[gentoo-user] VMWare?

[gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Ian K]

Hey all,
I have a friend who is getting a desktop, (high end)
and was wondering if he should VMware under WinXp and
install Gentoo on VMWare. How slow would this be if
any, under an Athlon 64 3000+, and what are general
pros and cons with VMware? He is also thinking of
dualbooting, would that be smarter?
Thanks!
Ian

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[John Jolet]

that's backwards!  install vmware under gentoo, then win xp under vmware.

On Saturday 20 August 2005 22:01, Ian K wrote:
> Hey all,
> I have a friend who is getting a desktop, (high end)
> and was wondering if he should VMware under WinXp and
> install Gentoo on VMWare. How slow would this be if
> any, under an Athlon 64 3000+, and what are general
> pros and cons with VMware? He is also thinking of
> dualbooting, would that be smarter?
> Thanks!
> Ian
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Chad Leigh -- Shire.Net LLC]

On Aug 20, 2005, at 9:01 PM, Ian K wrote:

> Hey all,
> I have a friend who is getting a desktop, (high end)
> and was wondering if he should VMware under WinXp and
> install Gentoo on VMWare. How slow would this be if
> any, under an Athlon 64 3000+,

He should install gentoo and then install XP pro in that instead.   
Probably more stable :-)

> and what are general
> pros and cons with VMware? He is also thinking of
> dualbooting, would that be smarter?

Does he need access to both at the same time?  Then run with VMWare.   
If not, then use dual booting

Chad

> Thanks!
> Ian
>
> __________________________________________________
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>
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales]

I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
much damage.

As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free. I
never tested it, but I hear it is a great emulator. Plex86, the free
software counter-part, is still under development. So it is really
young and probably has less funcionalities. I don't know any other
options.

If he really wants a Unix-like enviroment running on Windows, I think
it will be easier to install CygWin..

2005/8/21, John Jolet <john@jolet.net>:
> that's backwards!  install vmware under gentoo, then win xp under vmware.
> 
> On Saturday 20 August 2005 22:01, Ian K wrote:
> > Hey all,
> > I have a friend who is getting a desktop, (high end)
> > and was wondering if he should VMware under WinXp and
> > install Gentoo on VMWare. How slow would this be if
> > any, under an Athlon 64 3000+, and what are general
> > pros and cons with VMware? He is also thinking of
> > dualbooting, would that be smarter?
> > Thanks!
> > Ian
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> 
> --
> John Jolet
> Your On-Demand IT Department
> 512-762-0729
> www.jolet.net
> john@jolet.net
> --
> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> 
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Michael Crute]

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I personally run it the "right way" if there is such a thing. Gentoo with 
VMware 5 installed on the computer and XP Pro installed inside of VMware. 
For what little I need Windoze VMware works wonders. It runs most Windows 
apps (including the OS) almost faster than it runs naively. I haven't tried 
it the other way around (VMware installed on top of Windoze) but I can 
imagine that it runs far slower on Windoze than it does on Gentoo. As far as 
my experience running VMware on Gentoo I have nothing but good experiences. 
The only downside is the licensing cost to get a copy of VMware.

-Mike

On 8/20/05, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales <raphael.melo21@gmail.com> 
wrote:
> 
> I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
> run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
> much damage.
> 
> As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
> licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free. I
> never tested it, but I hear it is a great emulator. Plex86, the free
> software counter-part, is still under development. So it is really
> young and probably has less funcionalities. I don't know any other
> options.
> 
> If he really wants a Unix-like enviroment running on Windows, I think
> it will be easier to install CygWin..
> 
> 2005/8/21, John Jolet <john@jolet.net>:
> > that's backwards! install vmware under gentoo, then win xp under vmware.
> >
> > On Saturday 20 August 2005 22:01, Ian K wrote:
> > > Hey all,
> > > I have a friend who is getting a desktop, (high end)
> > > and was wondering if he should VMware under WinXp and
> > > install Gentoo on VMWare. How slow would this be if
> > > any, under an Athlon 64 3000+, and what are general
> > > pros and cons with VMware? He is also thinking of
> > > dualbooting, would that be smarter?
> > > Thanks!
> > > Ian
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do You Yahoo!?
> > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> > --
> > John Jolet
> > Your On-Demand IT Department
> > 512-762-0729
> > www.jolet.net <http://www.jolet.net>
> > john@jolet.net
> > --
> > gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> >
> >
> 
> --
> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> 
> 


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________________________________
Michael E. Crute
Software Developer
SoftGroup Development Corporation

Linux, because reboots are for installing hardware.
"In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates?"

