Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Indi]

On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 03:10:02AM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> Yesterday I attempted my first Gentoo install (11.0). Thanks to help here, I 
> got through my mirrorselect problem. First boot failed. I managed to miss 
> enabling VIA ATA support, so had no access to /. Second kernel build 
> suceeded, even to basic network working. First activity on first boot was 
> 'emerge mc'. That took too long to measure, pulling in 146 packages total, 
> and I had to goto an appointment before it finished (at package 109).
> 
> Along the way to successful boot, I attempted two emerges suggested by the 
> handbook (one being Grub Legacy). Both produced "ERROR: ... (compile 
> phase)..." errors. Today I attempted NFS mounting only to find messages 
> indicating I had neither portmap nor rpcbind running, so tried 'emerge 
> portmap'. This produced similar (compile phase)... line 2140: Called die..." 
> error. So did 'emerge rpcbind'. The way I normally provide logs when asking 
> for help is put them on my file/web server via NFS, hence the chicken & egg 
> subject line.
>

Maybe a stupid question, but have you tried run emerge --sync and emerge
-vauND world yet since installing? 

> Another problem, highly annoying, is both vga= and video= cmdline parameters 
> are apparently being ignored. KMS seems married to the Trinitron's 
> PreferredMode (1600x1200), which produces mousetype on the ttys, and needs to 
> be fixed before I'll be able to accomplish much without pain trying to see 
> what I'm doing. My tty PreferredMode is 1152x864, which works with openSUSE 
> KMS kernels by setting video=1152x864 on cmdline.
> 
> Any suggestions? Are such things in a FAQ somewhere? Do I need an older or 
> newer portage than Wednesday's? The Handbook stops at Finalizing, where these 
> questions aren't covered.

Do you have your video card specified in make.conf?
Should be somthing like:

VIDEO_CARDS="radeon"

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Alex Schuster]

Indi writes:

> On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 03:10:02AM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:

>> Along the way to successful boot, I attempted two emerges suggested by the 
>> handbook (one being Grub Legacy). Both produced "ERROR: ... (compile 
>> phase)..." errors. 

If you like, post the messages here. Be sure to include enough of the
log, from the first error message on.

>> Today I attempted NFS mounting only to find messages 
>> indicating I had neither portmap nor rpcbind running, so tried 'emerge 
>> portmap'. This produced similar (compile phase)... line 2140: Called die..." 
>> error. So did 'emerge rpcbind'. The way I normally provide logs when asking 
>> for help is put them on my file/web server via NFS, hence the chicken & egg 
>> subject line.

Have you emerged nfs-utils? Is /etc/init.d/nfs running? This should take
care of everything I think.

> Maybe a stupid question, but have you tried run emerge --sync and emerge
> -vauND world yet since installing? 
> 
>> Another problem, highly annoying, is both vga= and video= cmdline parameters 
>> are apparently being ignored. KMS seems married to the Trinitron's 
>> PreferredMode (1600x1200), which produces mousetype on the ttys, and needs to 
>> be fixed before I'll be able to accomplish much without pain trying to see 
>> what I'm doing. My tty PreferredMode is 1152x864, which works with openSUSE 
>> KMS kernels by setting video=1152x864 on cmdline.

I just switched to KMS mode, and was happy that without doing anything I
had the natural resolution of my display. Don't know how to change this
though. Does kernel command line parameter "vga=ask" still work maybe?

>> Any suggestions? Are such things in a FAQ somewhere? Do I need an older or 
>> newer portage than Wednesday's? The Handbook stops at Finalizing, where these 
>> questions aren't covered.

There are several more howtos on gentoo.org, but I don't know if NFS and
console display are covered.

> Do you have your video card specified in make.conf?
> Should be somthing like:
> 
> VIDEO_CARDS="radeon"

I think that's for X-related stuff only.

	Wonko

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/14 05:19 (GMT+0200) Alex Schuster composed:

> Indi writes:

>>  Felix Miata wrote:

>>>  Along the way to successful boot, I attempted two emerges suggested by the
>>>  handbook (one being Grub Legacy). Both produced "ERROR: ... (compile
>>>  phase)..." errors.

> If you like, post the messages here. Be sure to include enough of the
> log, from the first error message on.

Still the same problem, needing to get the log off the system onto the server 
or into an email without working NFS or rebooting to something with working NFS.

So, I've booted into SUSE. Logs for 6 failed emerges are in 
http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/

I'm chrooted into Gentoo for now to try and fix whatever's broken, and get to 
use legible tty fonts that way in the mean time, e.g. while rebuilding kernel 
with proper tty video selections, and ext4 instead of ext3.

> Have you emerged nfs-utils? Is /etc/init.d/nfs running? This should take
> care of everything I think.

# emerge nfs-utils

produces errors for dev-libs/libevent-2.0.10 twice.

>>  Maybe a stupid question, but have you tried run emerge --sync and emerge
>>  -vauND world yet since installing?

>>>  Another problem, highly annoying, is both vga= and video= cmdline parameters
>>>  are apparently being ignored. KMS seems married to the Trinitron's
>>>  PreferredMode (1600x1200), which produces mousetype on the ttys, and needs to
>>>  be fixed before I'll be able to accomplish much without pain trying to see
>>>  what I'm doing. My tty PreferredMode is 1152x864, which works with openSUSE
>>>  KMS kernels by setting video=1152x864 on cmdline.

Never solved the above in Fedora either. It's the same problem here. 
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=701190

> I just switched to KMS mode, and was happy that without doing anything I
> had the natural resolution of my display. Don't know how to change this

Natural resolution is fine in X, because I can force DPI and tweak fonts 
easily. In ttys the only way that ever worked easily was via vga=, which 
doesn't work with KMS.

> though. Does kernel command line parameter "vga=ask" still work maybe?

It does produce a modes list as before, but whatever is selected is ignored 
unless using a video chip that lacks KMS support, like mga or r128.

> There are several more howtos on gentoo.org, but I don't know if NFS and
> console display are covered.

I'll look while the kernel is recompiling.

>>  VIDEO_CARDS="radeon"

> I think that's for X-related stuff only.

Related question: Is there any way to get BIOS setting for NUMLOCK state to 
be obeyed? emerge can't find a setleds or numlock package except as relates 
to X. Both Mandriva & openSUSE obey BIOS NUM state automatically.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/13 22:35 (GMT-0400) Indi composed:

> Maybe a stupid question, but have you tried run emerge --sync

.bash_history tells me I did this twice prior to your response...

> and emerge -vauND world yet since installing?

