From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84ADB138BF3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2014 20:56:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 845F4E0B76; Sun, 16 Feb 2014 20:56:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ee0-f43.google.com (mail-ee0-f43.google.com [74.125.83.43]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 57A34E09F3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2014 20:56:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ee0-f43.google.com with SMTP id c41so6669807eek.16 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2014 12:56:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=GXCiPyw2fGDKHePafPg7b9ydp4skdxfd99AjZsJbjTU=; b=TWWLXbHiaIsKV3qp3v+jhTRINdqnMZqT3ZhCbyeEbkjT4Hqhzo1c6lWsnWeXoJWLFh z7DGs3DwRTqNx+xOfhsJ0vM2X3uIcB68TexurDfgkObiw9iFQf4Vv3m1wu32Lt4qNwL8 BAMuYrWioQxYoCga4BL4uCsaCJCgoxNadnKyKW8y2dtazgdHvhxQ7D2Iwr403e+3yq/N HPfvGng9Orn46bVJJcgiQISjhPHRQniwdgdMGRboD8d9miO8aecuL0EWaPP5HmNJ7ahU /LZ0gBubIk8nLq4CG88Node9Q69p1j63grRzUkZTHPtrxi/827TLOwUuOo7VBlvSIrqb K97A== X-Received: by 10.14.127.200 with SMTP id d48mr23380581eei.9.1392584163084; Sun, 16 Feb 2014 12:56:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.178.21] (p3E9E6F5D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de. [62.158.111.93]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id u6sm48848514eep.11.2014.02.16.12.56.01 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 16 Feb 2014 12:56:02 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <530125E0.1080105@googlemail.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2014 21:56:00 +0100 From: Volker Armin Hemmann User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Debian just voted in systemd for default init system in jessie References: <52FF84CE.2050301@libertytrek.org> <53010ADB.2070708@yandex.ru> <201402161926.17796.michaelkintzios@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Archives-Salt: a8f6f55c-3196-43f3-bcbf-3c8c30beef36 X-Archives-Hash: ab4caf5b675e89a40c7956b1b7856fae Am 16.02.2014 21:27, schrieb Canek Peláez Valdés: > On Sun, Feb 16, 2014 at 1:26 PM, Mick wrote: > [snip] >> You may have lost it in the link that Volker posted (thanks Volker), but this >> comment from HaakonKL probably sums it up: >> >> "... I will give Upstart this though: Should something better come along, you >> could replace upstart. I guess this holds true for OpenRC as well. >> >> You can't say that about systemd." > I had read that blog entry before. Is full of errors, like believing > that everything that systemd does is inside PID 1. > > There is actually little code inside PID 1; most of systemd > functionality comes from separated binaries. You know, do one thing, > do it right? > > >From [1]: > > "If you build systemd with all configuration options enabled you will > build 69 individual binaries. These binaries all serve different > tasks, and are neatly separated for a number of reasons." and all are linked (not compile&link) in such a manner that you can't just pick and choose. Oh no, you get the full treatment if you like it or not. >> Can you surgically remove systemd in the future without reverse engineering >> half of what the LSB would look at the time, or will its developers ensure >> that this is a one time choice only? > You guys talk about software like if it was a big bad black magical > box with inexplicable powers. > > If someone is willing and able, *everything* can be "surgically > remove[d]". We got rid of devfs, remember? We got rid of OSS (thank > the FSM for ALSA). We got rid of HAL (yuck!). GNOME got rid of bonobo, > and ESD. KDE got rid of aRts (and who knows what more). yeah, as soon as everybody had worked out devfs it got scrapped. As soon as hal was usable, it was replaced with something new, that never stopped changing since then. And then came pulseaudio. The solution to a problem that does not exist. And because of pulseaudio, all the things that led. to systemd happened. > > You can get rid of *everything*, if so you desire. But *someone* needs > to write/patch the code. > > Regards. > > [1] http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/the-biggest-myths.html I am not trusting the people who lied about udev.