From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92E111381F3 for ; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:49:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 482E221C0CB; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:48:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-we0-f181.google.com (mail-we0-f181.google.com [74.125.82.181]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A00121C078 for ; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:47:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-we0-f181.google.com with SMTP id u54so2993176wey.40 for ; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 11:47:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=4OHAt6F8RjFzeY2kOtSUMUBjCa0q09VN2Z2PMcgA2E4=; b=qM8esVnId04+2Huven+TcLelnvT1ZXxwfQ5DWEQTbSkh6TWcYhI5OfyOev1C6o1pLP z88ZgKLvg9qOWO89zUVXM0TU/yUwnXaIaVM8cjwpbr9xklkqHZg2dsQPN4Q3EXuwhB+z VwRhL/Vhk9KhqLvv5EN7ama5TZxMtf40QgPvurCghLyZQ1T3YzX1u6hqpTcUkcBcDIsD AXsEzICMyZeius50Dl3QIE1tyqpYlun2Pl/khcUygH0C5va8D99l5zzKFmrP7sdksHWH IwaZPldxlRwBUI184Yqnv+5cZebaWsZHPsWsGG+FhoVc+5fupfui3SloD8Fzi+byGX5B YVMg== Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.180.76.203 with SMTP id m11mr16716750wiw.6.1352749644138; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 11:47:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.216.108.5 with HTTP; Mon, 12 Nov 2012 11:47:23 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20121112212819.2421d6e3@khamul.example.com> References: <20121112013321.64a4e1e0@khamul.example.com> <1402956.bjYysXIEXy@energy> <20121112212819.2421d6e3@khamul.example.com> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2012 13:47:23 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [ANNOUNCE] I like systemd now :) From: =?UTF-8?B?Q2FuZWsgUGVsw6FleiBWYWxkw6lz?= To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: e25fecb0-dd22-471e-9196-96025f884d3f X-Archives-Hash: 220525733ec1f5edb85ac75e6972c7dc On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 1:28 PM, Alan McKinnon wr= ote: > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 12:21:06 -0600 > Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s wrote: > >> On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 11:29 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann >> wrote: >> [snip] >> >> Seniority !=3D meritocracy. And I don't know how much "meritocratic" >> >> this list could be, since it is a users lists. The most "merit" a >> >> member of this list can get is to give technically acurate, >> >> constructive, and polite help for those users asking for it. >> >> >> > >> > in that case Alan certainly is at the very top. >> > >> > He is one of maybe three posters where I read every mail - and one >> > of a handful I have a hard time to disagree with. Same for Neil >> > Bothwick. Just to name two that rank very highly on my privat list >> > of good gentoo-user citizens. >> > >> > Because both know what they are talking about. Something that is >> > very rare. >> >> I'm not saying otherwise. I'm just saying that asking for "how long" >> someone has "been around" to determine his "place in the pecking >> order" it's laughable. >> >> Just for the record, and although I'm a systemd user and supporter, I >> don't agree with many of the things =E5=BE=AE=E8=94=A1 said, and I certa= inly don't >> agree with the way he said them. >> >> But still for Alan to ask for how long he has been on the list to >> undermine his point of view, I think is laughable at the best, and >> cheap at the worst. > > Now is the correct time to point out that you misinterpreted my post. I > didn't say so earlier for the simple reason that (in my world at least) > that always seems to pour gasoline on fires. > > The intent was for =E5=BE=AE=E8=94=A1 to respond then I could point out t= hat I felt > him coming in here brand new and making comments of "haters" and so on > was highly inappropriate and considered rude in almost all human > cultures. It is true that longevity doesn't buy much, but it is also > true that people in a group or community do have to establish at least > *some* street cred first. Sans that, we have little more than > mob-chaos. I don't agree with that. It's a technical list, so the technical arguments should be the only ones that matter, no matter who says them or (to a certain degree) how they say them. I didn't say anything about the members of the list responding to =E5=BE=AE= =E8=94=A1 on at least one technical ground; yours was the first message I saw that had not even a hint of a technical argument, but only a call for proof of seniority. I felt that needed to be called out, because (IMO) it serves no purpose and alienates users, specially new ones that feel that they don't belong to a non-existing club. Regards. --=20 Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingenier=C3=ADa de la Computaci=C3=B3n Universidad Nacional Aut=C3=B3noma de M=C3=A9xico