[gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Walter Dnes]

  I'm doing an AMD64 no-multilib install to a laptop with 6 gigs of ram.
I haven't done one in a while and it looks strange.  I notice that the
initial make.conf is...

########################################################################
# These settings were set by the catalyst build script that automatically
# built this stage.
# Please consult /usr/share/portage/config/make.conf.example for a more
# detailed example.
COMMON_FLAGS="-O2 -pipe"
CFLAGS="${COMMON_FLAGS}"
CXXFLAGS="${COMMON_FLAGS}"
FCFLAGS="${COMMON_FLAGS}"
FFLAGS="${COMMON_FLAGS}"

# NOTE: This stage was built with the bindist Use flag enabled
PORTDIR="/var/db/repos/gentoo"
DISTDIR="/var/cache/distfiles"
PKGDIR="/var/cache/binpkgs"

# This sets the language of build output to English.
# Please keep this setting intact when reporting bugs.
LC_MESSAGES=C
########################################################################

  I downloaded and used install-amd64-minimal-20190731T214503Z.iso and
stage3-amd64-nomultilib-20190731T214503Z.tar.xz which looks correct.
I'll insert CHOST and MAKEOPTS to play safe.  Any other gotchas in
recent installs?

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org>
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Sat, 3 Aug 2019 00:24:51 -0400, Walter Dnes wrote:

> # NOTE: This stage was built with the bindist Use flag enabled
> PORTDIR="/var/db/repos/gentoo"
> DISTDIR="/var/cache/distfiles"
> PKGDIR="/var/cache/binpkgs"

Hooray! They've changed the default locations to something more sensible.
Keeping data in /usr never made sense, I switched PORTDIR to /var/portage
years ago. Keeping tarballs inside the portage tree made even less sense.

I suspect agreement that change was needed was fairly quick, followed by
years of bikeshedding about where to move them ;-)


-- 
Neil Bothwick

Ask a silly person, get a silly answer

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[gentoo-user] Re: Recent changes to install procedure

[Ian Zimmerman]

On 2019-08-03 07:56, Neil Bothwick wrote:

> Hooray! They've changed the default locations to something more
> sensible.  Keeping data in /usr never made sense, I switched PORTDIR
> to /var/portage years ago. Keeping tarballs inside the portage tree
> made even less sense.

I tried to do that some time ago, but I've run into some issues.  It
looked like not all of the tools honored the PORTDIR variable.

So instead, I just made /usr/portage a separate filesystem.

-- 
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if you also post the followup to the list or newsgroup.
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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Recent changes to install procedure

[Dale]

Ian Zimmerman wrote:
> On 2019-08-03 07:56, Neil Bothwick wrote:
>
>> Hooray! They've changed the default locations to something more
>> sensible.  Keeping data in /usr never made sense, I switched PORTDIR
>> to /var/portage years ago. Keeping tarballs inside the portage tree
>> made even less sense.
> I tried to do that some time ago, but I've run into some issues.  It
> looked like not all of the tools honored the PORTDIR variable.
>
> So instead, I just made /usr/portage a separate filesystem.
>


Do you know what tools those were?  I moved mine years ago and I don't
recall any tools having issues. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 

[gentoo-user] Re: Recent changes to install procedure

[Ian Zimmerman]

On 2019-08-03 11:31, Dale wrote:

> Do you know what tools those were?

Sorry, I don't remember.  I'll be sure to post here if I encounter the
same kind of problem.

-- 
Please don't Cc: me privately on mailing lists and Usenet,
if you also post the followup to the list or newsgroup.
To reply privately _only_ on Usenet and on broken lists
which rewrite From, fetch the TXT record for no-use.mooo.com.

Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Recent changes to install procedure

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Sat, 3 Aug 2019 10:10:47 -0700, Ian Zimmerman wrote:

> > Do you know what tools those were?  
> 
> Sorry, I don't remember.  I'll be sure to post here if I encounter the
> same kind of problem.

I've not had any problems wither, but at least one program complains if
/etc/portage/make.conf is a directory, despite that being declared valid
in the docs.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

"You want us to do WHAT?" - Ancient Chinese wall engineer.

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Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Walter Dnes]

On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 12:24:51AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote

> I'll insert CHOST and MAKEOPTS to play safe.  Any other gotchas in
> recent installs?