...but not this. Doing so now produces something that is not obvious to me 
how to respond to:

<begin screen output>
These are the packages that would be merged, in order:

Calculating dependencies... done!

emerge: there are no ebuilds built with USE flags to satisfy 
">=media-libs/libcanberra-0.4[gtk]".
!!! One of the following packages is required to complete your request:
- media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 (Change USE: +gtk)
(dependency required by "x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "virtual/notification-daemon-0[gnome]" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "x11-libs/libnotify-0.7.2" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "media-video/vlc-1.1.9[libnotify]" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-vlc-0.3.2" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-4.5.0[vlc]" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "kde-base/kdelibs-4.6.2-r3" [ebuild])
(dependency required by "kde-misc/polkit-kde-kcmodules-0.98_pre20101127" 
[ebuild])
<end screen output>

Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can emerging 
one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's unclear to me what 
"One of the following packages" actually refers to.

>Do you have your video card specified in make.conf?
>Should be somthing like:

> VIDEO_CARDS="radeon"

I hadn't seen anything about VIDEO_CARDS until your response. Most of my 
systems are mga, intel or radeon, but this particular one is NV. Finding the 
answer to which of three possibles are the correct response led me to 
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/xorg-config.xml which I hadn't seen before. Now 
that I have I think I need to recompile due to misconfiguring of Graphics 
support.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 05:28 on Saturday 14 May 2011, Felix Miata did 
opine thusly:

> On 2011/05/13 22:35 (GMT-0400) Indi composed:
> > Maybe a stupid question, but have you tried run emerge --sync
> 
> .bash_history tells me I did this twice prior to your response...
> 
> > and emerge -vauND world yet since installing?
> 
> ...but not this. Doing so now produces something that is not obvious to me
> how to respond to:
> 
> <begin screen output>
> These are the packages that would be merged, in order:
> 
> Calculating dependencies... done!
> 
> emerge: there are no ebuilds built with USE flags to satisfy
> ">=media-libs/libcanberra-0.4[gtk]".
> !!! One of the following packages is required to complete your request:
> - media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 (Change USE: +gtk)
> (dependency required by "x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "virtual/notification-daemon-0[gnome]" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "x11-libs/libnotify-0.7.2" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "media-video/vlc-1.1.9[libnotify]" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-vlc-0.3.2" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-4.5.0[vlc]" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "kde-base/kdelibs-4.6.2-r3" [ebuild])
> (dependency required by "kde-misc/polkit-kde-kcmodules-0.98_pre20101127"
> [ebuild])
> <end screen output>
> 
> Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can emerging
> one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's unclear to me
> what "One of the following packages" actually refers to.

It's telling you that you must enable USE=gtk for libcanberra for that build 
to succeed. The chain of packages listed won't solve the problem, they are 
causing it.

Easiest is to list gtk in USE in make.conf, then everything that uses gtk will 
link against it. If you are worried about Gnome, this wil not cause gnome to 
be installed, just gtk+


-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/14 08:25 (GMT+0200) Alan McKinnon composed:

> Felix Miata composed:

>>  emerge: there are no ebuilds built with USE flags to satisfy
>>  ">=media-libs/libcanberra-0.4[gtk]".
>>  !!! One of the following packages is required to complete your request:
>>  - media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 (Change USE: +gtk)
>>  (dependency required by "x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "virtual/notification-daemon-0[gnome]" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "x11-libs/libnotify-0.7.2" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "media-video/vlc-1.1.9[libnotify]" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-vlc-0.3.2" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-4.5.0[vlc]" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "kde-base/kdelibs-4.6.2-r3" [ebuild])
>>  (dependency required by "kde-misc/polkit-kde-kcmodules-0.98_pre20101127"
>>  [ebuild])
>>  <end screen output>

>>  Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can emerging
>>  one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's unclear to me
>>  what "One of the following packages" actually refers to.

> It's telling you that you must enable USE=gtk for libcanberra for that build
> to succeed. The chain of packages listed won't solve the problem, they are
> causing it.

That's what I was afraid of, a "list" of one followed by a genuine list. :-(

> Easiest is to list gtk in USE in make.conf, then everything that uses gtk will
> link against it. If you are worried about Gnome, this wil not cause gnome to
> be installed, just gtk+

Maybe someone can humor me and not go with the "easiest" route. Let's assume 
I could live without any Mozilla products or Gimp, and want a system free not 
just of Gnome but also of GTK. Let's say I'm deaf, and no speakers will ever 
be attached to the system, which has an onboard sound chip rather than a PCI 
sound card I could simply remove. What would it take to eliminate this 
apparent KDE dependence on GTK (and sound support)? How "portable" is a sound 
event library that makes KDE depend on GTK? For now, I've cut USE down to 
only "bash-completion ncurses samba slang xattr", but it hasn't helped me to 
get everything I need to work outside of X. Until I have working NFS and NUM 
state obeying the BIOS, I have little interest in what's required to make X 
functional, and no interest in audible notifications.

BTW, my 3rd kernel did solve my video on ttys problem, and get me access to 
my EXT2 partition. :-)
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 11:38 on Saturday 14 May 2011, Felix Miata did 
opine thusly:

> On 2011/05/14 08:25 (GMT+0200) Alan McKinnon composed:
> > Felix Miata composed:
> >>  emerge: there are no ebuilds built with USE flags to satisfy
> >>  ">=media-libs/libcanberra-0.4[gtk]".
> >>  !!! One of the following packages is required to complete your request:
> >>  - media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 (Change USE: +gtk)
> >>  (dependency required by "x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by "virtual/notification-daemon-0[gnome]"
> >>  [ebuild]) (dependency required by "x11-libs/libnotify-0.7.2" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by "media-video/vlc-1.1.9[libnotify]" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-vlc-0.3.2" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-4.5.0[vlc]" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by "kde-base/kdelibs-4.6.2-r3" [ebuild])
> >>  (dependency required by
> >>  "kde-misc/polkit-kde-kcmodules-0.98_pre20101127" [ebuild])
> >>  <end screen output>
> >>  
> >>  Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can
> >>  emerging one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's
> >>  unclear to me what "One of the following packages" actually refers to.
> > 
> > It's telling you that you must enable USE=gtk for libcanberra for that
> > build to succeed. The chain of packages listed won't solve the problem,
> > they are causing it.
> 
> That's what I was afraid of, a "list" of one followed by a genuine list.
> :-(

What's hard about it?

You have a failed dependency. The next logical question to ask is "what is the 
dependency? What other package requires this package?"

The only way to answer that is to list them all recursively, all the way back 
to the root of the tree. 

In this case you need libcanberra built with USE=gtk
That depends on x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0
Pulled in by virtual/notification-daemon-0 built with USE=gnome

and so on and so on. It's a simple graph actually.