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Marco Matthies]

Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales wrote:
> As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
> licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free. I
> never tested it, but I hear it is a great emulator. Plex86, the free
> software counter-part, is still under development. So it is really
> young and probably has less funcionalities. I don't know any other
> options.

You may also want to try qemu (LGPL) and the acceleration kernel module 
kqemu, which makes qemu quite competetive with vmware (but is sadly not 
open-source).
http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/

Plex86 apparently can only run a patched linux guest os at the moment:
http://plex86.sourceforge.net/
http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_id=7762667&forum_id=26580

Marco
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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:46:20 -0300, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
wrote:

> I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
> run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
> much damage.

That's how I do it and it works well. I very rarely use VMWare for
Windows, mainly for testing on different Linux distros. It runs virtually
as fast as native hardware, apart from a slight reduction in disk speed
from the virtual disks.

VMWare 5 is very nice, and runs much better on amd64 than the 4.x series.

> As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
> licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free.

That's hardly an issue if he's going to run Windows with it :-O


-- 
Neil Bothwick

A friend of mine sent me a postcard with a satellite photo of the
entire planet on it, and on the back he wrote, "Wish you were here."

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Sandy McGuffog]

I too run VMWare 5 on XP (as well as a dual boot installation) and can
confirm it runs at near native speeds.

Be aware however that there is an issue with the clock on 2.4 series
kernels - due to the changes made to run at 1000Hz, you will find that
Gentoo's clock no longer keeps perfect time. This problem can be
improved, but not completely solved, by (a) recompiling the kernel to
run at a lower clock and (b) running the VMWare toolkit, which has a
clock "helper"

On 8/21/05, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:46:20 -0300, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
> wrote:
> 
> > I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
> > run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
> > much damage.
> 
> That's how I do it and it works well. I very rarely use VMWare for
> Windows, mainly for testing on different Linux distros. It runs virtually
> as fast as native hardware, apart from a slight reduction in disk speed
> from the virtual disks.
> 
> VMWare 5 is very nice, and runs much better on amd64 than the 4.x series.
> 
> > As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
> > licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free.
> 
> That's hardly an issue if he's going to run Windows with it :-O
> 
> 
> --
> Neil Bothwick
> 
> A friend of mine sent me a postcard with a satellite photo of the
> entire planet on it, and on the back he wrote, "Wish you were here."
> 
> 
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Greg Shikhman]

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The only issue with running WinXP inside a virtual environment is it becomes 
useless for gaming (making windows COMPLETELY useless) because VMWare 
doesn't have support for DirectX.

On 8/21/05, Sandy McGuffog <mcguffogl@gmail.com> wrote: 
> 
> I too run VMWare 5 on XP (as well as a dual boot installation) and can
> confirm it runs at near native speeds.
> 
> Be aware however that there is an issue with the clock on 2.4 series
> kernels - due to the changes made to run at 1000Hz, you will find that
> Gentoo's clock no longer keeps perfect time. This problem can be
> improved, but not completely solved, by (a) recompiling the kernel to
> run at a lower clock and (b) running the VMWare toolkit, which has a
> clock "helper"
> 
> On 8/21/05, Neil Bothwick <neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> > On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:46:20 -0300, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos 
> Sales
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
> > > run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
> > > much damage.
> >
> > That's how I do it and it works well. I very rarely use VMWare for
> > Windows, mainly for testing on different Linux distros. It runs 
> virtually
> > as fast as native hardware, apart from a slight reduction in disk speed
> > from the virtual disks.
> >
> > VMWare 5 is very nice, and runs much better on amd64 than the 4.xseries.
> >
> > > As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a
> > > licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free.
> >
> > That's hardly an issue if he's going to run Windows with it :-O
> >
> >
> > --
> > Neil Bothwick
> >
> > A friend of mine sent me a postcard with a satellite photo of the
> > entire planet on it, and on the back he wrote, "Wish you were here."
> >
> >
> >
> 
> --
> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> 
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Michael Crute]

