From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0E3F5138334 for ; Tue, 11 Dec 2018 23:56:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 33AECE0D26; Tue, 11 Dec 2018 23:56:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-oi1-x235.google.com (mail-oi1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A0D50E0CCA for ; Tue, 11 Dec 2018 23:56:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-oi1-x235.google.com with SMTP id x23so13585656oix.3 for ; Tue, 11 Dec 2018 15:56:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=a9/xSkMihlXSmfSHNFTW6Ncz2h3wJM4INV1ytzqcw6I=; b=izuuJHerIIBHcmO5aO1DfMS5VfnmV7ty+94ZMMFQHs94oCS53aCm/PUJHziutrscuh g+pr17heiUN7x6XVFV2BctTDj9M2H1Y/mmghYNpUz21oEyNbCb0Uca1KH1S21RTF5UmT WcZ8+nQiXUBDcYw+kG3M3avk0gpCMVT4ORYbyGMsD3YBHfXHq5ZzkGKkF5Btw3WZPuaJ VFFvhX+vkD0V2yS6IfxbqJDNl6+gfvO73JA/OsLNOQnret2lDOavh4Gb9eWeb/qfG3Dh 6wbQLrguLllQpXG4C1XcaaOCirykfLN6vPYakbXDk2nNzDEo+mqyU7g+/t/+I2DYLhl7 RKrg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=a9/xSkMihlXSmfSHNFTW6Ncz2h3wJM4INV1ytzqcw6I=; b=MZtaJUq7MVQQSYoSX0+g5YgHRsLOXkELkgZNdvrhUVpjG0+z9/qCaw9viY8y542N4o At8IbIE4NaselJ1XxaAFTmwmsUYupTeyG2+CjWLaWX9/7wu+2ao/FGNKeS5v9NUnYT9E tySpm//wDpd83rh6Gw0oIAd4N5Ak+QO8A2OygZUnxaxGczTmas3swzH5WnEUffID5UgO VyZpDFFl3HiXKA0QwZXwYAFwd2FqQbAI442B33bqYSnzuu+GuZZBuJppoXwMplmcQHNp eXyAP4Kk1UC269vFMUsl8ikkXvdsadoaKVmwYVLfYFxqMwjUYLbYHUIwTaGPe6sV5DJ9 9BaQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AA+aEWZj2bqG5lVpflYa16i2TlQ3jxjl2xF3Wfb/lXyQUMfhmuHskMuw 0IG08h8A09HEOnUdfCqYJGs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AFSGD/Wl72Wx8xqepJrT74xs/vqV6QbJd5lycSte3/OgvXiaR74QjfTnOqDyjxaCv6JR0UvzT/C+uQ== X-Received: by 2002:aca:bdc1:: with SMTP id n184mr2563059oif.223.1544572607430; Tue, 11 Dec 2018 15:56:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.5] (adsl-68-19-235-148.bna.bellsouth.net. [68.19.235.148]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r11sm8031087oib.45.2018.12.11.15.56.45 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 11 Dec 2018 15:56:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: CPU upgrade and LVM questions. To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org References: <492d8bf4-4b8d-f7f6-05d8-2473b6825fab@gmail.com> <6651f356-8831-1d49-6d1e-adbe9d337b74@charter.net> <234e7289-0372-64de-5a94-d1aa82c7d40b@charter.net> <288c83f0-70a5-98ec-b082-d575239f0c03@gmail.com> <0456c03c-8a4b-17b9-b062-e42580ed531f@gmail.com> <20181210221412.2097b809@digimed.co.uk> <0fe209dd-649f-c1fc-8c84-4f84aad7ed15@gmx.com> <20181211084925.3aff5175@digimed.co.uk> From: Dale Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=rdalek1967@gmail.com; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= xsFNBFpEtdQBEADI51WaryP3FJlDfmCQx2aPQpSppEKxqWhCTA8KFEcOVFmIIfiFAeekqMMD mhUxgZTtlQh7dsNqha6ioaYDqGKTv7oeJlPJw4hmIMJX3WYVSOHlsJUNM2jpDIAFeEKfup/T zDzFpuU2Qtr/Y0ji35wHyOAZLRckeNk705oRvE9wqi6noTP15Gxmw/U6aMzEfvu+wGEfCjgs 9bERmu+CS75PZEaFAv8RnsXUv1UcvQ45jmk/8ni/ogxE2h53OIp6c/hOlgJkSVRQWPZZyKZw lDiSUKCtMXPMdZ9w0X6RltQxtIQXO0KxAKaAp+tnL8z+0piafF5uW4RIglhT922RXKxxdZyx SjRgtE4V1IPtUcwPAeqVUZw2P1b4pjfPv7tNtMoFsIiY0ZnT+ua4ps6KOUeocRPKAX14mZkL jt/sZM7aIKiwyoteshRgWNNkxh4OiSxGCRUKNQI8M42cRSidvJZ6SGZXM3WpV28RPyF7+0Ba 0stEQwBGNF8uxgytY9rOJ7obmIpEZKx1p3W1O1hadOjBo2110jMDirRXtktMDfBDvVKkOZ06 vLu16uZLb0O52euhl2dMcEI3ZoCAFTKtdwMITIDj1TcMBZar6+bcwOicSFFogOLHQLJZRO5q I5szOIYW7+c0yNqPRLT3Sq7HzDyuyTUjmPZSAcqOwzX8GwUFkwARAQABzRtEYWxlIDxyZGFs ZWsxOTY3QGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwZQEEwEIAD4WIQSUDVlCt0m0Z/PsCaxgB5lCagHqugUCWkS1 1AIbIwUJCWYBgAULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAKCRBgB5lCagHqurR7D/45/q20 vXdrJGxrkNphotmlBtTpNbVauu5A2NDv3E1Il6yqRBfh4Xw7xFuwhz9DqThuvByU6566vr0z 7oVCK33dxRm4WA7YaogRQZy4VVIbHdrksnh2f702CFllqtn5Y29M2JtXG5jiiL3aZNEhoyP9 eMtzLPGs56yZ3eMkz4U7DEmWCAUr8bbuXW+eq/A0V5djcFdHfmanuDZSxzg+cZTpVOLolS2b pmNsPTSMkJ2MDY2Kfdg3gPhSaawo2agQfgnf9E7vSm7z/rlk8bBUWcPAP/XTN9ndVwOO3x74 EQv/M4EiCTtNpw3yapVZI2NhA1wqW648D7RxIPD8Y3nkJVDS4x5g54xDe1IUFOtVUSDAh+vY wUJt7vgbCeRjyT8XbuGW9RokIos3ALNaPoq/FDNEqefbmop0CPRih6aLFHWT4YBA6xQjLJuP LSNvalNqE5mef0giCtnLxo/lkjnP9Sv+t/5VSHda5zkVuN0+2w46SbGvXIHRkSoSi6XH3ccq KayJC+oTqo4xf9J30c7CV4rEcYnJcnxMw0vcYmU3DwjGfKxuKcLHgPr9mDNWvhteroA5wNWw NzQ72yAj7rsZVUXCxZgiPldSH3SXZJ/Jo6E9JouzQgRb/I4Vy4jx0Yw8rJLDx/ha82fn+FVe cFbiodVV5UD0inw488IAAtJE+Zi0t87BTQRaRLXUARAA38iHcF7M7GnkS73dazdLBgz2YJsu fpix/N/x4CvoHMqTuwi4ASz1WroYjl3KajeH0DSybyPdEQ7nffxIUt48deT3j/rwsJkPRvCF