From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1R4UIG-0002tG-M0 for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 09:01:08 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2765121C211; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 09:00:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtpq3.gn.mail.iss.as9143.net (smtpq3.gn.mail.iss.as9143.net [212.54.34.166]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B31A21C068 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 08:59:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [212.54.34.150] (helo=smtp18.gn.mail.iss.as9143.net) by smtpq3.gn.mail.iss.as9143.net with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R4UH7-0005pG-OE for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:57 +0200 Received: from 5ed027a1.cm-7-1a.dynamic.ziggo.nl ([94.208.39.161] helo=data.antarean.org) by smtp18.gn.mail.iss.as9143.net with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1R4UGf-0002tz-H7 for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:29 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by data.antarean.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 395F6CFA for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:43 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antarean.org Received: from data.antarean.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (data.antarean.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x91LqObnwuw6 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from eve.localnet (eve.lan.antarean.org [10.20.13.50]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by data.antarean.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6A79E635 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:41 +0200 (CEST) From: Joost Roeleveld To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2011 10:59:26 +0200 Message-ID: <2584650.Gi816EnIAc@eve> User-Agent: KMail/4.7.1 (Linux/2.6.36-gentoo-r5; KDE/4.7.1; x86_64; ; ) In-Reply-To: References: <20110912150248.GB3599@acm.acm> <73132955.y04H0sY5km@eve> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-ZiggoSMTP-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-ZiggoSMTP-MailScanner-ID: 1R4UGf-0002tz-H7 X-ZiggoSMTP-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-ZiggoSMTP-MailScanner-SpamCheck: geen spam, SpamAssassin (niet cached, score=-0.692, vereist 5, BAYES_00 -1.90, KHOP_DYNAMIC 0.73, RDNS_DYNAMIC 0.98, RP_MATCHES_RCVD -0.50) X-ZiggoSMTP-MailScanner-From: joost@antarean.org X-Spam-Status: No X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 006c5c3ece0712c998d39ea783419d80 On Thursday, September 15, 2011 05:38:41 PM Canek Pel=E1ez Vald=E9s wro= te: > On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 5:30 PM, Joost Roeleveld = wrote: > > On Thursday, September 15, 2011 03:04:37 PM Canek Pel=E1ez Vald=E9s= wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 1:59 PM, Mick = wrote: > >> > On Thursday 15 Sep 2011 16:13:26 Michael Schreckenbauer wrote: > >> > 1. The minimal initramfs will only need to be built once (and > >> > rarely > >> > rebuilt thereafter). This removes one of my fears and it was a > >> > main > >> > objection for me - I would hate to have to rebuild initramfs eve= ry > >> > time I roll a new kernel, or libs and what not of fs happen to b= e > >> > udpated, etc. > >>=20 > >> In my experience, it takes more time to build the kernel than it t= akes > >> to rebuild the initramfs. And if you choose to use dracut, the pro= cess > >> is automatic (you always call dracut with the same options, unless= you > >> suddenly add LVM or something similar). > >=20 > > Canek, as you've been using dracut already extensively, is it possi= ble > > to set default options/modules/whatever to get to the situation whe= re > > simply running "dracut" without any extra options will always recre= ate > > the correct initramfs? > The modules get defined by the DRACUT_MODULES variable, which is > use-expanded. The options are configured in /etc/dracut.conf, but I > believe there are some command line options not configurable. The developers suggested I try dracut and I do intend to do that. My problem is, the one most likely affected by this is also the one I w= ant to=20 experiment the least with. Guess I'll have to test this inside a VM. > >> I didn't use an initramfs for my first years using Gentoo. Since I= > >> started to use media-gfx/splashutils a couple of years ago, every = time > >> I upgraded my kernel, I splash_geninitramfs'd my initramfs. Now I = do > >> the same, but with plymouth and systemd using dracut. It's just pa= rt > >> of the process of getting a new kernel. > >=20 > > And, if the initramfs has other tools in it, after every emerge of = these > > tools. This is where I see a possible cause for failure as then the= > > situation arises where the initramfs will still start "correctly", = but > > because it's using older tools it's possible that older versions an= d > > new versions start running simultaneously and get mixed up in a way= > > that is not immediately apparent. >=20 > I see it the other way around: you ensure that your initramfs is in > sync with your system. In other words: the initramfs contains a subse= t > of your normal installation. That is why it makes redundant /lib, > /sbin and /bin. The reason I ditched lilo when grub came out was because I always would= forget=20 to run the lilo-command. (Another was that lilo wouldn't work on a new=20= machine, but that's not important) The same will be true for dracut. And probably not just for me. The on-disk-format may stay the same and the tools (am thinking LVM her= e)=20 should always be able to find my filesystems. But, what if the initramf= s does=20 the fsck with older tools? Currently, the fsck runs before actually mounting the filesystems. If t= he=20 filesystems end up being pre-mounted, when will fsck run and which vers= ion? -- Joost