From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F54F158042 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 22:13:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 68781E0954; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 22:13:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-io1-f46.google.com (mail-io1-f46.google.com [209.85.166.46]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C4872E0940 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 22:13:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-io1-f46.google.com with SMTP id ca18e2360f4ac-83dfab49655so1941839f.1 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 14:13:39 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1731708818; x=1732313618; h=content-transfer-encoding:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=sZUkKQqfrwG4D5hIkhs2Bj2oVTfCUs+8o6mDi9ZZ0n4=; b=wi/Pe3hhuVMQgc9v/7CFe3vXlJqQF6BnhLFMoC09bDf4Q4bPLmV/QzxXDKDuQ+Vecf Klxs4geGFLkc84XtpL4bLjsX7mujsAh7/FerM55DgRXftKJ+R0llHg68OeHeAupljoAI M+oA/YRiifDqXw4WZUQS7GECq45cToQwKd75F11tQvYkRb3NmRYWmDRfzXWLNQhwcJOC 4mi2taFDkWaS2wcldd3XKskS4skrPcCboXMB/eyGDpt4CL/oyVurgt3CJglO0WSvnCDw 5KC4N1mEy1VplK8PPAiqRlEV2yjKt3ZlKuao4O8mneAeIVTE9ayj9Ib2HS7AmPyxuiRo fRBA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yzsj+0KLaj2nJJN34JweFTmp7KxSTMNqpQPBDJvTG/1cuoJnACR ZTdopqW7l0HxaFXgns0dKYPMseq8AVJM0LvXA4bVO4a3jPtZuxTKhyKYr6zY7AUsOG2HbjH8Gih pfwXl0Fp1/6n18Zj7PJXYxjoogpYqaw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IG69TDRbSDPjQ6ItTBSQx4+mK/1PbZ6r28fM9W7n1brTiAKgmhsnHchhFMI6HgClTRbat48oPM/Xk9dkdckmnA= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6602:2c95:b0:837:7f1a:40af with SMTP id ca18e2360f4ac-83e6c18ebdcmr456749639f.14.1731708818022; Fri, 15 Nov 2024 14:13:38 -0800 (PST) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <2965683.e9J7NaK4W3@rogueboard> <471aaa99-dcd1-e9e6-dcc8-725664363b62@gmail.com> <115451235.nniJfEyVGO@rogueboard> In-Reply-To: <115451235.nniJfEyVGO@rogueboard> From: Rich Freeman Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2024 17:13:27 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Seagate hard drives with dual actuators. To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: 1f8699dd-6056-45ba-90fa-eeefad49a02d X-Archives-Hash: e736d68fd44e9cbe5ffe93e096e511c0 On Fri, Nov 15, 2024 at 10:35=E2=80=AFAM Michael = wrote: > > Host managed SMRs (HM-SMR) require the OS and FS to be aware of the need = for > sequential writes and manage submitted data sympathetically to this limit= ation > of the SMR drive, by queuing up random writes in batches and submitting t= hese > as a sequential stream. > > I understand the ext4-lazy option and some patches on btrfs have improved > performance of these filesystems on SMR drivers, but perhaps f2fs will pe= rform > better? :-/ IMO a host-managed solution is likely to be the only thing that will work reliably. If the drive supports discard/trim MAYBE a dumber drive might be able to be used with the right filesystem. Even if you're doing "write-once" workloads any kind of metadata change is going to cause random writes unless the filesystem was designed for SMR. Ideally you'd store metadata on a non-SMR device, though it isn't strictly necessary with a log-based approach. If the SMR drive tries really hard to not look like an SMR drive and doesn't support discard/trim then even an SMR-aware solution probably won't be able to use it effectively. The drive is going to keep doing read-before-write cycles to preserve data even if there is nothing useful to preserve. -- Rich