BpmcwxErd/Mbq0BgikYxXvO68aEAs4jBDR26YtONfjobEfd+Juhxci9UN9vTOCgSPhY+dxHs MZ0gHRzvMnpM3o3+oht/XRZr05RQx83DvTIqWnjDQlCseYYlbFp+rFTZi7ro71ULDThfCE0p +f+IQ3zX0cRKOcJGtNRvyWH6PxmN4td6Q7gPHfAsFPLsCpg7nZwOejtAktPejtSEXlN6QOKv bmRQxNtzgMtjzJNNJW2NtBz0DIW394+9stchQRKLqH8n8GnB6tlkfPg4vgf/kq14QQSZcb0F M36wk+i1Hk+TWYWbOBoUw9+X941Pw1JnglJ3tzpBh+36+pdG02Lbm2v6SaZ69zkDfzJ2Sfhb E+KQLibLkiCOhuSDLDWUgUeb0lJ/0qlo3vcQMTBuG5eiWiwBkp4C+ACb1f1Akq0mFvim+gCJ qJOTu0IDK9DjKLKglA3Z6sbeepnXq8fxB2Mo/SFSYEsGqUu4MLxgwnPg7zi+rKg7MhqdiBBE fqugmNguCEYZjJrGCCzwuqPXAZAcyzEYTGFKwI6NdEZ6v8Xc3om9MJomB3y1uzG6K7T9ue5H aw/2aqEAEQEAAcLBfAQYAQgAJhYhBJQNWUK3SbRn8+wJrGAHmUJqAeq6BQJaRLXUAhsMBQkJ ZgGAAAoJEGAHmUJqAeq6/ykP/ib6xEHednaXvzZvvj854PB5ffBqKkphbf51g6pxPvFBWMwY E7Bu/kq8e3hkp3rzX42BjqiUmfEe2OyfZCabXLybP8i/QRkHTzD5nLoIYLeL+62N/WQFW1NU VhqdfQbMhphNgP1mvG2Ib5R6S+Fb+vkw776oq6jLwUBP/o6PPpp62GyvFvFb9ekxV9+sE4yG V3DTqURBY+aXfc/MTzlCXp4u4QzFW9odfcb/kb9f1m/gZbWGihAqeMd1HViXQoMzTx6IuP13 eQAkKj4FlA2QMzbEOOKO6fliSt1JweJoh0OLCEAM/3q+LaflMvvjhl9ht00IUT/ySj3/dZdf EdTpuUAtnC3A3flwgK/aetkkOhrkx9hx4SKn6UHtAl+eCqP1Mae+nWzkisBL0/hBPEz713md 5I+4Y4QjIokRiz/5l/TFwpGu26zmDfDUkZmxZR/iNCW0VAmZE2YdyRm3PYcFcVXuZ1f/ff0D us9xGsO8V6F5EIwx/9Y6AWQdW7PoKHA21ri93PoRgjv+QoOifXEkhJwTKg5k5b1Tr7h9eRU/ Se2XigPVODjrN9FRfkx/JxlJcCs/igGJS05BmiZNIIRDKBGdXy/Fj5HQB2q5v5DfvrLMNTwK Aa8pn/em1SKC/l9aV9ygpN+cQPKoQjGxPPaId/rwX+GVxKl2vakjHLPLQmm3 Message-ID: <4e9081a8-f898-e586-f51f-23c991ce0320@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2018 17:56:45 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0 SeaMonkey/2.49.9.1 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------4DE2BA5A7970D7FA84549A87" X-Archives-Salt: e805ea1c-920f-4947-9783-ee80fd609471 X-Archives-Hash: 2ebda859e7207a6847b0f8f12425740e This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------4DE2BA5A7970D7FA84549A87 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Adam Carter wrote: > On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 7:49 PM Neil Bothwick > wrote: > > > So tell us what is your perfect country for hardware manufacturing? > > There isn't one as you can never be sure. You are presenting hope, and > maybe likelihood, as certainty when this does not exist. > > > Datapoint - looks like Bloomberg is starting to walk back its complete > support of the original implant story. > https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-11/super-micro-says-third-party-test-found-no-malicious-hardware > > Also they have assigned another reporter that was not involved in the > original story, to attempt to verify the claims of the original story... > > Others have made the point that the Amazon and Apple denials left them > no wriggle room in the event that implants are found and shareholders > launch a class action, and that this indicates a genuine belief that > there are no backdoors. > > Considering risk; > If you are of interest to a nation state, you're pretty much stuffed > anyway, and I think this discussion has been around implants made via > Chinese government action. > The management processor issue is a real problem because they're not > well understood, on by default, cant be (or cant easily) be disabled, > and has to be software maintained. However, given all the other issues > like the never ending stream of security issues in software, i'm not > sure it changes the overall risk profile significantly. Only time will > tell. > > Sorry for further polluting your thread Dale :) > I agree.  If you are committing international crimes, terrorism for example, they will snoop on you and it doesn't matter much what you do or use.  If nothing else, they will put you on a super computer setup that will crack whatever you are doing/using and get you that way.  As we know, generally speaking, given enough computer power, almost anything can be cracked.  It's a time thing mostly.  While off topic sort of, it is still relevant.  This might fit better on the encryption thread but I still find it interesting. It is technology related too.  It seems we agree on one thing here, we can't trust much of anything or anyone completely.  So, no need for the apology.  I still learn from the posts even if I don't post a reply to some.  Dale :-)  :-)  --------------4DE2BA5A7970D7FA84549A87 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Adam Carter wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 7:49 PM Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> So tell us what is your perfect country for hardware manufacturing?

