From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4942D138334 for ; Sun, 9 Dec 2018 22:42:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8A69FE09F8; Sun, 9 Dec 2018 22:42:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-yw1-xc2c.google.com (mail-yw1-xc2c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BC520E08FF for ; Sun, 9 Dec 2018 22:42:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-yw1-xc2c.google.com with SMTP id i20so3250223ywc.5 for ; Sun, 09 Dec 2018 14:42:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=XD8R+oCRsSE/O/tNaNSIR5tQ5IC5RRvl+YpfcMJQ1I4=; b=cB/k+RQ5sEyUwsbDzqkgeLpDSbkZGkCpFvdxDvc/ZIC1lEdRV7zgcbB8Q6LznfTBwc lPk80++RpLM8KJlM8wHrupey0/DETdPL3GvexE5I54KJMsn+2iQpJ4zznRjKyDgpxDlH 5BHIOoLbJgKv974PBpecPRkvytVg7XXDXsQQz7M5Jt0EhBb4yAfTB15a6uOAe4LmBJ0V RlSIZT0NeRLaW9Zv0AIPuY4Ks3eyg33IyPtQYuFJvyypo1TvDlamzO/cmyaebYcFtqeS tWiugGVF83zZMVZhWaGqd0k/LH8DCRtZqPfJZM77DD71Q3UqXYPGN4S/oDbh11FH8pk/ J/xw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=XD8R+oCRsSE/O/tNaNSIR5tQ5IC5RRvl+YpfcMJQ1I4=; b=eXsfldRPlSq+SDwzxmExnrq7gdCZCK/pOL8sRBTKgo2R7KQ5DDLXuzcj1ROZ88L7zI sSb/TEt4GvZCPpg5aYSVCMzZc4XPhIAYNE5XRLrbMfp1IwvynmpnBV3bWl6S7HALOQXr +yW6Gj6n18j9ZWSt8ag2DAiKNyb5EOty7Jc5K44fZ8k75/nnfyQ38j99WAB6HvUXz4h6 5pVZnUmS/IzveRk/ljc4PQD6Y7XpcoEVlo+Mm3RECW8gUZo0Ycsaas5nnec4/CGY4uTS 9c3+2Bpiz7InyqCMmqTe4UjXeCzILom+bvOoTnVr+RlYuIesMpsB8jHD+3aTrWVTM71H +iDw== X-Gm-Message-State: AA+aEWa1jT3wrnvG5TjyB8qRaQT/2nT7YEaTVUHeJfF7kDTVQmsBeD5x lIUy3zTyWn7CKse/BaZCWog= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AFSGD/UXlu1QgMeoAHk+s4X2rNRAU3BHhkQYYn5Agcz0ir23HpL8NWjNV4ZnhBgWikad4U9HDL1jxg== X-Received: by 2002:a81:3051:: with SMTP id w78mr10287456yww.236.1544395320715; Sun, 09 Dec 2018 14:42:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.2.5] (adsl-74-240-55-188.jan.bellsouth.net. [74.240.55.188]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 139sm3176563ywt.78.2018.12.09.14.41.56 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 09 Dec 2018 14:41:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: CPU upgrade and LVM questions. To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org References: <492d8bf4-4b8d-f7f6-05d8-2473b6825fab@gmail.com> <6651f356-8831-1d49-6d1e-adbe9d337b74@charter.net> <234e7289-0372-64de-5a94-d1aa82c7d40b@charter.net> <288c83f0-70a5-98ec-b082-d575239f0c03@gmail.com> <0456c03c-8a4b-17b9-b062-e42580ed531f@gmail.com> From: Dale Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=rdalek1967@gmail.com; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= xsFNBFpEtdQBEADI51WaryP3FJlDfmCQx2aPQpSppEKxqWhCTA8KFEcOVFmIIfiFAeekqMMD mhUxgZTtlQh7dsNqha6ioaYDqGKTv7oeJlPJw4hmIMJX3WYVSOHlsJUNM2jpDIAFeEKfup/T zDzFpuU2Qtr/Y0ji35wHyOAZLRckeNk705oRvE9wqi6noTP15Gxmw/U6aMzEfvu+wGEfCjgs 9bERmu+CS75PZEaFAv8RnsXUv1UcvQ45jmk/8ni/ogxE2h53OIp6c/hOlgJkSVRQWPZZyKZw lDiSUKCtMXPMdZ9w0X6RltQxtIQXO0KxAKaAp+tnL8z+0piafF5uW4RIglhT922RXKxxdZyx SjRgtE4V1IPtUcwPAeqVUZw2P1b4pjfPv7tNtMoFsIiY0ZnT+ua4ps6KOUeocRPKAX14mZkL jt/sZM7aIKiwyoteshRgWNNkxh4OiSxGCRUKNQI8M42cRSidvJZ6SGZXM3WpV28RPyF7+0Ba 0stEQwBGNF8uxgytY9rOJ7obmIpEZKx1p3W1O1hadOjBo2110jMDirRXtktMDfBDvVKkOZ06 vLu16uZLb0O52euhl2dMcEI3ZoCAFTKtdwMITIDj1TcMBZar6+bcwOicSFFogOLHQLJZRO5q I5szOIYW7+c0yNqPRLT3Sq7HzDyuyTUjmPZSAcqOwzX8GwUFkwARAQABzRtEYWxlIDxyZGFs ZWsxOTY3QGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwZQEEwEIAD4WIQSUDVlCt0m0Z/PsCaxgB5lCagHqugUCWkS1 1AIbIwUJCWYBgAULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAKCRBgB5lCagHqurR7D/45/q20 vXdrJGxrkNphotmlBtTpNbVauu5A2NDv3E1Il6yqRBfh4Xw7xFuwhz9DqThuvByU6566vr0z 7oVCK33dxRm4WA7YaogRQZy4VVIbHdrksnh2f702CFllqtn5Y29M2JtXG5jiiL3aZNEhoyP9 eMtzLPGs56yZ3eMkz4U7DEmWCAUr8bbuXW+eq/A0V5djcFdHfmanuDZSxzg+cZTpVOLolS2b pmNsPTSMkJ2MDY2Kfdg3gPhSaawo2agQfgnf9E7vSm7z/rlk8bBUWcPAP/XTN9ndVwOO3x74 EQv/M4EiCTtNpw3yapVZI2NhA1wqW648D7RxIPD8Y3nkJVDS4x5g54xDe1IUFOtVUSDAh+vY wUJt7vgbCeRjyT8XbuGW9RokIos3ALNaPoq/FDNEqefbmop0CPRih6aLFHWT4YBA6xQjLJuP LSNvalNqE5mef0giCtnLxo/lkjnP9Sv+t/5VSHda5zkVuN0+2w46SbGvXIHRkSoSi6XH3ccq KayJC+oTqo4xf9J30c7CV4rEcYnJcnxMw0vcYmU3DwjGfKxuKcLHgPr9mDNWvhteroA5wNWw NzQ72yAj7rsZVUXCxZgiPldSH3SXZJ/Jo6E9JouzQgRb/I4Vy4jx0Yw8rJLDx/ha82fn+FVe cFbiodVV5UD0inw488IAAtJE+Zi0t87BTQRaRLXUARAA38iHcF7M7GnkS73dazdLBgz2YJsu fpix/N/x4CvoHMqTuwi4ASz1WroYjl3KajeH0DSybyPdEQ7nffxIUt48deT3j/rwsJkPRvCF BpmcwxErd/Mbq0BgikYxXvO68aEAs4jBDR26YtONfjobEfd+Juhxci9UN9vTOCgSPhY+dxHs MZ0gHRzvMnpM3o3+oht/XRZr05RQx83DvTIqWnjDQlCseYYlbFp+rFTZi7ro71ULDThfCE0p +f+IQ3zX0cRKOcJGtNRvyWH6PxmN4td6Q7gPHfAsFPLsCpg7nZwOejtAktPejtSEXlN6QOKv bmRQxNtzgMtjzJNNJW2NtBz0DIW394+9stchQRKLqH8n8GnB6tlkfPg4vgf/kq14QQSZcb0F M36wk+i1Hk+TWYWbOBoUw9+X941Pw1JnglJ3tzpBh+36+pdG02Lbm2v6SaZ69zkDfzJ2Sfhb E+KQLibLkiCOhuSDLDWUgUeb0lJ/0qlo3vcQMTBuG5eiWiwBkp4C+ACb1f1Akq0mFvim+gCJ qJOTu0IDK9DjKLKglA3Z6sbeepnXq8fxB2Mo/SFSYEsGqUu4MLxgwnPg7zi+rKg7MhqdiBBE fqugmNguCEYZjJrGCCzwuqPXAZAcyzEYTGFKwI6NdEZ6v8Xc3om9MJomB3y1uzG6K7T9ue5H aw/2aqEAEQEAAcLBfAQYAQgAJhYhBJQNWUK3SbRn8+wJrGAHmUJqAeq6BQJaRLXUAhsMBQkJ ZgGAAAoJEGAHmUJqAeq6/ykP/ib6xEHednaXvzZvvj854PB5ffBqKkphbf51g6pxPvFBWMwY E7Bu/kq8e3hkp3rzX42BjqiUmfEe2OyfZCabXLybP8i/QRkHTzD5nLoIYLeL+62N/WQFW1NU VhqdfQbMhphNgP1mvG2Ib5R6S+Fb+vkw776oq6jLwUBP/o6PPpp62GyvFvFb9ekxV9+sE4yG V3DTqURBY+aXfc/MTzlCXp4u4QzFW9odfcb/kb9f1m/gZbWGihAqeMd1HViXQoMzTx6IuP13 eQAkKj4FlA2QMzbEOOKO6fliSt1JweJoh0OLCEAM/3q+LaflMvvjhl9ht00IUT/ySj3/dZdf EdTpuUAtnC3A3flwgK/aetkkOhrkx9hx4SKn6UHtAl+eCqP1Mae+nWzkisBL0/hBPEz713md 5I+4Y4QjIokRiz/5l/TFwpGu26zmDfDUkZmxZR/iNCW0VAmZE2YdyRm3PYcFcVXuZ1f/ff0D us9xGsO8V6F5EIwx/9Y6AWQdW7PoKHA21ri93PoRgjv+QoOifXEkhJwTKg5k5b1Tr7h9eRU/ Se2XigPVODjrN9FRfkx/JxlJcCs/igGJS05BmiZNIIRDKBGdXy/Fj5HQB2q5v5DfvrLMNTwK Aa8pn/em1SKC/l9aV9ygpN+cQPKoQjGxPPaId/rwX+GVxKl2vakjHLPLQmm3 Message-ID: <3043e118-dd8d-2ba8-d93a-84fd30a564f6@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2018 16:41:53 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0 SeaMonkey/2.49.9.1 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------60FE0013B5F89FFF9A23CB7B" X-Archives-Salt: 430b5923-0c86-4c2c-8463-4675d9a1d431 X-Archives-Hash: b25ce7d2d36324cac8e747300101e4e3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------60FE0013B5F89FFF9A23CB7B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit J. Roeleveld wrote: > On December 9, 2018 6:23:07 PM UTC, "Taiidan@gmx.com" > wrote: > > On 12/07/2018 06:47 PM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote: > > On 07/12/2018 09:30, Dale wrote: > > Nikos Chantziaras wrote: > > If you want to see all of the installed packages that > are affected, you need to set CPU_FLAGS_X86 to an > empty string:    CPU_FLAGS_X86="" and then do "emerge > -puDN --with-bdeps=y @world". This is because > CPU_FLAGS_X86 is not empty by default. It contains sse > and sse2 by default, because these are supported by > all 64-bit CPUs. > > What I did, I commented out the whole line and ran it that > way. > > If you comment it out, it will have default values. If you set > it to an empty string, you should be able to see which > packages make use of the default flags (like sse and sse2.) > Note it's a pretend emerge (-p). Just to check which packages > you have installed that make use of these flags. > > One last question for anyone who has done this recently.  > When finished, I'll have a FX-8350 CPU with 8 cores at > 4.0/4.2GHz, 32GBs of memory all on a Gigabyte 970 series > mobo.  Would there be any point in upgrading to a whole > new rig or is what I have about as fast is reasonable to > build? I don't do gaming or anything.  Even the GTX 650 > video card is likely overkill for what I do here.  The > older 200 series card is working just fine.  On one hand, > my current build is several years old.  On the other, > computers seem to have reached their peak.  I'm sure there > is more powerful systems out there but would I be any > better off with one? > > > Since the AM3+ and its C32/G34 Opteron counterparts are the last and > best x86 cpus without ME/PSP I would say you are better off with what > you have - the best piledriver cpus like the FX-8350+ are still able to > play the latest games and in a VM via IOMMU-GFX if you want. > > In any case I would consider a OpenPOWER (ppc64/ppc64le) arch system > (like the blackbird or talos 2) as an upgrade path instead of any futher > x86 stuff as there aren't any black boxes, there is > documentation+firmware sources and the cpus are made in usa. > > > Made in USA isn't necessarily a good thing when talking about not > wanting any hidden back doors. > Not sure which country would be a reliable location though, I wouldn't > trust Western European countries either. > > -- > Joost > -- > Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. I have to say, this is something I thought about.  While some newer CPUs have even been talked about on this list, I don't recall this one being included, or the one I currently use.  Given its age, I would think it would be exposed if it was hackable or had a backdoor, but one never knows.  As to country it was made in, I don't trust any of them really.  The NSA is just as bad at snooping as any other country.  Well, some such as China may be worse but if it has a backdoor, it has a backdoor.  If one Govt or group knows about it, they all will at some point and will exploit it for their own means.  I might add, this is why I'd love to see encryption done by a group that is not infiltrated by a Govt agency, education system etc and is open source the the point that a backdoor is impossible.  That would be a very tall order tho.  Sometimes people with bad intentions get in despite all the effort to exclude them.  This is one reason I'm considering splitting off certain directories that are encrypted.  Thing is, is there one that isn't already hackable by groups such as the NSA or folks in China etc??  Would we really ever know if they could or not??  Dale :-)  :-)  --------------60FE0013B5F89FFF9A23CB7B Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
J. Roeleveld wrote:
On December 9, 2018 6:23:07 PM UTC, "Taiidan@gmx.com" <Taiidan@gmx.com> wrote: 
On 12/07/2018 06:47 PM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

