[gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[walt]

I'm back in gnome heaven again, thanks to cinnamon-1.6.1 :)

First I'd like to thank Canek for his generous help to all of us
here who have been struggling with gnome-shell.  I'm sure I'll
try gnome-shell again when it's more mature, but for now I'm
sticking with cinnamon.  It's a giant step backward and I love it :)

The newly ported system-monitor panel applet for cinnamon is what
convinced me to switch -- it now looks and behaves exactly like the
old gnome2 version.

There are a couple of things you should know if you've never tried
cinnamon before.  (These may already be documented in the gentoo
wiki but I haven't looked, which is why I had to figure them out
for myself :)

Once you have cinnamon emerged, how do you actually start it? Just
put this line in your .xinitrc:
exec ck-launch-session gnome-session --session=cinnamon

BTW I tried deleting the ck-launch-session. That broke auto-mounting
of removable media like usb sticks, so I put it back.  I'm sure this
will change rapidly when systemd becomes the default, but systemd is
not mature enough yet for my taste so I'm sticking with openrc for now.

Second, and very important for the system-monitor panel applet, is
that networkmanager must be running for the network activity to be
visible in the applet.  That took me a few days to work out :p

Another big change in the panel applet is that you must turn on the
"Panel edit mode" before you can add any other applets to it.  That's
done by right-clicking on the panel.  Then turn edit mode off again
before the panel will work as expected.  That's very confusing if
you have to find it by trial-and-error ;)

I'd be interested to hear other opinions about cinnamon.

Re: [gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mindrunner]

Cinnamon is very great. Also nemo, the nautilus fork of 3.4, because
nautilus 3.6 is a very big regression in manys opinion (mine too).

Ive had soo many problem with gnome 3 (mainly performance), so i
switchesd to lxde.

It felt like replacing an intel pentium 4 with a core i7....

now i am using lxde within my gentoo, and cinnamon on my secondary
screen (linux mint).

I love cinnamon. But it is unusable in my opinion, because it is on top
of gnome3. they should make this working standalone! :))

On 10/15/2012 01:26 AM, walt wrote:
> I'm back in gnome heaven again, thanks to cinnamon-1.6.1 :)
> 
> First I'd like to thank Canek for his generous help to all of us
> here who have been struggling with gnome-shell.  I'm sure I'll
> try gnome-shell again when it's more mature, but for now I'm
> sticking with cinnamon.  It's a giant step backward and I love it :)
> 
> The newly ported system-monitor panel applet for cinnamon is what
> convinced me to switch -- it now looks and behaves exactly like the
> old gnome2 version.
> 
> There are a couple of things you should know if you've never tried
> cinnamon before.  (These may already be documented in the gentoo
> wiki but I haven't looked, which is why I had to figure them out
> for myself :)
> 
> Once you have cinnamon emerged, how do you actually start it? Just
> put this line in your .xinitrc:
> exec ck-launch-session gnome-session --session=cinnamon
> 
> BTW I tried deleting the ck-launch-session. That broke auto-mounting
> of removable media like usb sticks, so I put it back.  I'm sure this
> will change rapidly when systemd becomes the default, but systemd is
> not mature enough yet for my taste so I'm sticking with openrc for now.
> 
> Second, and very important for the system-monitor panel applet, is
> that networkmanager must be running for the network activity to be
> visible in the applet.  That took me a few days to work out :p
> 
> Another big change in the panel applet is that you must turn on the
> "Panel edit mode" before you can add any other applets to it.  That's
> done by right-clicking on the panel.  Then turn edit mode off again
> before the panel will work as expected.  That's very confusing if
> you have to find it by trial-and-error ;)
> 
> I'd be interested to hear other opinions about cinnamon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

[gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[walt]

On 10/15/2012 12:24 AM, mindrunner wrote:

> Ive had soo many problem with gnome 3 (mainly performance), so i
> switched to lxde.

The performance penalty can be due to old video hardware because
both gnome-shell and cinnamon use video compositing for silly and
unnecessary stuff like transparent windows.

In fact, I blame all the new problems with both gnome3 and kde4
on video compositing.  All the whiz-bang kids doing desktop
development are determined to use compositing anywhere they can
possibly use it, even if it's silly.  Just my grouchy old opinion,
of course.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 05:23:44 -0700, walt wrote:

> In fact, I blame all the new problems with both gnome3 and kde4
> on video compositing.  All the whiz-bang kids doing desktop
> development are determined to use compositing anywhere they can
> possibly use it, even if it's silly.

KDE has a checkbox to enable/disable it, and it is disabled by default if
the system hardware is unsuitable. I agree about the unnecessary
proliferation of hardware-hammering eye candy, but have no problems with
it being there as long as it's optional.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

The best antiques are old friends.

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Randolph Maaßen]

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On Oct 15, 2012 2:59 PM, "Neil Bothwick" <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
>
> On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 05:23:44 -0700, walt wrote:
>
> > In fact, I blame all the new problems with both gnome3 and kde4
> > on video compositing.  All the whiz-bang kids doing desktop
> > development are determined to use compositing anywhere they can
> > possibly use it, even if it's silly.
>
> KDE has a checkbox to enable/disable it, and it is disabled by default if
> the system hardware is unsuitable. I agree about the unnecessary
> proliferation of hardware-hammering eye candy, but have no problems with
> it being there as long as it's optional.
>
>
> --
> Neil Bothwick
>
> The best antiques are old friends.