  So far so good. The basic system is installed and booting.  One
question... can I just set the "bindist" USE flag globally.  On a basic
text install (Xorg not installed yet) in package.use I've already set...

dev-libs/openssl bindist
net-misc/openssh bindist
net-wireless/iw bindist
net-wireless/wpa_supplicant bindist

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org>
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Dale]

Walter Dnes wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 12:24:51AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote
>
>> I'll insert CHOST and MAKEOPTS to play safe.  Any other gotchas in
>> recent installs?
>   So far so good. The basic system is installed and booting.  One
> question... can I just set the "bindist" USE flag globally.  On a basic
> text install (Xorg not installed yet) in package.use I've already set...
>
> dev-libs/openssl bindist
> net-misc/openssh bindist
> net-wireless/iw bindist
> net-wireless/wpa_supplicant bindist
>


Just out of curiosity I did a euse -i bindist.  It seems what that flag
does sort of depends on the package it is set for.  You may want to
investigate what it will do on those packages before setting it
globally.  Of course, if the majority of the time you want that enabled,
you could disable it for those packages where it does something you
don't want but have the default set to on.  Whichever is easier. 

Hope that helps.

BTW, I moved my tree and such to /var/cache/portage/ a few years ago. 
At the time, that was the location most supported but I guess time
changed things and they picked another location.  Other than knowing
what location for emerge and friends to put and look for the related
items, it doesn't matter where one puts it really, as long as
permissions are correct. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Mick]

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On Saturday, 3 August 2019 16:45:07 BST Dale wrote:
> Walter Dnes wrote:
> > On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 12:24:51AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote
> > 
> >> I'll insert CHOST and MAKEOPTS to play safe.  Any other gotchas in
> >> recent installs?
> >> 
> >   So far so good. The basic system is installed and booting.  One
> > 
> > question... can I just set the "bindist" USE flag globally.  On a basic
> > text install (Xorg not installed yet) in package.use I've already set...
> > 
> > dev-libs/openssl bindist
> > net-misc/openssh bindist
> > net-wireless/iw bindist
> > net-wireless/wpa_supplicant bindist
> 
> Just out of curiosity I did a euse -i bindist.  It seems what that flag
> does sort of depends on the package it is set for.  You may want to
> investigate what it will do on those packages before setting it
> globally.  Of course, if the majority of the time you want that enabled,
> you could disable it for those packages where it does something you
> don't want but have the default set to on.  Whichever is easier. 
> 
> Hope that helps.
> 
> BTW, I moved my tree and such to /var/cache/portage/ a few years ago. 
> At the time, that was the location most supported but I guess time
> changed things and they picked another location.  Other than knowing
> what location for emerge and friends to put and look for the related
> items, it doesn't matter where one puts it really, as long as
> permissions are correct. 
> 
> Dale
> 
> :-)  :-) 

Unless you're building binaries to redistribute it doesn't make sense to set 
it globally.  I vaguely recall something going sideways with openssl when I 
had this flag set in the past, so I've left it unset since.

-- 
Regards,

Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Dale]

Mick wrote:
> On Saturday, 3 August 2019 16:45:07 BST Dale wrote:
>> Walter Dnes wrote:
>>> On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 12:24:51AM -0400, Walter Dnes wrote
>>>
>>>> I'll insert CHOST and MAKEOPTS to play safe.  Any other gotchas in
>>>> recent installs?
>>>>
>>>   So far so good. The basic system is installed and booting.  One
>>>
>>> question... can I just set the "bindist" USE flag globally.  On a basic
>>> text install (Xorg not installed yet) in package.use I've already set...
>>>
>>> dev-libs/openssl bindist
>>> net-misc/openssh bindist
>>> net-wireless/iw bindist
>>> net-wireless/wpa_supplicant bindist
>> Just out of curiosity I did a euse -i bindist.  It seems what that flag
>> does sort of depends on the package it is set for.  You may want to
>> investigate what it will do on those packages before setting it
>> globally.  Of course, if the majority of the time you want that enabled,
>> you could disable it for those packages where it does something you
>> don't want but have the default set to on.  Whichever is easier. 
>>
>> Hope that helps.
>>
>> BTW, I moved my tree and such to /var/cache/portage/ a few years ago. 
>> At the time, that was the location most supported but I guess time
>> changed things and they picked another location.  Other than knowing
>> what location for emerge and friends to put and look for the related
>> items, it doesn't matter where one puts it really, as long as
>> permissions are correct. 
>>
>> Dale
>>
>> :-)  :-) 
> Unless you're building binaries to redistribute it doesn't make sense to set 
> it globally.  I vaguely recall something going sideways with openssl when I 
> had this flag set in the past, so I've left it unset since.
>


