From: "Canek Peláez Valdés" <caneko@gmail.com>
To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] /dev/sda* missing at boot
Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 12:45:47 -0400 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <CADPrc8047KkveLDc91Fq__mQA-=8kwghEpPYPr9byGd5JNGt=A@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4842477.AF29R6J79c@pc>
On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Michael Schreckenbauer <grimlog@gmx.de> wrote:
> Am Donnerstag, 8. September 2011, 16:58:22 schrieb Neil Bothwick:
>> On Thu, 8 Sep 2011 11:15:40 -0400, Michael Mol wrote:
>> > Perhaps udev's problem is that it's too complex, as a result of having
>> > too large a problem scope.
>
>> The problem, AIUI, is the udev can run any programs specified in the
>> rules files, and they may not be available before /usr is mounted.
>
> Funny thing is, devfs was removed, because of "unfixable race-conditions"
> (among other things iirc). What else is this then?
> An initramfs is not a proper fix for this design flaw, imo.
Then design the correct solution and implement it. If it's technically
sound, it will prevail. I think it's a rather complicated problem with
a non trivial solution, but the code is there if you feel like give it
a try.
devfs was replaced by udev primarily because devfs shoved a lot stuff
in the kernel (the rules to create the devide nods) that belongs in
users pace. And I agree: the rules to determine what devices nodes
gets created by what hardware (that nowadays hardware appears and
disappears almost randomly from the kernel point of view), belongs in
user space. And guess what? Then to boot you need a minimal user
space. And the fool-proof way to get one before mounting anything, is
to put it in an initramfs.
Embedded systems don't need that, and deal with it in a particular way
(device-trees and other stuff). Desktop and servers can use (and I
think should use) an initramfs (yes, servers too, especially with
eSATA and similar things). The kernel devs have been moving in that
direction for a long time.
I would not be surprised that the option to not have initramfs will be
removed from the kernel in the future, unless you select
CONFIG_EMBEDDED=y.
Regards.
--
Canek Peláez Valdés
Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2011-09-08 16:48 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 231+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2011-08-18 18:59 [gentoo-user] /dev/sda* missing at boot frares
2011-08-18 19:08 ` András Csányi
2011-08-19 12:42 ` [gentoo-user] " Nikos Chantziaras
2011-08-19 19:38 ` Francesco Talamona
2011-08-18 19:13 ` [gentoo-user] " Michael Mol
2011-08-19 5:33 ` Graham Murray
2011-08-19 1:44 ` Matthew Finkel
2011-08-19 2:27 ` Mark Knecht
2011-08-19 10:09 ` Mick
2011-08-19 13:12 ` frares
2011-08-19 13:41 ` Gregory Woodbury
2011-08-19 22:08 ` Dale
2011-08-20 7:04 ` Mick
2011-08-20 7:17 ` Dale
2011-08-20 8:29 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-08-20 8:48 ` Dale
2011-08-20 8:57 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-08-20 12:55 ` Mick
2011-09-06 23:06 ` Dale
2011-09-07 5:09 ` William Hubbs
2011-09-07 5:24 ` Dale
2011-09-07 17:23 ` Dan Johansson
2011-09-07 17:52 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-07 18:09 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-07 18:28 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-07 19:07 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-07 19:10 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-07 19:19 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-07 19:24 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-07 19:27 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-07 22:54 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-07 23:04 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-07 23:39 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-08 3:23 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 10:11 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 15:32 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:24 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 20:37 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 21:03 ` Dale
2011-09-08 22:55 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 2:55 ` Dale
2011-09-09 15:29 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 9:10 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-08 17:30 ` pk
2011-09-08 18:40 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 5:04 ` pk
2011-09-07 23:55 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-08 3:30 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 3:39 ` Dale
2011-09-08 14:51 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 15:15 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-08 15:40 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 15:58 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-08 16:11 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 16:45 ` Canek Peláez Valdés [this message]
2011-09-08 17:11 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 17:22 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:05 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 20:23 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:43 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 20:48 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 21:04 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 21:11 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 22:36 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 23:23 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 23:34 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 11:35 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 21:29 ` Alan Mackenzie
2011-09-08 21:44 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 22:06 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-09 8:06 ` [gentoo-user] " Nicolas Sebrecht
2011-09-09 10:03 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-12 8:40 ` Nicolas Sebrecht
2011-09-12 9:18 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-12 16:50 ` Dale
2011-09-08 22:31 ` [gentoo-user] " Alan Mackenzie
2011-09-08 23:05 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 21:04 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 20:40 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 20:56 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 21:06 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 21:38 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 22:28 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 23:01 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 17:35 ` pk
