[gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Without any ranting ... I feel kind of stupid waiting for GNOME 2.26
going stable within the gentoo-tree while GNOME 2.28 is out now at
gnome.org.

Maybe I am too conservative here and could already use 2.26 for a while
by unmasking lots of packages or doing *something* ...

Not that I really miss something, it's just that I wonder ... and I
would like to explore any new features etc ...

The question:

Should I wait for bug 263083 to be done?

https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=263083

Or is there a "safe enough, stable enough" way to get gnome-2.26 onto my
amd64-desktop without crashing my main workstation every few days?

Again: I appreciate the work of all the gentoo-devs, I am far from being
able to judge their work. I just ask as I assume that I am missing
something maybe ...

Thanks, Stefan.

[gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[walt]

On 09/29/2009 03:01 PM, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
>
> Without any ranting ... I feel kind of stupid waiting for GNOME 2.26
> going stable within the gentoo-tree while GNOME 2.28 is out now at
> gnome.org.
>
> Maybe I am too conservative here and could already use 2.26 for a while
> by unmasking lots of packages or doing *something* ...

I run gnome on my ~amd64 machine and have had no problems at all (so far).
IMHO it's safe to run gnome on an ~amd64 machine, but I've not used the
unstable gnome desktop on a stable amd64 machine.  Just from past experience
I might expect problems from mixing stable/unstable in that manner.  But
I can offer no evidence either way.

Happy to be helpful ;o)

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Daniel Troeder]

On Tue, 2009-09-29 at 18:19 -0700, walt wrote:
> I run gnome on my ~amd64 machine and have had no problems at all (so far).
> IMHO it's safe to run gnome on an ~amd64 machine, but I've not used the
> unstable gnome desktop on a stable amd64 machine.  Just from past experience
> I might expect problems from mixing stable/unstable in that manner.  But
> I can offer no evidence either way.
I'm running testing GNOME on a "stable" system, with tesing
audio/video/gfx/xorg stuff.
Everything I consider "moving fast" is testing, the rest of the system
is stable. Works good for me. Just that I have to unmask more and more
base packages too, because they are a dependency of other unmasked
packages...

$ wc -l /etc/portage/package.*
  593 /etc/portage/package.keywords
    2 /etc/portage/package.mask
   32 /etc/portage/package.unmask
   23 /etc/portage/package.use
  650 total

(cleaned number after checking for comments with
$ egrep '^#' /etc/portage/package.*
)

$ eix -I --only-names | wc -l
1194

Well... I wouldn't call a system with 50% testing packages officially
"stable" - though it is. :D

Bye,
Daniel

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Daniel Troeder schrieb:

> I'm running testing GNOME on a "stable" system, with tesing
> audio/video/gfx/xorg stuff.
> Everything I consider "moving fast" is testing, the rest of the system
> is stable. Works good for me. Just that I have to unmask more and more
> base packages too, because they are a dependency of other unmasked
> packages...

Yes, that's what I fear somehow.

> $ wc -l /etc/portage/package.*
>   593 /etc/portage/package.keywords
>     2 /etc/portage/package.mask
>    32 /etc/portage/package.unmask
>    23 /etc/portage/package.use
>   650 total
> 
> (cleaned number after checking for comments with
> $ egrep '^#' /etc/portage/package.*
> )
> 
> $ eix -I --only-names | wc -l
> 1194
> 
> Well... I wouldn't call a system with 50% testing packages officially
> "stable" - though it is. :D

;-)

Any way to share a meaningful list of gnome-related pkgs to
unmask/keyword? Just for starting off here ....

Thanks, Stefan

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Daniel Troeder]

> Any way to share a meaningful list of gnome-related pkgs to
> unmask/keyword? Just for starting off here ....

That's my list of GNOME related packages. Probably some of them are not
necessary to unmask anymore, and probably I missed some :)