Hi,
I have always loved gnome more than kde or anything else. About 2 years ago
I had to use Windows till about 3 months ago, and I came back to gentoo and
used gnome again. But I didn't feel that comfortable and home, so I tried
kde and some other desktop environments, but these felt even worse. I found
cinnamon and used it with  gdm, what made me happy for a while. But I
couldn't find an easy way to configure this system to my needs. I found no
way to change the gdm background for example. I googled for a couple of
days. So I tried to get rid of gnome, but I have some programmms, that use
it. I use Openbox and slim now, I could configure it within half a day, and
I'm happy now.

By the way, I got used to tabbing terminal.in gnome-terminal, does someone
know a tabbing terminal without gnome or kde or something this big?

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best Regards

Randolph Maaßen

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Thanasis]

on 10/15/2012 05:41 PM Randolph Maaßen wrote the following:
> By the way, I got used to tabbing terminal.in <http://terminal.in>
> gnome-terminal, does someone know a tabbing terminal without gnome or
> kde or something this big?

Try x11-terms/terminal

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Jakub Daniel]

Try tabbed with urxvt (for example, or any other embeddable terminal)

see suckless.org for more info about tabbed

Jakub

On 15 October 2012 21:14, Thanasis <thanasis@asyr.hopto.org> wrote:
> on 10/15/2012 05:41 PM Randolph Maaßen wrote the following:
>> By the way, I got used to tabbing terminal.in <http://terminal.in>
>> gnome-terminal, does someone know a tabbing terminal without gnome or
>> kde or something this big?
>
> Try x11-terms/terminal
>

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mindrunner]

you should try terminator, or guake if you want an "alternate" terminal.
i am using both in combination (guake in luman-overlay, has applied some
additional patches)

lxde/openbox is very nice. slim and slimlock are working fine in
combination with it. so there is no need for heavy gnome/kde desktops.

if you want your old gnome 2.x dektop back, you should try mate, which
is a fork of the last gnome 2.x stable branch. (there is mate-overlay) ;)

(happy to see some other german gentoo users! :)))

On 10/15/2012 04:41 PM, Randolph Maaßen wrote:
> On Oct 15, 2012 2:59 PM, "Neil Bothwick" <neil@digimed.co.uk
> <mailto:neil@digimed.co.uk>> wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 05:23:44 -0700, walt wrote:
>>
>> > In fact, I blame all the new problems with both gnome3 and kde4
>> > on video compositing.  All the whiz-bang kids doing desktop
>> > development are determined to use compositing anywhere they can
>> > possibly use it, even if it's silly.
>>
>> KDE has a checkbox to enable/disable it, and it is disabled by default if
>> the system hardware is unsuitable. I agree about the unnecessary
>> proliferation of hardware-hammering eye candy, but have no problems with
>> it being there as long as it's optional.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Neil Bothwick
>>
>> The best antiques are old friends.
> 
> Hi,
> I have always loved gnome more than kde or anything else. About 2 years
> ago I had to use Windows till about 3 months ago, and I came back to
> gentoo and used gnome again. But I didn't feel that comfortable and
> home, so I tried kde and some other desktop environments, but these felt
> even worse. I found cinnamon and used it with  gdm, what made me happy
> for a while. But I couldn't find an easy way to configure this system to
> my needs. I found no way to change the gdm background for example. I
> googled for a couple of days. So I tried to get rid of gnome, but I have
> some programmms, that use it. I use Openbox and slim now, I could
> configure it within half a day, and I'm happy now.
> 
> By the way, I got used to tabbing terminal.in <http://terminal.in>
> gnome-terminal, does someone know a tabbing terminal without gnome or
> kde or something this big?
> 
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best Regards
> 
> Randolph Maaßen
> 

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mindrunner]

02:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI
Manhattan [Mobility Radeon HD 5400 Series]

i7-820QM

8GB-DDR3



On 10/15/2012 02:23 PM, walt wrote:
> On 10/15/2012 12:24 AM, mindrunner wrote:
> 
>> Ive had soo many problem with gnome 3 (mainly performance), so i
>> switched to lxde.
> 
> The performance penalty can be due to old video hardware because
> both gnome-shell and cinnamon use video compositing for silly and
> unnecessary stuff like transparent windows.
> 
> In fact, I blame all the new problems with both gnome3 and kde4
> on video compositing.  All the whiz-bang kids doing desktop
> development are determined to use compositing anywhere they can
> possibly use it, even if it's silly.  Just my grouchy old opinion,
> of course.
> 
> 
> 
> 

[gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[walt]

On 10/15/2012 12:40 PM, mindrunner wrote:
> 02:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI
> Manhattan [Mobility Radeon HD 5400 Series]

Are you using the proprietary ati drivers? (x11-drivers/ati-drivers)
If yes, does fgl_glxgears run okay?

