From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1S7Mil-0003YO-JD for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 08:04:39 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 74D16E09D6; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 08:04:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from svr-us4.tirtonadi.com (svr-us4.tirtonadi.com [69.65.43.212]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F1ECE0A65 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 08:03:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-vx0-f181.google.com ([209.85.220.181]) by svr-us4.tirtonadi.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1S7Mhe-004KWa-Tn for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 15:03:30 +0700 Received: by vcge1 with SMTP id e1so375458vcg.40 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 01:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.52.88.103 with SMTP id bf7mr16718575vdb.72.1331625807065; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 01:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.58.200 with HTTP; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 01:03:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.58.200 with HTTP; Tue, 13 Mar 2012 01:03:26 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <4F5AC0F6.6000804@gmail.com> <4F5B33CA.2020705@coolmail.se> <20120310153540.5194cd7c@digimed.co.uk> <4F5BBE7A.8040802@coolmail.se> <4F5C724C.1010708@coolmail.se> <292166434.606817.1331577566543.JavaMail.open-xchange@email.1and1.com> <4F5E853F.8060404@gmail.com> <017301cd00bd$24bce2f0$6e36a8d0$@kutulu.org> <20120313091356.5a947032@khamul.example.com> Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 15:03:26 +0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: LVM, /usr and really really bad thoughts. From: Pandu Poluan To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf307f3c043433d404bb1b4b24 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - svr-us4.tirtonadi.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - lists.gentoo.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - poluan.info X-Archives-Salt: c950a720-0296-4cb9-bc0f-c2e29c84ff26 X-Archives-Hash: b839acd23d960c787fded1eac1d10fc4 --20cf307f3c043433d404bb1b4b24 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mar 13, 2012 2:41 PM, "Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s" = wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:31 AM, Pandu Poluan wrote: > > > > On Mar 13, 2012 2:19 PM, "Alan McKinnon" wrote: > >> > >> On Tue, 13 Mar 2012 11:54:58 +0700 > >> Pandu Poluan wrote: > >> > >> > > The idea of trying to launch udevd and initialize devices without > >> > > the software, installed in /usr, which is required by those device= s > >> > > is a configuration that causes problems in many real-world, > >> > > practical situations. > >> > > > >> > > The requirement of having /usr on the same partition as / is also = a > >> > > configuration that causes problems in many real-world, practical > >> > > situations. > >> > > > >> > > >> > I quite often read about this, and after some thinking, I have to > >> > ask: why? > >> > > >> > >> I've also thought about this and I also want to ask why? > >> > >> I stopped using a separate /usr on my workstations a long time ago whe= n > >> I realized it was pointless. The days of 5M hard disks when the entire > >> OS didn't fit on one are long gone. The days of my software going tits > >> up at the drop of a hat requiring a minimal repair environment to fix > >> it at boot are also long gone (my desk is littered with LiveCDs and > >> bootable flash drives). > >> > >> So I can't find a single good reason why /usr *must* be separate and m= y > >> workstations are the only machines that will ever have hotplug booting > >> issues. > >> > >> I'm even considering changing the install standards for the company > >> servers to dispense with separate /usr, as long as there are safeguard= s > >> against clowns who don't read INSTALL files and happily > >> accept /usr/local//var as a storage area. > >> > > > > I just did some more thinking, and *maybe* the reason is to prevent > > something under /usr (src and share comes to mind) from growing too big and > > messes up the root filesystem. > > > > Place the offenders on a separate partition, then mount them under /usr, and > > all should be well... > > The always used example is to have /usr shared as a read only NFS > partition among several workstations. In corporate environments it is > certainly used this way (or at least it was when I worked, and the way > I used it in my office seven or eight years ago). > > Of course, for a normal desktop user, a separate /usr is basically useless. > Ah, thanks for the explanation. Makes sense. Rgds, --20cf307f3c043433d404bb1b4b24 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Mar 13, 2012 2:41 PM, "Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s" <caneko@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:31 AM, Pandu Poluan <pandu@poluan.info> wrote:
> >
> > On Mar 13, 2012 2:19 PM, "Alan McKinnon" <alan.mckinnon@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> On Tue, 13 Mar 2012 11:54:58 +0700
> >> Pandu Poluan <pandu@p= oluan.info> wrote:
> >>
> >> > > The idea of trying to launch udevd and initialize d= evices without
> >> > > the software, installed in /usr, which is required = by those devices
> >> > > is a configuration that causes problems in many rea= l-world,
> >> > > practical situations.
> >> > >
> >> > > The requirement of having /usr on the same partitio= n as / is also a
> >> > > configuration that causes problems in many real-wor= ld, practical
> >> > > situations.
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> > I quite often read about this, and after some thinking, = I have to
> >> > ask: why?
> >> >
> >>
> >> I've also thought about this and I also want to ask why?<= br> > >>
> >> I stopped using a separate /usr on my workstations a long tim= e ago when
> >> I realized it was pointless. The days of 5M hard disks when t= he entire
> >> OS didn't fit on one are long gone. The days of my softwa= re going tits
> >> up at the drop of a hat requiring a minimal repair environmen= t to fix
> >> it at boot are also long gone (my desk is littered with LiveC= Ds and
> >> bootable flash drives).
> >>
> >> So I can't find a single good reason why /usr *must* be s= eparate and my
> >> workstations are the only machines that will ever have hotplu= g booting
> >> issues.
> >>
> >> I'm even considering changing the install standards for t= he company
> >> servers to dispense with separate /usr, as long as there are = safeguards
> >> against clowns who don't read INSTALL files and happily > >> accept /usr/local/<package>/var as a storage area.
> >>
> >
> > I just did some more thinking, and *maybe* the reason is to preve= nt
> > something under /usr (src and share comes to mind) from growing t= oo big and
> > messes up the root filesystem.
> >
> > Place the offenders on a separate partition, then mount them unde= r /usr, and
> > all should be well...
>
> The always used example is to have /usr shared as a read only NFS
> partition among several workstations. In corporate environments it is<= br> > certainly used this way (or at least it was when I worked, and the way=
> I used it in my office seven or eight years ago).
>
> Of course, for a normal desktop user, a separate /usr is basically use= less.
>

Ah, thanks for the explanation. Makes sense.

Rgds,

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