gnome-extra/nm-applet
net-misc/networkmanager-vpnc
net-misc/networkmanager-pptp
net-misc/networkmanager-openvpn
net-misc/networkmanager
gnome-extra/nm-applet
net-misc/openvpn
sys-auth/policykit
gnome-extra/policykit-gnome
sys-auth/pambase
sys-auth/consolekit
sys-apps/hal
app-cdr/brasero
dev-libs/libburn
media-sound/rhythmbox
gnome-extra/nautilus-sendto
app-misc/tracker
dev-libs/liboil
mail-client/evolution
gnome-extra/evolution-data-server
gnome-extra/evolution-webcal
gnome-extra/gtkhtml
net-libs/libsoup:2.4
dev-libs/glib
net-wireless/bluez-gnome
net-wireless/bluez-utils
net-wireless/bluez-libs
app-mobilephone/obex-data-server
gnome-extra/gnome-vfs-obexftp
net-wireless/bluez-hcidump
app-pda/gnome-pilot
app-pda/gnome-pilot-conduits
dev-dotnet/gnome-sharp
dev-dotnet/gtk-sharp
dev-dotnet/gtk-sharp-gapi
dev-dotnet/glade-sharp
dev-dotnet/atk-sharp
dev-dotnet/gdk-sharp
dev-dotnet/pango-sharp
dev-dotnet/glib-sharp
dev-dotnet/gnome-panel-sharp
dev-dotnet/gnome-desktop-sharp
dev-dotnet/gconf-sharp
dev-dotnet/dbus-sharp
dev-dotnet/art-sharp
dev-dotnet/gnomevfs-sharp
dev-libs/gmime
dev-dotnet/dbus-glib-sharp
gnome-base/gnome-applets
gnome-base/gnome-settings-daemon
gnome-base/gnome-desktop
gnome-base/libgnomekbd
dev-libs/libgweather
gnome-extra/fast-user-switch-applet
gnome-base/gconf
gnome-extra/gconf-editor
x11-libs/libwnck
gnome-base/gnome-panel
gnome-base/gvfs
gnome-base/gnome-session
gnome-base/gnome-keyring
app-editors/gedit
x11-libs/gtksourceview
dev-python/pygtksourceview
dev-python/pygtk
gnome-base/libgnomeui
gnome-base/gnome-vfs
dev-python/gnome-vfs-python
dev-python/pygobject
gnome-extra/deskbar-applet
gnome-base/orbit
gnome-extra/gucharmap
gnome-extra/gnome-utils
app-admin/pessulus
net-analyzer/gnome-netstatus
gnome-base/libgnomeprintui
gnome-base/libgnomeprint
gnome-extra/nautilus-cd-burner
gnome-base/nautilus
gnome-base/eel
net-misc/vinagre
net-libs/gtk-vnc
gnome-base/gnome-menus
gnome-extra/gnome-system-monitor
media-video/totem
dev-libs/totem-pl-parser
dev-python/totem-python
dev-python/gdata
gnome-base/gdm
x11-themes/gnome-themes
media-sound/sound-juicer
gnome-extra/bug-buddy
media-gfx/eog
app-arch/file-roller
net-analyzer/gnome-nettool
app-crypt/seahorse
x11-terms/gnome-terminal
x11-themes/gnome-icon-theme
gnome-extra/swfdec-gnome
media-libs/swfdec
gnome-extra/zenity
gnome-extra/yelp
app-text/rarian
gnome-base/gnome-control-center
x11-wm/metacity
gnome-extra/gnome-games
gnome-base/libgnome
x11-libs/pango
net-misc/vino
net-voip/ekiga
gnome-extra/gnome-power-manager
www-client/epiphany
dev-python/gnome-python
dev-python/gnome-python-desktop
dev-python/gnome-python-base
dev-python/gnome-python-desktop-base
dev-python/librsvg-python
dev-python/gnome-applets-python
dev-python/libbonobo-python
dev-python/libgnomecanvas-python
dev-python/gnome-media-python
dev-python/gconf-python
dev-python/libwnck-python
dev-python/evolution-python
dev-python/gtksourceview-python
dev-python/libgnomeprint-python
dev-python/metacity-python
dev-python/gnome-desktop-python
dev-python/gnome-keyring-python
dev-python/gnome-keyring-python
dev-python/nautilus-cd-burner-python
dev-python/libgtop-python
dev-python/bug-buddy-python
dev-python/libgnome-python
gnome-extra/gnome-user-docs
gnome-base/libgtop
gnome-base/gnome-volume-manager
gnome-extra/gnome-screensaver
gnome-base/libbonobo
gnome-base/librsvg
app-misc/tomboy
dev-dotnet/dbus-sharp
dev-dotnet/mono-addins
dev-lang/mono
dev-dotnet/libgdiplus
dev-dotnet/dbus-glib-sharp
x11-misc/alacarte
dev-libs/atk
x11-misc/xdg-utils
gnome-base/libbonoboui
gnome-extra/gnome-media
app-text/evince
app-text/libspectre
gnome-extra/gcalctool
app-admin/sabayon
x11-themes/gtk-engines
x11-themes/gnome-backgrounds
x11-libs/cairo
x11-libs/pixman
x11-misc/icon-naming-utils
x11-libs/gtk+
gnome-base/gail
x11-libs/vte