> 
> > Easiest is to list gtk in USE in make.conf, then everything that uses gtk
> > will link against it. If you are worried about Gnome, this wil not cause
> > gnome to be installed, just gtk+
> 
> Maybe someone can humor me and not go with the "easiest" route. Let's
> assume I could live without any Mozilla products or Gimp, and want a
> system free not just of Gnome but also of GTK. Let's say I'm deaf, and no
> speakers will ever be attached to the system, which has an onboard sound
> chip rather than a PCI sound card I could simply remove. What would it
> take to eliminate this apparent KDE dependence on GTK (and sound support)?
> How "portable" is a sound event library that makes KDE depend on GTK? For
> now, I've cut USE down to only "bash-completion ncurses samba slang
> xattr", but it hasn't helped me to get everything I need to work outside
> of X. Until I have working NFS and NUM state obeying the BIOS, I have
> little interest in what's required to make X functional, and no interest
> in audible notifications.

First of all, I don't know what you want. Only you know what you want.

KDE does not depend on GTK here. Reading the above list from the bottom up:

You want KDE, so you get kdelibs. That gives you phonon with vlc support. vlc 
(not a KDE package) is configured to use libnotify, which is a gnome package 
and needs notification-daemon. THAT requires gtk.


Lets back up a bit. With something like Ubuntu, someone (the package 
maintainer) went through a insanely gigantic amount of ball-ache to figure out 
the dependencies and switch stuff on and off so that you never have to deal 
with this. The downside is that you get whatever the maintainer felt you 
should have.

gentoo is different - you are in complete control. This means that you have to 
go through the insanely gigantic ball-ache work yourself. The ebuilds help 
somewhat with USE flags, so with "USE=-gnome -gtk" you could disable all 
optional gnome and gtk dependencies. Sometimes you get a hard dependency that 
isn't optional, in that case you are SOL and must make a decision whether to 
have gnome or not. Either way, you get to choose, and you also get to have to 
think long and hard first.

Back to your list.

The little fucker that is causing your issue is vlc support and libnotify.

Do you want these? Define what you want exactly, and enable or disable USE 
flags to suit your choices.

Do keep in mind that I can't tell you what to do because you haven't really 
defined what you want yet. I could tell you to add 
"-gnome -gtk -vlc -libnotify" 
to USE in /etc/make.conf and that would certainly obliterate gnome for sure. 
But it might also be overreaching.






> 
> BTW, my 3rd kernel did solve my video on ttys problem, and get me access to
> my EXT2 partition. :-)

-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Mick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: Text/Plain, Size: 3141 bytes --]

On Saturday 14 May 2011 11:21:51 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> Apparently, though unproven, at 11:38 on Saturday 14 May 2011, Felix Miata
> did
> 
> opine thusly:
> > On 2011/05/14 08:25 (GMT+0200) Alan McKinnon composed:
> > > Felix Miata composed:
 
> > >>  Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can
> > >>  emerging one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's
> > >>  unclear to me what "One of the following packages" actually refers
> > >>  to.
> > > 
> > > It's telling you that you must enable USE=gtk for libcanberra for that
> > > build to succeed. The chain of packages listed won't solve the problem,
> > > they are causing it.
[snip... wise advice from Alan ...]

> Do keep in mind that I can't tell you what to do because you haven't really
> defined what you want yet. I could tell you to add
> "-gnome -gtk -vlc -libnotify"
> to USE in /etc/make.conf and that would certainly obliterate gnome for
> sure. But it might also be overreaching.

If you want libcanberra and therefore you must have USE="gtk", but you do not 
want to have any other packages compiled with the gtk USE flag, you can define 
it only for the package in question by adding a line in 
/etc/portage/package.use like so:

media-libs/libcanberra gtk -oss

to e.g. enable the gtk and disable the oss flags.

To see whether a flag has been set or not and relevant information about it, 
run:

euse -i <flag>

For libcanberra it shows:

[- cD ] gtk (media-libs/libcanberra):
Enables building of gtk+ helper library, gtk+ runtime sound effects and the 
canberra-gtk-play utility. To enable the gtk+ sound effects add canberra-gtk-
module to the colon separated list of modules in the GTK_MODULES environment 
variable.

Use option -I to see which packages have been installed using a particular 
flag.  Have a look in man euse to decipher the symbols.


To see all the flags for a particular package after it has been installed run:

equery uses libcanberra
[ Searching for packages matching libcanberra... ]
[ Colour Code : set unset ]
[ Legend : Left column  (U) - USE flags from make.conf              ]
[        : Right column (I) - USE flags packages was installed with ]
[ Found these USE variables for media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 ]
 U I
 + + alsa       : Adds support for media-libs/alsa-lib (Advanced Linux Sound 
Architecture)
 - - gstreamer  : Adds support for media-libs/gstreamer (Streaming media)
 + + gtk        : Adds support for x11-libs/gtk+ (The GIMP Toolkit)
 - - oss        : Adds support for OSS (Open Sound System)
 - - pulseaudio : Adds support for PulseAudio sound server
 - + sound      : Enable sound support
 - - tdb        : Enables Trivial Database support for caching purposes.


You can also check flags and (r)dependencies on line:

http://gentoo-portage.com/Browse


> > BTW, my 3rd kernel did solve my video on ttys problem, and get me access
> > to my EXT2 partition. :-)

Have you read and applied http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/xorg-config.xml to find 
out how to configure your card and xorg?
-- 
Regards,
Mick

[-- Attachment #2: This is a digitally signed message part. --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/14 12:52 (GMT+0100) Mick composed:

>>  >  BTW, my 3rd kernel did solve my video on ttys problem, and get me access
>>  >  to my EXT2 partition. :-)

> Have you read and applied http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/xorg-config.xml to find
> out how to configure your card and xorg?

Reading section 2.2 there is how I realized what it was that I had 
misconfigured previously to cause my video on ttys problem. ;-)

My #1 problem to solve is NFS not working yet (nfs-utils aka libevent, 
portmap, rpc emerge failures), but it would also be very nice to get Grub to 
emerge. Logs: http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

[gentoo-user] Re: chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[walt]

On 05/14/2011 06:20 AM, Felix Miata wrote:

> My #1 problem to solve is NFS not working yet (nfs-utils aka
> libevent, portmap, rpc emerge failures), but it would also be very
> nice to get Grub to emerge. Logs: http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/

Looking at the config for libevent, the script can't find ccache.
Do you have dev-util/ccache installed?  Did you enable the 'ccache'
FEATURE in /etc/make.conf?

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/14 09:20 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed:

> My #1 problem to solve is NFS not working yet (nfs-utils aka libevent,
> portmap, rpc emerge failures), but it would also be very nice to get Grub to
> emerge. Logs: http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/

Now as noted in the econf failed thread I've succeeded in emerging nfs-utils 
and grub, but neither work right.

