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From: covici@ccs.covici.com
To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
Date: Fri, 02 Aug 2013 01:18:20 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <5860.1375420700@ccs.covici.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CADPrc80XQ-E=KMA+a8wxtvsbJPvF6DqKuKo0_vA=mSiw5aetNA@mail.gmail.com>

Canek Peláez Valdés <caneko@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 1, 2013 at 4:43 AM, Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> wrote:
> > On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 02:00:23AM -0500, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote
> >> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:24 AM, Daniel Campbell <lists@sporkbox.us> wrote:
> >
> >> You need an OpenRC use flag to install OpenRC init scripts? That's
> >> simply a lie.
> >
> >   An apology to Daniel might be in order.  I start my USE flag with "-*".
> > During a recent install, I found out "the hard way" that eudev (and udev)
> > do not install their init scripts without the "openrc" flag.  As you can
> > see from the ebuild fragments below, they require the "openrc" flag to
> > pull in sys-fs/udev-init-scripts
> >
> > From sys-fs/udev/udev-197-r8.ebuild
> > ===================================
> > PDEPEND=">=virtual/udev-197-r1
> >         hwdb? ( >=sys-apps/hwids-20130114[udev] )
> >         openrc? ( >=sys-fs/udev-init-scripts-19-r1 )"
> >
> > From sys-fs/eudev/eudev-1_beta4-r1.ebuild
> > =========================================
> > PDEPEND=">=virtual/udev-180
> >         openrc? ( >=sys-fs/udev-init-scripts-18 )"
> 
> udev/eudev are special cases: the first is systemd with systemd
> removed at make install time; the second is a fork of systemd with
> systemd exorcised. The systemd package also uses the "openrc" USE flag
> to install OpenRC init scripts; I hope you agree that it is also an
> special case (systemd, which is a whole init system, provides init
> scripts for another init system). The package sys-apps/kmod also uses
> the "openrc" USE flag to install an init script, which "Create[s] [a]
> list of required static device nodes for the current kernel". I have
> no idea why this is necessary, but kmod is a dependency of systemd,
> and the developers of both projects collaborate a lot  between them.
> 
> No other package in the tree uses an "openrc" USE flag (or at least
> they don't appear in /usr/portage/profiles/use.local.desc), except for
> plymouth, and that it's to install a plugin for OpenRC, not to install
> its OpenRC scripts.
> 
> So no package in the tree uses an "openrc" USE flag to install init
> scripts, except for one somewhat related to systemd, two forks and/or
> special handling of systemd, and systemd itself. In *ALL* the other
> packages in the tree, the OpenRC init scripts are installed
> unconditionally, as the systemd unit files are.
> 
> And that's how it should be.
> 
> Lastly, the ebuilds for udev/eudev should work out of the box in a
> sane configuration. You have been told several times, both by users
> and developers, that USE="-*" is not really supported; you broke your
> system by using it, you get to keep the pieces.
> 
> Gentoo is about choice (or so I keep hearing); that doesn't mean it
> shouldn't strive to have sane defaults that keep the majority happy:
> 
> http://blogs.gentoo.org/mgorny/2013/07/23/keeping-the-majority-happy/

So, I hope the package  maintainers will create or install systemd units
and init.d files so we can have the choice and not spend tons of time
maintaining the system -- it gets to the point of being rediculous after
a while.  Systemd sounds nice, but its frustrating because of this.

-- 
Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
How do
you spend it?

         John Covici
         covici@ccs.covici.com


  reply	other threads:[~2013-08-02  5:18 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 66+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2013-07-28  8:22 [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-29  3:30 ` [gentoo-user] " »Q«
2013-07-29 11:04 ` Nikos Chantziaras
2013-07-30  7:04   ` Pavel Volkov
2013-07-31 18:28     ` Michael Palimaka
2013-07-30  7:09 ` [gentoo-user] " Pavel Volkov
2013-07-30  7:47   ` Pavel Volkov
2013-07-30 16:17     ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-30 17:53       ` covici
2013-07-30 18:06         ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-30 22:04           ` covici
2013-07-30 22:40             ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31  6:24               ` Daniel Campbell
2013-07-31  7:00                 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-08-01  9:43                   ` Walter Dnes
2013-08-01 16:15                     ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-08-02  5:18                       ` covici [this message]
2013-07-31 11:34               ` Tanstaafl
2013-07-31 12:22                 ` Neil Bothwick
2013-07-31 12:30                   ` Tanstaafl
2013-07-31 12:41                     ` Yohan Pereira
2013-07-31 15:24                       ` Tanstaafl
2013-07-31 15:36                         ` [gentoo-user] " »Q«
2013-07-31 17:45                           ` Neil Bothwick
2013-08-01 10:24                       ` [gentoo-user] " Walter Dnes
2013-08-01 11:15                         ` Neil Bothwick
2013-08-01 15:46                           ` [gentoo-user] " »Q«
2013-08-01 16:06                             ` Neil Bothwick
2013-07-31 15:20                     ` [gentoo-user] " Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 15:26                       ` Tanstaafl
2013-07-31 15:36                         ` [gentoo-user] " Nikos Chantziaras
2013-07-31 15:36                         ` [gentoo-user] " Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 17:23                           ` Alan McKinnon
2013-07-31 17:56                             ` Stroller
2013-07-31 18:09                               ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 18:21                                 ` Bruce Hill
2013-07-31 18:24                                   ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 18:59                                     ` Stroller
2013-07-31 19:03                                       ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 19:09                                         ` Stroller
2013-07-31 20:02                                     ` Bruce Hill
2013-07-31 18:31                                   ` [gentoo-user] " Grant Edwards
2013-07-31 20:05                                     ` Bruce Hill
2013-07-31 18:54                                 ` [gentoo-user] " Stroller
2013-07-31 19:09                                   ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 19:39                                     ` Stroller
2013-07-31 19:28                                   ` Alan McKinnon
2013-07-31 22:28                                     ` Stroller
2013-07-31 19:36                                   ` Neil Bothwick
2013-07-31 18:09                               ` Alan McKinnon
2013-07-31 18:22                                 ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 18:35                                   ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-07-31 20:07                                   ` Bruce Hill
2013-07-31 18:54                                 ` Stroller
2013-07-31 19:38                                   ` Alan McKinnon
2013-07-31 21:22                                     ` Stroller
2013-07-31 21:43                                       ` Alan McKinnon
2013-07-31 22:25                                         ` Stroller
2013-08-01  6:12                                           ` Alan McKinnon
2013-08-01  0:09                                 ` [gentoo-user] " walt
2013-07-31 18:13                               ` [gentoo-user] " Yohan Pereira
2013-07-31 15:45                         ` Yohan Pereira
2013-07-31 16:49                           ` Tanstaafl
2013-07-31 16:46                       ` Michael Orlitzky
2013-07-30 16:16   ` Canek Peláez Valdés
2013-08-02  9:10 ` Poncho

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