2011-09-08 17:47 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-08 18:11 ` pk
2011-09-08 19:01 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 19:40 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-09 9:39 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-08 18:41 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 5:18 ` pk
2011-09-08 7:59 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-08 15:08 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 7:37 ` [gentoo-user] " Alberto Luaces
2011-09-08 8:17 ` Alberto Luaces
2011-09-08 1:37 ` [gentoo-user] " David W Noon
2011-09-08 2:49 ` Dale
2011-09-08 3:33 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 8:09 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 15:13 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 16:06 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 16:34 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 17:01 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-08 17:18 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 17:45 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-08 19:00 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 19:37 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-08 20:03 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:57 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-09 8:11 ` Paul Colquhoun
2011-09-09 8:53 ` Dale
2011-09-09 9:15 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 1:25 ` Dale
2011-09-10 1:32 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-10 1:58 ` Dale
2011-09-10 7:30 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 7:54 ` Dale
2011-09-10 10:00 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 14:59 ` Dale
2011-09-10 15:52 ` Pandu Poluan
2011-09-10 16:34 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-10 21:15 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 21:28 ` Dale
2011-09-10 22:35 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-11 9:37 ` Peter Humphrey
2011-09-12 8:41 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-12 8:40 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-12 8:37 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-12 8:55 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-12 8:35 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-10 17:33 ` William Kenworthy
2011-09-10 18:12 ` William Kenworthy
2011-09-10 18:21 ` Dale
2011-09-12 7:12 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 12:14 ` Mike Edenfield
2011-09-12 12:28 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 14:47 ` Pandu Poluan
2011-09-12 15:29 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-12 15:44 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 16:56 ` Dale
2011-09-10 7:16 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 7:56 ` Dale
2011-09-12 7:17 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 7:49 ` Dale
2011-09-09 11:35 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-09 12:46 ` Mick
2011-09-09 16:44 ` pk
2011-09-09 17:04 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-09 17:09 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-10 1:10 ` Dale
2011-09-10 1:01 ` Dale
2011-09-10 10:56 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-10 15:52 ` Dale
2011-09-10 22:02 ` Keith Dart
2011-09-10 22:51 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-10 23:40 ` Keith Dart
2011-09-11 11:59 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-09 17:24 ` pk
2011-09-09 17:53 ` Michael Schreckenbauer
2011-09-10 1:15 ` Dale
2011-09-10 1:23 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-10 1:49 ` Dale
2011-09-10 7:17 ` pk
2011-09-10 7:36 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-10 10:24 ` Mick
2011-09-10 16:09 ` Dale
2011-09-10 16:19 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-10 16:36 ` Pandu Poluan
2011-09-10 16:50 ` Michael Mol
2011-09-10 16:47 ` Dale
2011-09-10 21:28 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-11 8:22 ` Mike Edenfield
2011-09-11 8:54 ` Pandu Poluan
2011-09-11 9:51 ` pk
2011-09-10 10:43 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-11 3:16 ` Paul Colquhoun
2011-09-11 7:29 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-11 12:26 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-11 18:56 ` Dale
2011-09-11 19:37 ` Mick
2011-09-11 21:07 ` Dale
2011-09-11 21:46 ` David W Noon
2011-09-11 22:08 ` Dale
2011-09-12 1:44 ` James Wall
2011-09-12 8:12 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 19:07 ` David W Noon
2011-09-12 7:45 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 8:32 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-12 8:49 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-12 9:07 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 9:13 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-12 9:34 ` Joost Roeleveld
2011-09-12 10:57 ` Neil Bothwick
2011-09-14 5:01 ` Walter Dnes
2011-09-08 19:48 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 20:21 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:38 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 20:46 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 21:25 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 16:44 ` David W Noon
2011-09-08 16:56 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 18:05 ` David W Noon
2011-09-08 19:13 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 20:25 ` David W Noon
2011-09-08 20:42 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 22:33 ` Mick
2011-09-08 22:39 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-08 23:00 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 23:26 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2011-09-09 6:22 ` Mick
2011-09-09 7:35 ` Dale
2011-09-08 22:51 ` David W Noon
2011-09-08 20:45 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-09-08 23:32 ` David W Noon
2011-09-09 11:41 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-09 12:44 ` Dale
2011-09-09 14:02 ` Alex Schuster
2011-09-10 1:20 ` Dale
2011-09-09 18:16 ` David W Noon
2011-09-09 19:57 ` Alex Schuster
2011-08-20 12:53 ` Gregory Woodbury
2011-08-20 12:59 ` David W Noon
2011-08-20 13:29 ` Mick
2011-08-20 13:58 ` Pandu Poluan
2011-08-20 15:32 ` David W Noon
2011-08-20 14:22 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-08-19 13:48 ` Alan McKinnon
2011-08-19 15:06 ` frares
2011-08-19 15:20 ` Alan McKinnon
-- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2011-08-18 19:17 frares
2011-08-18 19:26 ` frares
2011-08-18 19:42 ` Michael Mol
2011-08-18 23:29 ` Peter Humphrey
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