I have two Gentoo stanzas in my primary bootloader, one to load the kernel, 
another to chainload Gentoo's Grub. Loading the kernel works, but chainload 
gives error 13 invalid executable format. I named the bzImage copied to /boot 
"kernel-2.6.37-r4f", and symlinked it a vmlinuz. vmlinuz is the name I use in 
the Grub stanzas. Is Gentoo's Grub expecting the kernel to have a particular 
name, and I picked a wrong one? Or maybe what it doesn't like is that I 
uncommented splashimage=(hd0,6)/boot/grub/splash.xpm.gz in menu.lst?

The errors from NFS are different than I originally encountered, and indicate 
that neither portmap nor rpcbind are running. Which of the two did nfs-utils 
actually install (or both?), and what exactly is its name I need to use with 
rc-update or start one or the other manually to get my server's exports 
mounted locally?
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (part solved)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/15 22:18 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed:

> The errors from NFS are different than I originally encountered, and indicate
> that neither portmap nor rpcbind are running. Which of the two did nfs-utils
> actually install (or both?), and what exactly is its name I need to use with
> rc-update or start one or the other manually to get my server's exports
> mounted locally?

This one is solved. I looked in /etc/init.d/ and saw rpcbind, got it working 
manually, then set it automatic on boot with 'rc-update add rpcbind default'. :-)
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/15 22:18 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed:

> I have two Gentoo stanzas in my primary bootloader, one to load the kernel,
> another to chainload Gentoo's Grub. Loading the kernel works, but chainload
> gives error 13 invalid executable format. I named the bzImage copied to /boot
> "kernel-2.6.37-r4f", and symlinked it a vmlinuz. vmlinuz is the name I use in
> the Grub stanzas. Is Gentoo's Grub expecting the kernel to have a particular
> name, and I picked a wrong one? Or maybe what it doesn't like is that I
> uncommented splashimage=(hd0,6)/boot/grub/splash.xpm.gz in menu.lst?

I got this to work too:

# grub
grub> find /boot/grub/stage1
grub> root (hd0,6)
grub> setup (hd0,6)
grub> quit
#

Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it didn't 
actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up. If so, it could be 
there was already some mismatched Grub code there already from a previous use 
of the sectors there that didn't like the file format.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 404 bytes --]

On Sun, 15 May 2011 22:54:14 -0400, Felix Miata wrote:

> Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it
> didn't actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up.

Emerging GRUB installs it, that's all. The post installation message
would have told you to set i up, but it's up to you to do the work.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

I'm not closed minded, you're just wrong.

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Tanstaafl]

On 2011-05-15 10:54 PM, Felix Miata wrote:
> Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it
> didn't actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up. If so, it
> could be there was already some mismatched Grub code there already from
> a previous use of the sectors there that didn't like the file format.

Felix - you need to start reading the post-install messages when
emerging things.

With Gentoo, a lot of times, you have to actually do things manually
after installing something - as you found with GRUB.

Most people set things up so they get emails of the post install
messages when emerging things, but it is up to you to actually read them
and, when necessary, follow the instructions.

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[JDM]

That's a clever trick. How do you get emails from emerge? 
JDM

-----Original Message-----
From: Tanstaafl <tanstaafl@libertytrek.org>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 07:58:34 
To: <gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org>
Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

On 2011-05-15 10:54 PM, Felix Miata wrote:
> Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it
> didn't actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up. If so, it
> could be there was already some mismatched Grub code there already from
> a previous use of the sectors there that didn't like the file format.

Felix - you need to start reading the post-install messages when
emerging things.

With Gentoo, a lot of times, you have to actually do things manually
after installing something - as you found with GRUB.

Most people set things up so they get emails of the post install
messages when emerging things, but it is up to you to actually read them
and, when necessary, follow the instructions.

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 241 bytes --]

On Mon, 16 May 2011 12:43:05 +0000, JDM wrote:

> That's a clever trick. How do you get emails from emerge? 

Read the settings for PORTAGE_ELOG in man make.conf.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

WinErr 001: Windows loaded - System in danger

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Stroller]

On 16/5/2011, at 1:43pm, JDM wrote:
>> Most people set things up so they get emails of the post install
>> messages when emerging things, but it is up to you to actually read them
>> and, when necessary, follow the instructions.
> That's a clever trick. How do you get emails from emerge? 

$ grep -i mail /etc/make.conf 
PORTAGE_ELOG_SYSTEM="save mail"
PORTAGE_ELOG_MAILURI="root"
PORTAGE_ELOG_MAILFROM="portage@hex"
$

(I follow the guiding principal that root and postmaster should always be correctly aliased, and that mail to them should be delivered correctly to another named user, my own).

Stroller.

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Willie Wong]

On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 05:38:04AM -0400, Felix Miata wrote:
> >Felix Miata composed:
> 
> >> emerge: there are no ebuilds built with USE flags to satisfy
> >> ">=media-libs/libcanberra-0.4[gtk]".
> >> !!! One of the following packages is required to complete your request:
> >> - media-libs/libcanberra-0.26 (Change USE: +gtk)
> >> (dependency required by "x11-misc/notification-daemon-0.5.0" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "virtual/notification-daemon-0[gnome]" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "x11-libs/libnotify-0.7.2" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "media-video/vlc-1.1.9[libnotify]" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-vlc-0.3.2" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "media-libs/phonon-4.5.0[vlc]" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "kde-base/kdelibs-4.6.2-r3" [ebuild])
> >> (dependency required by "kde-misc/polkit-kde-kcmodules-0.98_pre20101127"
> >> [ebuild])
> >> <end screen output>
> 
> >> Is it telling me I have to change my USE from -gtk to +gtk, or can emerging
> >> one of those 8 packages listed satisfy the dep? IOW, it's unclear to me
> >> what "One of the following packages" actually refers to.
> 
> >It's telling you that you must enable USE=gtk for libcanberra for that build
> >to succeed. The chain of packages listed won't solve the problem, they are
> >causing it.
> 
> That's what I was afraid of, a "list" of one followed by a genuine list. :-(
> 
> >Easiest is to list gtk in USE in make.conf, then everything that uses gtk will
> >link against it. If you are worried about Gnome, this wil not cause gnome to
> >be installed, just gtk+
> 
> Maybe someone can humor me and not go with the "easiest" route.
> Let's assume I could live without any Mozilla products or Gimp, and
> want a system free not just of Gnome but also of GTK. Let's say I'm
> deaf, and no speakers will ever be attached to the system, which has
> an onboard sound chip rather than a PCI sound card I could simply
> remove. What would it take to eliminate this apparent KDE dependence
> on GTK (and sound support)? How "portable" is a sound event library
> that makes KDE depend on GTK? For now, I've cut USE down to only
> "bash-completion ncurses samba slang xattr", but it hasn't helped me
> to get everything I need to work outside of X. 