GNOME likes gstreamer, and if you think (like me) A/V stuff should be
up2date, then here is my list for that:
(Personally I prefer mplayer/ffmpeg and the like over gst, but as it
gets installed anyway, then it should be modern :)

dev-python/gst-python
media-libs/gst-plugins-bad
media-libs/gst-plugins-base
media-libs/gst-plugins-good
media-libs/gst-plugins-ugly
media-libs/gstreamer
media-plugins/gst-plugins-a52dec
media-plugins/gst-plugins-alsa
media-plugins/gst-plugins-cdparanoia
media-plugins/gst-plugins-dvb
media-plugins/gst-plugins-dvdread
media-plugins/gst-plugins-faad
media-plugins/gst-plugins-ffmpeg
media-plugins/gst-plugins-flac
media-plugins/gst-plugins-fluendo-mpegdemux
media-plugins/gst-plugins-gconf
media-plugins/gst-plugins-gio
media-plugins/gst-plugins-gnomevfs
media-plugins/gst-plugins-lame
media-plugins/gst-plugins-mad
media-plugins/gst-plugins-meta
media-plugins/gst-plugins-mpeg2dec
media-plugins/gst-plugins-ogg
media-plugins/gst-plugins-pango
media-plugins/gst-plugins-theora
media-plugins/gst-plugins-vorbis
media-plugins/gst-plugins-x
media-plugins/gst-plugins-xvideo
media-plugins/gst-plugins-v4l2


It's to much work to look through my USE flags, so I'm posting all I
have:

USE="-32bit -3dnow -3dnowext -arts -doc -dso -esd -examples -fortran
-gstreamer -qt3support a52 aac aalib acpi alsa apache2 applet archive
autoipd avahi bash-completion bluetooth branding brasero cairo caps
cdaudio cdda cddax cddb cdio cdr cdrkit cleartype config-file consolekit
css connection-sharing cups curl custom-optimization daap dbus
device-mapper dga dhclient dhcp divx dns dts dv dvb dvd dvdr dvdread dvi
eds enca encode exif expat faac faad fam fame fat fbcon fbcondecor
fbsplash ffmpeg flac fontconfig fuse galago gcj gconf gd gedit gif gimp
git glibc-omitfp glitz gmedia gnome gnome-keyring gnutls gs gtk gzip
h323 hal hddtemp http-forms http-server icu id3tag ieee1394 imagemagick
imlib inotify jabber java jpeg kdeenablefinal kernel-patch kpathsea
laptop lcms ldap libass libcaca libnotify lm_sensors lzma lzo mad maps
matroska mdnsresponder-compat milter mjpeg mmap mmx mmxext mng mp3
mplayer mpeg musicbrainz nautilus network networkmanager nntp nsplugin
nss ntfs ntp nuv offensive ogg opengl pch pda pdf pipechan plotutils png
postscript ppds pth pulseaudio qos quicktime quotas ramfs realmedia
reiserfs remote rtsp samba sasl scanner sdl shout sip smp spell sqlite
sse sse2 sse3 sse4.1 ssse3 startup-notification stream subversion svg
taglib tagwriting theora threads tiff truetype udev upnp usb v4l2 vcd
vcdinfo vcdx vorbis wav wmf wmp wps X x264 xattr xfs xinerama xml xmlrpc
xmp xulrunner xv xvid xvmc"

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Daniel Troeder schrieb:
>> Any way to share a meaningful list of gnome-related pkgs to
>> unmask/keyword? Just for starting off here ....
> 
> That's my list of GNOME related packages. Probably some of them are not
> necessary to unmask anymore, and probably I missed some :)
> 
> gnome-extra/nm-applet
> net-misc/networkmanager-vpnc
> net-misc/networkmanager-pptp
> net-misc/networkmanager-openvpn
> net-misc/networkmanager
> gnome-extra/nm-applet

[...]

thanks for the list ... after checking my backups I now added your list,
edited a bit and started emerging.

We'll see ;-)

Stefan

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Stefan G. Weichinger schrieb:

> [...]
> 
> thanks for the list ... after checking my backups I now added your list,
> edited a bit and started emerging.
> 
> We'll see ;-)

looks good so far, around 60 pkgs emerged, gnome 2.26 up and running.
Now I look into the details, pulseaudio-integration and some other pkgs
need to be rebuilt.

