font related packages.

So all that gets installed and no other package relies on xorg-x11 
directly, they depend on eg xorg-server instead. So when 
you 'emerge -NDu world' the dependencies are satisfied and all is well 
in portage-land.

As long as no ebuilds do stupid things like depend on xorg-x11 directly, 
all will continue to work correctly even if xorg-x11 is removed

alan
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Re: [gentoo-user] x11-base/xorg-x11 not needed?!

[Jorge Almeida]

On Thu, 12 Oct 2006, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> But wouldn't it add to entropy, next time I do a "emerge -NDu world"?
>
> No, if you look inside the xorg-x11 ebuild, you'll it depends on
> xorg-server (the actual X server itself), a bunch of common apps
> (xauth, xhost, xrandr, etc), 10 or so libs and 4 font related packages.
>
> So all that gets installed and no other package relies on xorg-x11
> directly, they depend on eg xorg-server instead. So when
> you 'emerge -NDu world' the dependencies are satisfied and all is well
> in portage-land.
>
> As long as no ebuilds do stupid things like depend on xorg-x11 directly,
> all will continue to work correctly even if xorg-x11 is removed
>
OK, thanks.
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Jorge Almeida
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