The above listing shows that phonon will be built with the "vlc" use
flag, so clearly you haven't trimmed USE down to "just"
bash-completion, ncurses, samba, slang, xattr. In fact, if you had
done so you would've also trimmed out cxx, posix, and threads, which
would probably not be the best idea. 

So for concreteness, can you post the complete USE list, _not_ the
list in /etc/make.conf, since that does not show you the USE enabled
*by default* on whichever profile you have chosen to use. To get the
list of all USE flags, try 
  emerge --info

In this particular case, you can consider adding "-vlc" to your USE
and try again. 

W
-- 
Willie W. Wong                                     wwong@math.princeton.edu
Data aequatione quotcunque fluentes quantitae involvente fluxiones invenire 
         et vice versa   ~~~  I. Newton

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/14 10:06 (GMT-0400) Willie Wong composed:

> The above listing shows that phonon will be built with the "vlc" use
> flag, so clearly you haven't trimmed USE down to "just"
> bash-completion, ncurses, samba, slang, xattr. In fact, if you had
> done so you would've also trimmed out cxx, posix, and threads, which
> would probably not be the best idea.

The timestamp on my make.conf(.07) file on display at 
http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/ shows a last written considerably earlier 
than I last wrote, but ...

> So for concreteness, can you post the complete USE list, _not_ the
> list in /etc/make.conf, since that does not show you the USE enabled
> *by default* on whichever profile you have chosen to use. To get the

Of this I was totally unaware. So now I know I probably should not have 
selected the kde profile on first try, but instead selected a minimal and 
only after being happy with the basics changing to kde.

Does [1] default/linux/x86/10.0 from 'eselect profile list' amount to a 
"minimal" install (no X)? If so, is there any reason not to switch to it 
instead of setting -vlc, and then later when actually ready to enable X, 
switching back to kde?

What is the [7] hardened/linux/x86 profile, or better yet, the incantation to 
get descriptions descriptions of all the available targets?

> list of all USE flags, try
>    emerge --info

About 1.6 screens full, including what looks like a bazillion things in USE=. 
It looks like USE= ends with zlib, and then until the appearance of Unset:, 
everything in between is appended without any newlines, among them, 
PHP_TARGETS, GPSD_PROTOCOLS & APACHE2. Yikes! 
http://fm.no-ip.com/Tmp/Linux/G/emergeinfo1.txt

> In this particular case, you can consider adding "-vlc" to your USE
> and try again.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Willie Wong]

On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 11:07:33AM -0400, Felix Miata wrote:
> Does [1] default/linux/x86/10.0 from 'eselect profile list' amount
> to a "minimal" install (no X)? If so, is there any reason not to
> switch to it instead of setting -vlc, and then later when actually
> ready to enable X, switching back to kde?

There's no big harm, except that you may end up rebuilding a bunch of
packages. One way to get a lot of hands-on control on precisely what
USE you want it via the "-*" flag. But be VERY careful if you are
going to use it. A USE variable set in /etc/make.conf starting with it

  USE="-* X vim ..."

will use nothing but those variables (plus the package specific ones
specified in /etc/portage). There are certain flags that you most
likely don't want to turn off: cxx, posix, and threads for example. 

It is a powerful tool; which means you can also seriously hurt
yourself from it. 

Note that the profiles are not "only if" things. You can still run
the KDE desktop without being on the KDE profile. You should think of
the profile as a default bundle that the developers think you may like
if you want to use KDE. You can of course completely customise it just
from the default/linux/x86/10.0 profile. So if you start your system
on this profile, and build it up to your liking, there's no need to
switch over to the KDE profile. 

> 
> What is the [7] hardened/linux/x86 profile, or better yet, the
> incantation to get descriptions descriptions of all the available
> targets?

hardened is maintained by the gentoo hardened project
  http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/hardened/

If this is a desktop you probably don't want to use it. And SELinux
you can just google to find out. 

W

-- 
Willie W. Wong                                     wwong@math.princeton.edu
Data aequatione quotcunque fluentes quantitae involvente fluxiones invenire 
         et vice versa   ~~~  I. Newton

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[William Hubbs]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1097 bytes --]

On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 11:36:29AM -0400, Willie Wong wrote:
> There's no big harm, except that you may end up rebuilding a bunch of
> packages. One way to get a lot of hands-on control on precisely what
> USE you want it via the "-*" flag. But be VERY careful if you are
> going to use it. A USE variable set in /etc/make.conf starting with it
> 
>   USE="-* X vim ..."
> 
> will use nothing but those variables (plus the package specific ones
> specified in /etc/portage). There are certain flags that you most
> likely don't want to turn off: cxx, posix, and threads for example. 
> 
> It is a powerful tool; which means you can also seriously hurt
> yourself from it. 

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS.

It turns off all use flags set in profiles as well as use flag defaults
set in ebuilds.

The safer way, and the way I would recommend, is to use something like
euse from gentoolkit to figure out which flags are on and turn off the
ones you do not want in make.conf instead of turning off everything and
trying to turn back on the ones you do want.

William


[-- Attachment #2: Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 23:21 on Saturday 14 May 2011, William Hubbs 
did opine thusly:

> On Sat, May 14, 2011 at 11:36:29AM -0400, Willie Wong wrote:
> > There's no big harm, except that you may end up rebuilding a bunch of
> > packages. One way to get a lot of hands-on control on precisely what
> > USE you want it via the "-*" flag. But be VERY careful if you are
> > going to use it. A USE variable set in /etc/make.conf starting with it
> > 
> >   USE="-* X vim ..."
> > 
> > will use nothing but those variables (plus the package specific ones
> > specified in /etc/portage). There are certain flags that you most
> > likely don't want to turn off: cxx, posix, and threads for example.
> > 
> > It is a powerful tool; which means you can also seriously hurt
> > yourself from it.
> 
> PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS.
> 
> It turns off all use flags set in profiles as well as use flag defaults
> set in ebuilds.
> 
> The safer way, and the way I would recommend, is to use something like
> euse from gentoolkit to figure out which flags are on and turn off the
> ones you do not want in make.conf instead of turning off everything and
> trying to turn back on the ones you do want.


Agreed.

"emerge --info | grep USE" reveals what an enormous task it is to fix USE=-*. 
Not only an enormous task but a fruitless one too - most of the flags will 
just get re-enabled!

Most people advocating this on list threads and forums, want a minimal system 
without all the KDE/Gnome/etc bloat. The correct way to do that is to use a 
minimal profile then examine the now much smaller emerge --info and disabled 
the few remiaining USE flags one does not want.