Thanks for sharing and encouraging!
Stefan

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Daniel Troeder]

On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 19:15 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
> Stefan G. Weichinger schrieb:
> 
> > [...]
> > 
> > thanks for the list ... after checking my backups I now added your list,
> > edited a bit and started emerging.
> > 
> > We'll see ;-)
> 
> looks good so far, around 60 pkgs emerged, gnome 2.26 up and running.
> Now I look into the details, pulseaudio-integration and some other pkgs
> need to be rebuilt.
> 
> Thanks for sharing and encouraging!
> Stefan

Happy to hear that :)
Yes... PA is a mess... it's really necessary and on the other hand it's
really a mess... there are lots of web sites out there that describe the
way. Still I'm having issues every other day, and I'm never sure if it's
because of PA, alsa, apps or just me... I hope this stabilizes soon.

I'm eagerly looking forward to GNOME 2.30 :D

Have fun :)
Daniel

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Daniel Troeder schrieb:

>> Thanks for sharing and encouraging!
>> Stefan
> 
> Happy to hear that :)
> Yes... PA is a mess... it's really necessary and on the other hand it's
> really a mess... there are lots of web sites out there that describe the
> way. Still I'm having issues every other day, and I'm never sure if it's
> because of PA, alsa, apps or just me... I hope this stabilizes soon.

Same here. After booting no sound ... in PA all looks good, after some
searching I find alsamixer mutes things ... sigh ... but as long as
there aren't more problems I can live with it.

> I'm eagerly looking forward to GNOME 2.30 :D

Glad to have arrived at 2.26 here ;-)

S

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Daniel Troeder]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 595 bytes --]

On Thu, 2009-10-01 at 06:48 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
> Daniel Troeder schrieb:
> Same here. After booting no sound ... in PA all looks good, after some
> searching I find alsamixer mutes things ... sigh ... but as long as
> there aren't more problems I can live with it.
You can set things with alsamixer, and then (save and) restore them on
(re)boot with /etc/init.d/alsasound
Setup is in /etc/conf.d/alsasound.

Bye,
Daniel


-- 
PGP key @ http://pgpkeys.pca.dfn.de/pks/lookup?search=0xBB9D4887&op=get
# gpg --recv-keys --keyserver hkp://subkeys.pgp.net 0xBB9D4887


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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Daniel Troeder schrieb:
> On Thu, 2009-10-01 at 06:48 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
>> Daniel Troeder schrieb:
>> Same here. After booting no sound ... in PA all looks good, after some
>> searching I find alsamixer mutes things ... sigh ... but as long as
>> there aren't more problems I can live with it.
> You can set things with alsamixer, and then (save and) restore them on
> (re)boot with /etc/init.d/alsasound
> Setup is in /etc/conf.d/alsasound.

So I have to have both services running, alsasound AND pulseaudio ?
I assumed I would have to disable alsasound when using PA (and disabled
it ...)

S

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Daniel Troeder]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1089 bytes --]

On Thu, 2009-10-01 at 15:08 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
> Daniel Troeder schrieb:
> > On Thu, 2009-10-01 at 06:48 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
> >> Daniel Troeder schrieb:
> >> Same here. After booting no sound ... in PA all looks good, after some
> >> searching I find alsamixer mutes things ... sigh ... but as long as
> >> there aren't more problems I can live with it.
> > You can set things with alsamixer, and then (save and) restore them on
> > (re)boot with /etc/init.d/alsasound
> > Setup is in /etc/conf.d/alsasound.
> 
> So I have to have both services running, alsasound AND pulseaudio ?
> I assumed I would have to disable alsasound when using PA (and disabled
> it ...)
ALSA is not a service (it's just drivers and API). There is nothing
running. It just loads your configuration (modules and volume levels).
PA on the other hand does not have hardware drivers - it relies on ALSA
or OSS for that.

-- 
PGP key @ http://pgpkeys.pca.dfn.de/pks/lookup?search=0xBB9D4887&op=get
# gpg --recv-keys --keyserver hkp://subkeys.pgp.net 0xBB9D4887


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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Daniel Troeder schrieb:

> ALSA is not a service (it's just drivers and API). There is nothing
> running. It just loads your configuration (modules and volume levels).
> PA on the other hand does not have hardware drivers - it relies on ALSA
> or OSS for that.

thanks, already activated it successfully ;)

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Stefan G. Weichinger schrieb:
> Stefan G. Weichinger schrieb:
> 
>> [...]
>>
>> thanks for the list ... after checking my backups I now added your list,
>> edited a bit and started emerging.