On 07/12/2018 09:30, Dale wrote:

Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

 If you want to see all of the installed packages that are affected,
 you need to set CPU_FLAGS_X86 to an empty string:

    CPU_FLAGS_X86=""

 and then do "emerge -puDN --with-bdeps=y @world". This is because
 CPU_FLAGS_X86 is not empty by default. It contains sse and sse2 by
 default, because these are supported by all 64-bit CPUs.



 What I did, I commented out the whole line and ran it that way.


If you comment it out, it will have default values. If you set it to an
empty string, you should be able to see which packages make use of the
default flags (like sse and sse2.)

Note it's a pretend emerge (-p). Just to check which packages you have
installed that make use of these flags.



One last question for anyone who has done this recently.  When finished,
I'll have a FX-8350 CPU with 8 cores at 4.0/4.2GHz, 32GBs of memory all
on a Gigabyte 970 series mobo.  Would there be any point in upgrading to
a whole new rig or is what I have about as fast is reasonable to build?
I don't do gaming or anything.  Even the GTX 650 video card is likely
overkill for what I do here.  The older 200 series card is working just
fine.  On one hand, my current build is several years old.  On the
other, computers seem to have reached their peak.  I'm sure there is
more powerful systems out there but would I be any better off with one?


Since the AM3+ and its C32/G34 Opteron counterparts are the last and
best x86 cpus without ME/PSP I would say you are better off with what
you have - the best piledriver cpus like the FX-8350+ are still able to
play the latest games and in a VM via IOMMU-GFX if you want.

In any case I would consider a OpenPOWER (ppc64/ppc64le) arch system
(like the blackbird or talos 2) as an upgrade path instead of any futher
x86 stuff as there aren't any black boxes, there is
documentation+firmware sources and the cpus are made in usa.

Made in USA isn't necessarily a good thing when talking about not wanting any hidden back doors.
Not sure which country would be a reliable location though, I wouldn't trust Western European countries either.

--
Joost
--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.


I have to say, this is something I thought about.  While some newer CPUs have even been talked about on this list, I don't recall this one being included, or the one I currently use.  Given its age, I would think it would be exposed if it was hackable or had a backdoor, but one never knows.  As to country it was made in, I don't trust any of them really.  The NSA is just as bad at snooping as any other country.  Well, some such as China may be worse but if it has a backdoor, it has a backdoor.  If one Govt or group knows about it, they all will at some point and will exploit it for their own means. 

I might add, this is why I'd love to see encryption done by a group that is not infiltrated by a Govt agency, education system etc and is open source the the point that a backdoor is impossible.  That would be a very tall order tho.  Sometimes people with bad intentions get in despite all the effort to exclude them. 

This is one reason I'm considering splitting off certain directories that are encrypted.  Thing is, is there one that isn't already hackable by groups such as the NSA or folks in China etc??  Would we really ever know if they could or not?? 

Dale

:-)  :-) 
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