-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video)

[Mick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: Text/Plain, Size: 1276 bytes --]

On Saturday 14 May 2011 16:07:33 Felix Miata wrote:

> Does [1] default/linux/x86/10.0 from 'eselect profile list' amount to a
> "minimal" install (no X)? If so, is there any reason not to switch to it
> instead of setting -vlc, and then later when actually ready to enable X,
> switching back to kde?

If you want the full KDE then select the kde desktop profile.  If you instead 
want a slimmer, generic desktop you can consider:

$ ls -la /etc/make.profile
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 56 Dec 16 15:00 /etc/make.profile -> 
../usr/portage/profiles/default/linux/amd64/10.0/desktop

This is what I use and the vlc USE flag is not set by it as a default:

$ euse -i vlc
global use flags (searching: vlc)
************************************************************
no matching entries found

local use flags (searching: vlc)
************************************************************
[-    ] vlc (media-libs/phonon):
Install VLC Phonon backend


> What is the [7] hardened/linux/x86 profile, or better yet, the incantation
> to get descriptions descriptions of all the available targets?

Have a look under /usr/portage/profiles/targets/*

You want to look at the make.default files in there for each respective 
profile.

-- 
Regards,
Mick

[-- Attachment #2: This is a digitally signed message part. --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 03:10:03PM +0200, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Mon, 16 May 2011 12:43:05 +0000, JDM wrote:
> 
> > That's a clever trick. How do you get emails from emerge? 
> 
> Read the settings for PORTAGE_ELOG in man make.conf.
> 
> 

Or as that man page says, 
"Please see /usr/share/portage/config/make.conf.example
for elog documentation."
:)

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 587 bytes --]

On Mon, 16 May 2011 10:57:14 -0400, Indi wrote:

> > Read the settings for PORTAGE_ELOG in man make.conf.

> Or as that man page says, 
> "Please see /usr/share/portage/config/make.conf.example
> for elog documentation."

I know that's what the man page currently says, but I expect it will be
updated to include the actual information long before this thread is
deleted from all mail archives, so it seemed prudent to point to the man
page and let the user follow the link :)


-- 
Neil Bothwick

A computer without Microsoft is like a chocolate cake without mustard.

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[JDM]

Thnx, have followed advice. I am impressed.
JDM

-----Original Message-----
From: Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 20:57:26 
To: <gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org>
Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

On Mon, 16 May 2011 10:57:14 -0400, Indi wrote:

> > Read the settings for PORTAGE_ELOG in man make.conf.

> Or as that man page says, 
> "Please see /usr/share/portage/config/make.conf.example
> for elog documentation."

I know that's what the man page currently says, but I expect it will be
updated to include the actual information long before this thread is
deleted from all mail archives, so it seemed prudent to point to the man
page and let the user follow the link :)


-- 
Neil Bothwick

A computer without Microsoft is like a chocolate cake without mustard.

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 05:00:02AM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> On 2011/05/15 22:18 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed:
> 
> > I have two Gentoo stanzas in my primary bootloader, one to load the kernel,
> > another to chainload Gentoo's Grub. Loading the kernel works, but chainload
> > gives error 13 invalid executable format. I named the bzImage copied to /boot
> > "kernel-2.6.37-r4f", and symlinked it a vmlinuz. vmlinuz is the name I use in
> > the Grub stanzas. Is Gentoo's Grub expecting the kernel to have a particular
> > name, and I picked a wrong one? Or maybe what it doesn't like is that I
> > uncommented splashimage=(hd0,6)/boot/grub/splash.xpm.gz in menu.lst?
>


I always just copy the bzImage to (for example)
/boot/vmlinux-2.6.38-gentoo-r5, but the name doesn't really matter as
long as it matches your bootloader entry.

> 
> Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it didn't 
> actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up. If so, it could be 
> there was already some mismatched Grub code there already from a previous use 
> of the sectors there that didn't like the file format.
>

The install docs are fairly clear that installing the grub pkg is only
the first step of setting up the bootloader.

It seems to me (though I could certainly be wrong) that your best bet 
really is to perform a "vanilla install" first, as much as your hardware 
allows. Just to get to know the system before attempting to customize it.
:)

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/16 11:26 (GMT-0400) Indi composed:

> On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 05:00:02AM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:

>>  On 2011/05/15 22:18 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed:

>>  >  I have two Gentoo stanzas in my primary bootloader, one to load the kernel,
>>  >  another to chainload Gentoo's Grub. Loading the kernel works, but chainload
>>  >  gives error 13 invalid executable format. I named the bzImage copied to /boot
>>  >  "kernel-2.6.37-r4f", and symlinked it a vmlinuz. vmlinuz is the name I use in
>>  >  the Grub stanzas. Is Gentoo's Grub expecting the kernel to have a particular
>>  >  name, and I picked a wrong one? Or maybe what it doesn't like is that I
>>  >  uncommented splashimage=(hd0,6)/boot/grub/splash.xpm.gz in menu.lst?

> I always just copy the bzImage to (for example)
> /boot/vmlinux-2.6.38-gentoo-r5, but the name doesn't really matter as
> long as it matches your bootloader entry.

I spent more time thinking about what happened, and decided the Grub message 
had to be coming from the master Grub trying to chainload the non-existent 
Gentoo Grub, and finding old data from a partition previously using that 
space, rather than something recognizable as boot code.

>>  Why setup didn't get this right via emerge I have no idea, unless it didn't
>>  actually do anything toward actually setting Grub up. If so, it could be
>>  there was already some mismatched Grub code there already from a previous use
>>  of the sectors there that didn't like the file format.

> The install docs are fairly clear that installing the grub pkg is only
> the first step of setting up the bootloader.

At that point I was seriously burned out on reading and rereading docs on 
install attempt #8 on my 5th day trying. I was so joyful seeing pretty colors 
and no error messages that I couldn't think logically. ;-)

> It seems to me (though I could certainly be wrong) that your best bet
> really is to perform a "vanilla install" first, as much as your hardware
> allows. Just to get to know the system before attempting to customize it.
> :)

Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my plan. 
After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good kernel, NFS, 
and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After the errors 
disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I started to wonder 
where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support emerging around that 
time, and more than 3 hours later and time for bed its hundred & some 
packages were still emerging. I woke up hours later to goto the bathroom and 
found that done, so set kdm to install. That hundred plus set of packages is 
still emerging now, nearly 6 hours later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz & 512M RAM is 
on the skimpy side for installing Gentoo?
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 06:10:02PM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> 
> Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my plan. 
> After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good kernel, NFS, 
> and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After the errors 
> disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I started to wonder 
> where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support emerging around that 
> time, and more than 3 hours later and time for bed its hundred & some 
> packages were still emerging. I woke up hours later to goto the bathroom and 
> found that done, so set kdm to install. That hundred plus set of packages is 
> still emerging now, nearly 6 hours later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz & 512M RAM is 
> on the skimpy side for installing Gentoo?
>

Not to mention there is pretty much no way you'll be using kde on that
hardware! I'd be surprised if X would be usable on that even with blackbox 
wm...