And now this:

http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/gnome/howtos/gnome-2.26-upgrade.xml

;-)

I will check what the removal of those "package.keywords"-entries would
do to my system ...

Stefan

Re: [gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[Albert Hopkins]

On Wed, 2009-09-30 at 00:01 +0200, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote: 
> Without any ranting ... I feel kind of stupid waiting for GNOME 2.26
> going stable within the gentoo-tree while GNOME 2.28 is out now at
> gnome.org.
> 
> Maybe I am too conservative here and could already use 2.26 for a while
> by unmasking lots of packages or doing *something* ...
> 
> Not that I really miss something, it's just that I wonder ... and I
> would like to explore any new features etc ...
> 
> The question:
> 
> Should I wait for bug 263083 to be done?
> 
> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=263083
> 
> Or is there a "safe enough, stable enough" way to get gnome-2.26 onto my
> amd64-desktop without crashing my main workstation every few days?

I haven't found any problems with and I've been running it since it's
been in the tree.  I think most of the problems are banged out when it's
in the overlay so by the time the packages make it to the tree they've
already been tested somewhat.

I've found the easiest way to run a suite of packages marked testing is
to go ahead and put yourself in the testing tree.  It's easier to mask
packages than to unmask testing ones (even though there are tools now
that supposedly help with that) and testing really isn't that unstable.
If/when there are problems (e.g. cups 1.4.1) the workaround is easy:
report a bug if applicable, mask the offending package and downgrade to
the last version that worked.  So come on in. The water's warm :)

-a

Re: [gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[Keith Dart]

=== On Wed, 09/30, Stefan G. Weichinger wrote: ===
> Without any ranting ... I feel kind of stupid waiting for GNOME 2.26
> going stable within the gentoo-tree while GNOME 2.28 is out now at
> gnome.org.

===

Just FYI, I always run unstable (now ~amd64), and rarely have problems,
and those are mostly compile problems related to my particular mix of
USE flags. Those are quickly fixed. Once running, everything has been
stable for me.  I guess that since "unstable" is so stable that no one
is inclined to unmask it for "stable" mask. ;-)

So go for it...

By far the biggest headaches have been all the changes happening in the
Xorg world, but that seems to have stabilized now also. 

But always keep in mind that as a Gentoo user you are your own system's
integrator...



-- Keith Dart

-- 
-- --------------------
Keith Dart
<keith@dartworks.biz>
=======================

Re: [gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Keith Dart schrieb:

> Just FYI, I always run unstable (now ~amd64), and rarely have problems,
> and those are mostly compile problems related to my particular mix of
> USE flags. Those are quickly fixed. Once running, everything has been
> stable for me.  I guess that since "unstable" is so stable that no one
> is inclined to unmask it for "stable" mask. ;-)
> 
> So go for it...
> 
> By far the biggest headaches have been all the changes happening in the
> Xorg world, but that seems to have stabilized now also. 
> 
> But always keep in mind that as a Gentoo user you are your own system's
> integrator...

oh yes ...

Keith, Albert, James, thanks for your replies ...

I will consider trying this although I would prefer not to go completely
~amd64 ... as I am very happy with the overall state of my system ...
you know, the old dilemma :-)

I will look into getting 2.26 soon, thanks.

Stefan

Re: [gentoo-user] gnome 2.26 stable?

[Justin]

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Stefan G. Weichinger schrieb:
> Without any ranting ... I feel kind of stupid waiting for GNOME 2.26
> going stable within the gentoo-tree while GNOME 2.28 is out now at
> gnome.org.
> 
> Maybe I am too conservative here and could already use 2.26 for a while
> by unmasking lots of packages or doing *something* ...
> 
> Not that I really miss something, it's just that I wonder ... and I
> would like to explore any new features etc ...
> 
> The question:
> 
> Should I wait for bug 263083 to be done?
> 
> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=263083
> 
> Or is there a "safe enough, stable enough" way to get gnome-2.26 onto my
> amd64-desktop without crashing my main workstation every few days?
> 
> Again: I appreciate the work of all the gentoo-devs, I am far from being
> able to judge their work. I just ask as I assume that I am missing
> something maybe ...
> 
> Thanks, Stefan.
> 
> 
Gnome herd is hardly working on stabilization. There are some hard
things to solve but they want to get it stable ASAP.


Btw, I am always running a ~gnome and I rarely had problems. They are
really doing a good job.


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