From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NeqtP-000710-Vh for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 09 Feb 2010 14:16:46 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 91995E10B1 for ; Tue, 9 Feb 2010 14:16:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.123]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58BC1E08D0 for ; Tue, 9 Feb 2010 14:08:29 +0000 (UTC) X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=Pg4a-o2I2woA:10 a=hS7reK8IGuB3cNn7BJwA:9 a=xFndUqwTiBf5AWS6ySEA:7 a=1123mmA7MJ8-GSvbZnLyf0q-qgEA:4 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 97.103.123.104 Received: from [97.103.123.104] ([97.103.123.104:44377] helo=basement.kutulu.org) by cdptpa-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.2.39 r()) with ESMTP id 07/A7-03217-C5C617B4; Tue, 09 Feb 2010 14:08:28 +0000 Received: by basement.kutulu.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 4AA377D801C; Tue, 9 Feb 2010 05:08:30 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5-gr0 (2008-06-10) on basement X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.4 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED, DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06,FH_DATE_PAST_20XX autolearn=no version=3.2.5-gr0 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [192.168.69.4]) by basement.kutulu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 160807D801A; Tue, 9 Feb 2010 05:08:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4B716C5D.5030600@kutulu.org> Date: Tue, 09 Feb 2010 09:08:29 -0500 From: Mike Edenfield User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.7) Gecko/20100111 Thunderbird/3.0.1 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org CC: Alan Mackenzie Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] How the HAL are you supposed to use these files? References: <20100208222047.GA6553@muc.de> In-Reply-To: <20100208222047.GA6553@muc.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Archives-Salt: f18ad5eb-a9d6-4501-a3fc-dc03d20b9b6b X-Archives-Hash: b53162af5f8502074cea0e3c7ab83ef9 On 2/8/2010 5:20 PM, Alan Mackenzie wrote: > . Am I the only person that finds this semantic gibberish? Is there > any explanation somewhere of what a "policy" aka "device rule" is? What > is the semantic significance of a "device rule"? What does it mean, to > "rule a device", or what sort of restrictions are being placed on this > device? > Given that one might desire a "basic working keyboard/mouse > combination", what is the chain of reasoning that ends up selecting the > file called "10-input-policy.fdi" from all the other ones? > This file is an inpenetrable stanza of uncommented XML. Are its verbs > documented somewhere? What do "" and"" mean, > for example? The way HAL works, in a nutshell, is to scan your system for every known piece of hardware it can find, and stores the information in a tree-like database of key/value pairs. Software can then query this database for information about whatever hardware you have. The information includes things like the bus location of the hardware, the manufacturer information, state information, and a lists of known capabilities like "keyboard", "mouse", "disk", etc. Device Rules are simply ways for the user to change values in the database after a device has been detected. The XML files work in two steps: 1. an existing node in the database, 2. or Can this new-style fragmented XML configuration do anything that a good > old-fashioned, human-readable and compact xorg.conf can't? If so, what? > What am I missing here? HAL manages a *lot* more than just your X configuration. It's intended to be a complete hardware management layer, one that was able to keep pace with new hardware more quickly than the kernel could. If you run the HAL database dump utility "lshal" you'll see more information about your hardware than you could ever possible care to know. > Please, somebody, tell me all this HAL stuff is straightforwardly > explained in an easily accessible Gentoo document, so that I can hang my > head in shame and apologise for the noise! ;-) Oddly enough, the most complete explanation of HAL I've ever found was on the Gentoo wiki and I think the page may be lost. It was never really documented that well, though there are a number of places you can find specific ways to do specific things (like using a touchpad) with HAL. The key point here, though, is that HAL is going away. Not because it was hard to configure, though -- because the code is an "unmaintainable mess" and because other software, like udev, duplicated much of its purpose. At this point, if it's not working for you out of the box, turn it back off and revert to the old style configuration file.