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

> On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:18:49PM -0400, Indi wrote:
> > On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 06:10:02PM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> > > 
> > > Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my plan. 
> > > After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good kernel, NFS, 
> > > and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After the errors 
> > > disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I started to wonder 
> > > where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support emerging around that 
> > > time, and more than 3 hours later and time for bed its hundred & some 
> > > packages were still emerging. I woke up hours later to goto the bathroom and 
> > > found that done, so set kdm to install. That hundred plus set of packages is 
> > > still emerging now, nearly 6 hours later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz & 512M RAM is 
> > > on the skimpy side for installing Gentoo?
> > >
> > 
> > Not to mention there is pretty much no way you'll be using kde on that
> > hardware! I'd be surprised if X would be usable on that even with blackbox 
> > wm...
> > 
> 

Oh jeesh, my bad -- I saw "167 MHz", but it's "1667 MHz".
Sorry! :/ (My eyesight is not good)
Yes, you shoud be able to run whatever DE/WM.
 
-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 
 

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 18:18 on Monday 16 May 2011, Indi did opine 
thusly:

> On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 06:10:02PM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> > Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my
> > plan. After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good
> > kernel, NFS, and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After the
> > errors disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I
> > started to wonder where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support
> > emerging around that time, and more than 3 hours later and time for bed
> > its hundred & some packages were still emerging. I woke up hours later
> > to goto the bathroom and found that done, so set kdm to install. That
> > hundred plus set of packages is still emerging now, nearly 6 hours
> > later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz & 512M RAM is on the skimpy side for
> > installing Gentoo?
> 
> Not to mention there is pretty much no way you'll be using kde on that
> hardware! I'd be surprised if X would be usable on that even with blackbox
> wm...

This is a joke right?



-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Dale]

Alan McKinnon wrote:
> Apparently, though unproven, at 18:18 on Monday 16 May 2011, Indi did opine
> thusly:
>
>    
>> On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 06:10:02PM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
>>      
>>> Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my
>>> plan. After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good
>>> kernel, NFS, and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After the
>>> errors disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I
>>> started to wonder where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support
>>> emerging around that time, and more than 3 hours later and time for bed
>>> its hundred&  some packages were still emerging. I woke up hours later
>>> to goto the bathroom and found that done, so set kdm to install. That
>>> hundred plus set of packages is still emerging now, nearly 6 hours
>>> later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz&  512M RAM is on the skimpy side for
>>> installing Gentoo?
>>>        
>> Not to mention there is pretty much no way you'll be using kde on that
>> hardware! I'd be surprised if X would be usable on that even with blackbox
>> wm...
>>      
> This is a joke right?
>
>    

I once ran Gentoo Linux with KDE3 on a 133Mhz machine with 256Mbs of 
ram.  It wasn't fast but it did OK.  A friend used it to play cards on.  
No internet or anything tho.

I did the compiling via chroot on my old rig which had a much faster CPU 
and such.  I just plugged the drive into my rig and did my thing.

It may be slow but it should work.  Make sure you have some swap tho.

Dale

:-)  :-)

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 23:15 on Monday 16 May 2011, Dale did opine 
thusly:

> Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > Apparently, though unproven, at 18:18 on Monday 16 May 2011, Indi did
> > opine
> > 
> > thusly:
> >> On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 06:10:02PM +0200, Felix Miata wrote:
> >>> Actually after the first or 2nd or some subsequent attempt that was my
> >>> plan. After so much time passed (days, not just hours) and I had good
> >>> kernel, NFS, and MC that I didn't see much point delaying KDE. After
> >>> the errors disappeared around 10 last night and I reported same here I
> >>> started to wonder where to go next on a tired brain. I set qt3support
> >>> emerging around that time, and more than 3 hours later and time for
> >>> bed its hundred&  some packages were still emerging. I woke up hours
> >>> later to goto the bathroom and found that done, so set kdm to install.
> >>> That hundred plus set of packages is still emerging now, nearly 6
> >>> hours later. Maybe 32 bit 1667MHz&  512M RAM is on the skimpy side for
> >>> installing Gentoo?
> >> 
> >> Not to mention there is pretty much no way you'll be using kde on that
> >> hardware! I'd be surprised if X would be usable on that even with
> >> blackbox wm...
> > 
> > This is a joke right?
> 
> I once ran Gentoo Linux with KDE3 on a 133Mhz machine with 256Mbs of
> ram.  It wasn't fast but it did OK.  A friend used it to play cards on.
> No internet or anything tho.
> 
> I did the compiling via chroot on my old rig which had a much faster CPU
> and such.  I just plugged the drive into my rig and did my thing.
> 
> It may be slow but it should work.  Make sure you have some swap tho.


I pondered for a long time how to reply to Indi.

I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic Alan, but 
something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later posted he read 
1667MHZ as 167MHz.

Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)



-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 371 bytes --]

On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:

> I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic
> Alan, but something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later
> posted he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.
> 
> Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)

Not nearly as much as a "6" :P


-- 
Neil Bothwick

WWW: World Wide Wait

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 01:01 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Neil Bothwick 
did opine thusly:

> On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic
> > Alan, but something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later
> > posted he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.
> > 
> > Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)
> 
> Not nearly as much as a "6" :P


I *really* need to get some sleep and go to bed _right_now_

<sigh>


-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Pandu Poluan]

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 06:18, Alan McKinnon <alan.mckinnon@gmail.com> wrote:
> Apparently, though unproven, at 01:01 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Neil Bothwick
> did opine thusly:
>
>> On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> > I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic
>> > Alan, but something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later
>> > posted he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.
>> >
>> > Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)
>>
>> Not nearly as much as a "6" :P
>
>
> I *really* need to get some sleep and go to bed _right_now_
>
> <sigh>
>
>

I <3 this list :-D

-- 
Pandu E Poluan
~ IT Optimizer ~
Visit my Blog: http://pepoluan.posterous.com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Felix Miata]

On 2011/05/16 19:01 (GMT-0400) Neil Bothwick composed:

> On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:

>>  he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.