  
> On 10/15/2012 02:23 PM, walt wrote:
>> >On 10/15/2012 12:24 AM, mindrunner wrote:
>> >
>>> >>Ive had soo many problem with gnome 3 (mainly performance), so i
>>> >>switched to lxde.
>> >
>> >The performance penalty can be due to old video hardware because
>> >both gnome-shell and cinnamon use video compositing for silly and
>> >unnecessary stuff like transparent windows.
>> >

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mindrunner]

This was my thread right before switching to lxde

http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-928750-start-0.html

i assume that everything is correct in my system.

sometimes i use the one driver, sometimes the other.
both have advantages against the other one, but gnome3 experience is
always HELL.

(fglrx wasnt working at all for months with gnome shell) dont know if
this is fixed already....

On 10/16/2012 01:07 AM, walt wrote:
> On 10/15/2012 12:40 PM, mindrunner wrote:
>> 02:00.0 VGA compatible controller: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI
>> Manhattan [Mobility Radeon HD 5400 Series]
> 
> Are you using the proprietary ati drivers? (x11-drivers/ati-drivers)
> If yes, does fgl_glxgears run okay?
> 
>  
>> On 10/15/2012 02:23 PM, walt wrote:
>>> >On 10/15/2012 12:24 AM, mindrunner wrote:
>>> >
>>>> >>Ive had soo many problem with gnome 3 (mainly performance), so i
>>>> >>switched to lxde.
>>> >
>>> >The performance penalty can be due to old video hardware because
>>> >both gnome-shell and cinnamon use video compositing for silly and
>>> >unnecessary stuff like transparent windows.
>>> >
> 
> 
> 
> 

Re: [gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Michael Hampicke]

Am 15.10.2012 09:24, schrieb mindrunner:
> Cinnamon is very great. Also nemo, the nautilus fork of 3.4, because
> nautilus 3.6 is a very big regression in manys opinion (mine too).

Thanks for the heads-up, last time I looked nemo was not in portage. I
use gnome3.6 and dislike the new nautilus - still have version 3.4 of it
installed. But now I can switch to nemo.

Re: [gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mindrunner]

nemo is there, but for now i prefer nautilus 3.4, because nemo lacks
some of the functions (like the "extract here" context menu) :((

On 10/15/2012 02:38 PM, Michael Hampicke wrote:
> Am 15.10.2012 09:24, schrieb mindrunner:
>> Cinnamon is very great. Also nemo, the nautilus fork of 3.4, because
>> nautilus 3.6 is a very big regression in manys opinion (mine too).
> 
> Thanks for the heads-up, last time I looked nemo was not in portage. I
> use gnome3.6 and dislike the new nautilus - still have version 3.4 of it
> installed. But now I can switch to nemo.
> 
> 
> 

Re: [gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[mike]

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On 10/15/2012 08:38 AM, Michael Hampicke wrote:
> Thanks for the heads-up, last time I looked nemo was not in portage. I
> use gnome3.6 and dislike the new nautilus - still have version 3.4 of it
> installed. But now I can switch to nemo.

GNOME 3.6 landed?  I know it was released, but I still don't have it on
my system... I'm assuming that it requires more unmasking and
modification of the /etc/portage/* stuff?

(Incidentally, when will it become "stable" as a whole?  I realize I
must be one of the very few dissenters to the subject here, but jhbuild
never works for me, and GNOME is the only thing that I don't fully have
that I want.  That, and I want to check out the GNOME boxes feature...)

	--- Mike

-- 
A man who reasons deliberately, manages it better after studying Logic
than he could before, if he is sincere about it and has common sense.
                                   --- Carveth Read, “Logic”


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Re: [gentoo-user] Gnome3 haters: you should try the new cinnamon-1.6.1

[Canek Peláez Valdés]

On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 12:52 AM, mike@trausch.us <mike@trausch.us> wrote:
> On 10/15/2012 08:38 AM, Michael Hampicke wrote:
>> Thanks for the heads-up, last time I looked nemo was not in portage. I
>> use gnome3.6 and dislike the new nautilus - still have version 3.4 of it
>> installed. But now I can switch to nemo.
>
> GNOME 3.6 landed?  I know it was released, but I still don't have it on
> my system... I'm assuming that it requires more unmasking and
> modification of the /etc/portage/* stuff?

3.6 is not in the official tree, but it is in the GNOME overlay:

http://git.overlays.gentoo.org/gitweb/?p=proj/gnome.git;a=summary

(And yeah, it needs "unmasking and modification of the /etc/portage/* stuff").

> (Incidentally, when will it become "stable" as a whole?  I realize I
> must be one of the very few dissenters to the subject here, but jhbuild
> never works for me, and GNOME is the only thing that I don't fully have
> that I want.  That, and I want to check out the GNOME boxes feature...)

We are not that few, we just don't scream so loudly ;)

I don't know when it will become stable, but at the sooner it will be
with 3.8, I reckon. Probably 3.10.

However, 3.6 is running pretty much great, but you kinda need to know
what are you doing before starting to unmask and keyword stuff.

Regards.
-- 
Canek Peláez Valdés
Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México