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Well you can still run Photoshop. :-D

-Mike

On 8/21/05, Greg Shikhman <cornmander@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> The only issue with running WinXP inside a virtual environment is it 
> becomes useless for gaming (making windows COMPLETELY useless) because 
> VMWare doesn't have support for DirectX.
> 
> On 8/21/05, Sandy McGuffog <mcguffogl@gmail.com> wrote: 
> > 
> > I too run VMWare 5 on XP (as well as a dual boot installation) and can
> > confirm it runs at near native speeds. 
> > 
> > Be aware however that there is an issue with the clock on 2.4 series
> > kernels - due to the changes made to run at 1000Hz, you will find that
> > Gentoo's clock no longer keeps perfect time. This problem can be
> > improved, but not completely solved, by (a) recompiling the kernel to
> > run at a lower clock and (b) running the VMWare toolkit, which has a
> > clock "helper"
> > 
> > On 8/21/05, Neil Bothwick < neil@digimed.co.uk> wrote:
> > > On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:46:20 -0300, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos 
> > Sales
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
> > > > run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
> > > > much damage.
> > >
> > > That's how I do it and it works well. I very rarely use VMWare for
> > > Windows, mainly for testing on different Linux distros. It runs 
> > virtually 
> > > as fast as native hardware, apart from a slight reduction in disk 
> > speed
> > > from the virtual disks.
> > >
> > > VMWare 5 is very nice, and runs much better on amd64 than the 4.xseries.
> > >
> > > > As for comments on VMWare, it isn't free software and you need a 
> > > > licence key. Some purists don't like the fact that it isn't free.
> > >
> > > That's hardly an issue if he's going to run Windows with it :-O
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Neil Bothwick
> > >
> > > A friend of mine sent me a postcard with a satellite photo of the 
> > > entire planet on it, and on the back he wrote, "Wish you were here."
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > 
> > --
> > gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> > 
> > 
> 


-- 
________________________________
Michael E. Crute
Software Developer
SoftGroup Development Corporation

Linux, because reboots are for installing hardware.
"In a world without walls and fences, who needs windows and gates?"

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Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Richard Fish]

Neil Bothwick wrote:

>On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 00:46:20 -0300, Raphael Melo de Oliveira Bastos Sales
>wrote:
>
>  
>
>>I agree with John. It is better to have a robust system (Gentoo) and
>>run the bad one (Windows) on user space (via VMWare) so it can't do
>>much damage.
>>    
>>
>
>That's how I do it and it works well. I very rarely use VMWare for
>Windows, mainly for testing on different Linux distros. It runs virtually
>as fast as native hardware, apart from a slight reduction in disk speed
>from the virtual disks.
>
>VMWare 5 is very nice, and runs much better on amd64 than the 4.x series.
>
>  
>

I've done this both ways with Workstation 4.5.  Using Windows as the 
host OS is a good choice if you want every single piece of hardware to 
"just work".  I never had a problem with speed (only with the clock, as 
someone else mentioned), except for compiling.  The virtual machine 
memory bandwidth seems to be significantly reduced compared to native, 
by maybe as much as 50%, which made compiling take quite a bit longer.  
Maybe this is improved in WS5, although I can't really say, because now 
I run the "right way" (TM).

One possibility is to setup the system as a dual-boot system, and give 
yourself the choice of running Gentoo from within VMWare or natively.

-Richard

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RE: [gentoo-user] VMWare?

[Daevid Vincent]

 This is exactly what I do. I run VMWare on XP and I just use the raw
partition for gentoo. The beauty is that when I really need to be native in
gentoo for some reason (maybe for kismet or something hardware related), I
just dual-boot into it. It's very slick. And it's pretty f'n awesome to be
able to run BOTH OSs at the SAME TIME.

D.Vin

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Richard Fish [mailto:bigfish@asmallpond.org] 
> Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 11:21 PM
> To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] VMWare?
> 
> > One possibility is to setup the system as a dual-boot system, 
> and give 
> yourself the choice of running Gentoo from within VMWare or natively.

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