>>  Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)

> Not nearly as much as a "6" :P

Sure it can! In 1111101000b, any of those "1"s represents more than 6. Indi 
misread 11010000011b as 10100111b, while "6" is only 110b. :-)
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 10:10:02PM +0200, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Mon, 16 May 2011 10:57:14 -0400, Indi wrote:
> 
> > > Read the settings for PORTAGE_ELOG in man make.conf.
> 
> > Or as that man page says, 
> > "Please see /usr/share/portage/config/make.conf.example
> > for elog documentation."
> 
> I know that's what the man page currently says, but I expect it will be
> updated to include the actual information long before this thread is
> deleted from all mail archives, so it seemed prudent to point to the man
> page and let the user follow the link :)
> 
> 

Quite right, thanks. :)

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 01:10:02AM +0200, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> 
> > I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic
> > Alan, but something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later
> > posted he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.
> > 
> > Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)
> 
> Not nearly as much as a "6" :P
> 

Or an "s"*.
:)

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ 
*(I'm an old woman)

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 01:28 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Indi did opine 
thusly:

> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 01:10:02AM +0200, Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > On Mon, 16 May 2011 23:40:32 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > > I had many posts typed out, most of them rude, all of them classic
> > > Alan, but something held me back. Lucky it went that way, he later
> > > posted he read 1667MHZ as 167MHz.
> > > 
> > > Amazing what a difference a "1" can make :-)
> > 
> > Not nearly as much as a "6" :P
> 
> Or an "s"*.
> 
> :)


You're speaking to a grumpy old fart combined language git, who not only 
studied English first language at length but an entire 5 year high school 
career in Latin as well. This makes me eminently qualified to opine thusly:

All persons working in technology fields necessarily display masculine 
attributes, hence shall be uniformly referred to by the male form of pronouns, 
i.e. all techies are addressed as "he". The female form is not incorrect, but 
discouraged.

All objects of technology (aka stuff what we work on), due to the peculiar 
interaction shown to them by techies, shall be uniformly referred to by means 
of the female form of pronouns. Vehicles and computers are especially to be 
referred to using the "she" form. Motorcycles triply so.

Users, n00bs, marketing persons, hairdressers, telephone handset sanitizers 
and other assorted riff-raff of the human species should be referred to using 
the neuter form of pronouns, i.e. "it", as befitting their overall 
contribution to humanity.

You see what I did there? You see how I recovered with a witty reposte without 
even blinking an eye? It takes nerves of steel and much practise to pull that 
one off, I tell you!

Let's see how long it takes Neil to find the grammar errors in that lot :-)

-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 991 bytes --]

On Tue, 17 May 2011 01:49:29 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:

 should be
> referred to using the neuter form of pronouns, i.e. "it", as befitting
> their overall contribution to humanity.
> 
> You see what I did there? You see how I recovered with a witty reposte
> without even blinking an eye? It takes nerves of steel and much
> practise to pull that one off, I tell you!
> 
> Let's see how long it takes Neil to find the grammar errors in that
> lot :-)
> 
Well, since you asked...

> All objects of technology (aka stuff what we work on),

Stuff WHAT we work on?

> Users, n00bs, marketing persons, hairdressers, telephone handset
> sanitizers and other assorted riff-raff of the human species

Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer, so that should be
telephone sanitiser - but that's nit-picking, even form me :)

Oh, and it should be grammatical errors :P


-- 
Neil Bothwick

I don't have any solution, but I certainly admire the problem.

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 09:16 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Neil Bothwick 
did opine thusly:


While we are nitpicking:


> Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer,


That should be "greatest writer", the other fellow was not the greatest - he 
merely wrote soap operas.

-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 548 bytes --]

On Tue, 17 May 2011 09:29:29 +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:

> > Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer,  
 
> That should be "greatest writer", the other fellow was not the greatest
> - he merely wrote soap operas.

I don't know what you mean, unless you mistakenly assumed I was referring
to Shakespeare... I wasn't.

I was of course referring to the one who came before Adams, whose merest
operational parameters he was not worthy to calculate - Nigel Kneale.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

C Error #029: Well! I'm impressed

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Tuesday 17 May 2011 08:16:20 Neil Bothwick wrote:
> Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer

Who do you class as the greatest English writer then?

> , so that should be
> telephone sanitiser - but that's nit-picking, even form me :)

[nipick] "even form me"? :P [/nitpick]

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 10:22 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Joost Roeleveld 
did opine thusly:

> On Tuesday 17 May 2011 08:16:20 Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer
> 
> Who do you class as the greatest English writer then?

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings

-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Tuesday 17 May 2011 10:35:48 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> Apparently, though unproven, at 10:22 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Joost
> Roeleveld
> 
> did opine thusly:
> > On Tuesday 17 May 2011 08:16:20 Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > > Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer
> > 
> > Who do you class as the greatest English writer then?
> 
> Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings

You like Vogon Poetry as well then? ;)

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Alan McKinnon]

Apparently, though unproven, at 11:21 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Joost Roeleveld 
did opine thusly:

> On Tuesday 17 May 2011 10:35:48 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> > Apparently, though unproven, at 10:22 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Joost
> > Roeleveld
> > 
> > did opine thusly:
> > > On Tuesday 17 May 2011 08:16:20 Neil Bothwick wrote:
> > > > Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer
> > > 
> > > Who do you class as the greatest English writer then?
> > 
> > Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings
> 
> You like Vogon Poetry as well then? ;)


I have no choice. Resistance is futile.


-- 
alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Neil Bothwick]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 324 bytes --]

On Tue, 17 May 2011 10:22:35 +0200, Joost Roeleveld wrote:

> > telephone sanitiser - but that's nit-picking, even form me :)  
> 
> [nipick] "even form me"? :P [/nitpick]

I think we should both be more careful with our typing when nit-picking :(


-- 
Neil Bothwick

COMMAND: A suggestion made to a computer.

[-- Attachment #2: signature.asc --]
[-- Type: application/pgp-signature, Size: 198 bytes --]

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Tuesday 17 May 2011 10:19:30 Neil Bothwick wrote:
> On Tue, 17 May 2011 10:22:35 +0200, Joost Roeleveld wrote:
> > > telephone sanitiser - but that's nit-picking, even form me :)
> > 
> > [nipick] "even form me"? :P [/nitpick]
> 
> I think we should both be more careful with our typing when nit-picking :(

Probably :)

Re: [gentoo-user] chicken <--> egg (NFS & tty video) (Fixed!)

[Indi]

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 09:40:01AM +0200, Alan McKinnon wrote:
> Apparently, though unproven, at 09:16 on Tuesday 17 May 2011, Neil Bothwick 
> did opine thusly:
> 
> 
> While we are nitpicking:
> 
> 
> > Douglas Adams was English, our second greatest writer,
> 
> 
> That should be "greatest writer", the other fellow was not the greatest - he 
> merely wrote soap operas.
> 

IMO it's "co-greatest writer": 
tossup between Douglas Adams and Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.

-- 
caveat utilitor 
♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫ ❤ ♫