From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0CFB1382C5 for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2018 04:48:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B9238E0B11; Fri, 2 Feb 2018 04:48:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mx.cims.nyu.edu (MX.CIMS.NYU.EDU [128.122.49.99]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 504DEE09FD for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2018 04:48:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.cs.nyu.edu (smtp.cs.nyu.edu [128.122.49.97]) by mx.cims.nyu.edu (8.15.1+Sun/8.15.1) with ESMTPS id w124mKhb024402 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 1 Feb 2018 23:48:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from E7450.localdomain (ool-18be5603.dyn.optonline.net [24.190.86.3]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp.cs.nyu.edu (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id w124mJUT003075 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 1 Feb 2018 23:48:20 -0500 Received: by E7450.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 5A06C4585C; Thu, 1 Feb 2018 23:48:19 -0500 (EST) From: allan gottlieb To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [OT] A little help for non-native English speakers References: <2979311.yKovLQH099@peak> <2102167.S96RrA3Q0U@peak> <20180202000407.4f6389b2@digimed.co.uk> <7111779.UBTVhAxIcJ@peak> Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2018 23:48:19 -0500 In-Reply-To: <7111779.UBTVhAxIcJ@peak> (Peter Humphrey's message of "Fri, 02 Feb 2018 00:36:00 +0000") Message-ID: <87tvv0m1yk.fsf@nyu.edu> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.3 (gnu/linux) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Greylist: inspected by milter-greylist-4.6.2 (mx.cims.nyu.edu [128.122.49.99]); Thu, 01 Feb 2018 23:48:21 -0500 (EST) for IP:'128.122.49.97' DOMAIN:'smtp.cs.nyu.edu' HELO:'smtp.cs.nyu.edu' FROM:'gottlieb@nyu.edu' RCPT:'' X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.6.2 (mx.cims.nyu.edu [128.122.49.99]); Thu, 01 Feb 2018 23:48:21 -0500 (EST) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.99.2 at mx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.80 on 128.122.49.99 X-Archives-Salt: 0d79f3fc-3cba-4c3b-b6f5-87067a5130f7 X-Archives-Hash: 063f010a3f7b67166f94ac9390ea07aa On Fri, Feb 02 2018, Peter Humphrey wrote: > I agree. You haven't consulted Fowler though, I see. (Drat! Where's my copy > when I need it?) He says the difference is whether we have a defining > clause. If what follows actually defines the subject of the sentence, use > "that". Otherwise it's "which". The terminology I was taught is that "which" introduces a nonrestrictive clause set off in commas "that" introduces a restrictive clause. "The ice cream that is in the fridge is cold" restricts the assertion of coldness to the ice cream in the fridge as opposed to some other ice cream. "The ice cream, which is in the fridge, is cold" asserts two points. The ice cream is cold. The ice cream is in the fridge. allan