It's been a long time since I did a install but I was thinking the same
as you.  For us users, it doesn't need to be set at all from what I
recall.  When I saw the flag, it rang a bell, just lightly, and that was
what made me curious about it.  The default seems to be off and it is
off here. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Walter Dnes]

On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 11:15:56AM -0500, Dale wrote

> It's been a long time since I did a install but I was thinking the same
> as you. For us users, it doesn't need to be set at all from what I
> recall.

  I had to set bindist for the listed packages.  Otherwise, they refused
to build, period.  The error message said that bindist had to be set.  I
did that, and they built properly.

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org>
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Dale]

Walter Dnes wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 11:15:56AM -0500, Dale wrote
>
>> It's been a long time since I did a install but I was thinking the same
>> as you. For us users, it doesn't need to be set at all from what I
>> recall.
>   I had to set bindist for the listed packages.  Otherwise, they refused
> to build, period.  The error message said that bindist had to be set.  I
> did that, and they built properly.
>

I have openssl and openssh installed here without bindest being set. 
It's been that way for longer than I can recall.  Perhaps another USE
flag is making it require that??  Some other package that I don't have
installed maybe? 

Maybe Mick will have a idea, or someone else.  I'm not sure what is up
with that. 

Dale

:-)  :-) 

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Walter Dnes]

On Sat, Aug 03, 2019 at 12:35:20PM -0500, Dale wrote

> I have openssl and openssh installed here without bindest being set.
> It's been that way for longer than I can recall. Perhaps another USE
> flag is making it require that?? Some other package that I don't have
> installed maybe?
> 
> Maybe Mick will have a idea, or someone else. I'm not sure what is up
> with that.

  This is getting "curiouser and curiouser".  I remember somewhere
during the install, a message about how stage3 had been built with
"bindist" flag set.  After tweaking make.conf to my specs, I rebuilt the
entire system "emerge -e @system" (148 packages).  Now those packages
build fine without the "bindist" flag.  Actually, iw didn't require a
rebuild at all. (I used "emerge --changed-use --deep --update @world")

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org>
I don't run "desktop environments"; I run useful applications

Re: [gentoo-user] Recent changes to install procedure

[Neil Bothwick]

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On Sat, 3 Aug 2019 14:39:56 -0400, Walter Dnes wrote:

>   This is getting "curiouser and curiouser".  I remember somewhere
> during the install, a message about how stage3 had been built with
> "bindist" flag set.  After tweaking make.conf to my specs, I rebuilt the
> entire system "emerge -e @system" (148 packages).  Now those packages
> build fine without the "bindist" flag.  Actually, iw didn't require a
> rebuild at all. (I used "emerge --changed-use --deep --update @world")

A stage 3 is a binary distribution, so it has to be built with bindist to
keep the lawyers happy.


-- 
Neil Bothwick

WinErr 042: Virus error - A virus has been activated in a dos-box. The
virus, however, requires Windows. All tasks will automatically be closed
            and the virus will be activated again.

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[gentoo-user] Re: Recent changes to install procedure

[Nikos Chantziaras]

On 03/08/2019 18:32, Walter Dnes wrote:
>    So far so good. The basic system is installed and booting.  One
> question... can I just set the "bindist" USE flag globally.
Usually you unset it globally. If you allow some of the packages to be 
built with it, you're going to lose some functionality due to 
redistribution legal nonsense. On a personal system where you install 
packages without the intent to redistribute them to others, you want 
that flag disabled globally.

For example in freetype you lose ClearType support. In Firefox it will 
replace the logo and possibly the name with something else. Openssh will 
disable patented algorithms.

Some packages will not fine-tune their performance to your CPU and 
instead do generic optimizations.

TL;DR: you don't want to enable bindist. Better disable it globally.