From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1R2351-0001q7-Nx for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 15:33:24 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4511321C130; Fri, 9 Sep 2011 15:32:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ww0-f53.google.com (mail-ww0-f53.google.com [74.125.82.53]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB4EC21C0A6 for ; Fri, 9 Sep 2011 15:29:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: by wwg14 with SMTP id 14so310390wwg.10 for ; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 08:29:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=8M7OTBBZ9/RPLw0ZM/eMPqLYBile3HF11nmRa/4p0oQ=; b=cavs9cjZlWKE4qWm6xljCWVEtsvZIE90T5sIuhP+fEYQbvhjx/f+Rw5czazrUjPlph ah/RvFP+LQz1bxjBj1Y1np84if8vzON0h/HL2kA22EofkmHaSZE4/8QHq1QN4n1D+gaz vZ/uxrqi494/vNhGimr2TpmwHEz6hK0n3DOU4= Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.14.234 with SMTP id d84mr150314wed.80.1315582187804; Fri, 09 Sep 2011 08:29:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.38.140 with HTTP; Fri, 9 Sep 2011 08:29:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4E698021.6000906@gmail.com> References: <201108191109.34984.michaelkintzios@gmail.com> <20110907050952.GA2588@linux1> <4E66FFFA.2020600@gmail.com> <201109071923.39954.Dan.Johansson@dmj.nu> <20110907235457.691be720@zaphod.digimed.co.uk> <20110908121151.018c38f3@rohan> <20110908222454.02488e58@rohan> <4E692DA0.9000306@gmail.com> <4E698021.6000906@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 11:29:47 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] /dev/sda* missing at boot From: =?UTF-8?B?Q2FuZWsgUGVsw6FleiBWYWxkw6lz?= To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 01aa90f508ce2b8e537cc62c5b1c1813 On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 10:55 PM, Dale wrote: > Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s wrote: >> >> On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 5:03 PM, Dale =C2=A0wrote: >>> >>> Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s wrote: >>>> >>>> I htink almost everyone understand this. Regards. >>> >>> I think you are one of *very* few that understands this. >>> >>> This reminds me of a old joke. =C2=A0One in four people have a mental i= ssue. >>> =C2=A0Check three friends and if they are OK, you are it. =C2=A0Again, = it is a joke >>> but my point is, very few people are liking this. =C2=A0That alone shou= ld say >>> a >>> lot. >> >> I know, but Open Source has never been a democracy. It is a >> meritocracy. No matter how many get upset by a change, the opinions >> that matter are from those writing the code. >> >>> =C2=A0This is a very few people forcing a change that no one wants. >> >> That's a contradiction, isn't it? The "few people" forcing the change >> want it, I hope. > > It's not. =C2=A0So far, one dev made the decision to do this and a few ha= ve > agreed. =C2=A0There are lots of people, as noted in this thread, that dis= agree. > =C2=A0Some of those people have been using Linux for a very long time. = =C2=A0I don't > know how long you have been using Linux but I'm pushing ten years myself.= =C2=A0I > suspect that Neil and Alan, and maybe others, have been using Linux a LOT > longer than that. =C2=A0Maybe more than both of us put together. =C2=A0Wh= en I see a > post by Alan or Neil, I read it carefully. =C2=A0There are Linux idiots i= n this > world but they are not one of them. =C2=A0On some subjects, I fall into t= he > ignorance category. =C2=A0I don't claim to know it all but some things I = do know > well. The "contradiction" part was a joke. A bad one, it seems. I started using Linux in 1996, when I started college (Computer Science, if you must know). I used RedHat, then Mandrake, then Gentoo, around 2003. After college I worked in several companies, doing mostly programming, but also a lot of system administration. I have worked with Solaris, HP-UX, SCO, and a tiny little bit of AIX, but the bulk of my curriculum is in Linux. In 2005 I got bored of being like Dilbert, and went back to school to get my masters in 2008 (Computer Science, again), and after getting back to work less than six months, I returned to Academia to get my PhD (Computer Science, what the hell), which I hope to get next year. That is not going to happen if instead of finishing writing my papers, I keep posting to threads in gentoo-user. I have some experience with Linux and Unix. I have followed the development of Linux, GNOME and everything in beetween in the stack like some people follow soap operas or football games. I think I kinda know what I'm talking about. But of course, I could be wrong in this issue. I just don't think so. I said my points and listened to very different and interesting ones. >From my POV (and I say this with all the respect possible), I see a lot of people afraid of change or too worried about their pet configurations, but not a really Earth-shattering technical strong point that makes me believe this change is "unnecessary", "irrational", or "lazy". It is incovenient? Sure, but in the long run I think it would make Linux better. This I haven't said, I think: I care about Linux, and basically Linux only. I want it to be on all my electronics, from my cell phone to my refrigerator and of course in my desktop. That is already happening, and the direction it is heading. But to do that, Linux cannot be a "classical Unix". It needs to be so much more. It needs to do thinks *DIFFERENTLY*. So, even if Linux will be always able to do anything any other Unix could do, it will do it in a fundamentally different way. So if you care for a Unix boxen that only does Unix-boxen things, in the classical, 1970-way, then probably Linux is not the best option for you. And for sure *I* don't want progress stopped only so Linux is able to do the things already does in the same way, with the only argument being "my script/setup/partition works now, why should I changed it?" Change happens. I appreciate the discussion, and I think it was enlightening and entertaining, but I will not participate anymore. I need to get my PhD one of this days. Regards. --=20 Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingenier=C3=ADa de la Computaci=C3=B3n Universidad Nacional Aut=C3=B3noma de M=C3=A9xico