There isn't one as you can never be sure. You are presenting hope, and
maybe likelihood, as certainty when this does not exist.

Datapoint - looks like Bloomberg is starting to walk back its complete support of the original implant story.
Also they have assigned another reporter that was not involved in the original story, to attempt to verify the claims of the original story...

Others have made the point that the Amazon and Apple denials left them no wriggle room in the event that implants are found and shareholders launch a class action, and that this indicates a genuine belief that there are no backdoors.

Considering risk;
If you are of interest to a nation state, you're pretty much stuffed anyway, and I think this discussion has been around implants made via Chinese government action.
The management processor issue is a real problem because they're not well understood, on by default, cant be (or cant easily) be disabled, and has to be software maintained. However, given all the other issues like the never ending stream of security issues in software, i'm not sure it changes the overall risk profile significantly. Only time will tell.

Sorry for further polluting your thread Dale :)



I agree.  If you are committing international crimes, terrorism for example, they will snoop on you and it doesn't matter much what you do or use.  If nothing else, they will put you on a super computer setup that will crack whatever you are doing/using and get you that way.  As we know, generally speaking, given enough computer power, almost anything can be cracked.  It's a time thing mostly. 

While off topic sort of, it is still relevant.  This might fit better on the encryption thread but I still find it interesting. It is technology related too.  It seems we agree on one thing here, we can't trust much of anything or anyone completely.  So, no need for the apology.  I still learn from the posts even if I don't post a reply to some. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 
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