From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE188139083 for ; Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:47:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EBD42E0E3A; Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:47:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smarthost01b.mail.zen.net.uk (smarthost01b.mail.zen.net.uk [212.23.1.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 89D99E0DA4 for ; Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:47:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [82.69.83.178] (helo=mail.digimed.co.uk) by smarthost01b.mail.zen.net.uk with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA256:256) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1eP6RC-0001Fe-7q for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:47:02 +0000 Received: from digimed.co.uk (fenchurch.digimed.co.uk [192.168.1.6]) by mail.digimed.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTPA id B0F4E67664 for ; Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:47:01 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:46:56 +0000 From: Neil Bothwick To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Is gnome becoming obligatory? Message-ID: <20171213124656.5f09717e@digimed.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <1631660.tsUNQvXBgp@thetick> References: <6582741.F9gJHCEsXr@dell_xps> <5A2D04A1.6090101@youngman.org.uk> <20171210101330.GA5671@ACM> <1631660.tsUNQvXBgp@thetick> Organization: Digital Media Production X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.15.1-dirty (GTK+ 2.24.31; x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) X-GPG-Fingerprint: 7260 0F33 97EC 2F1E 7667 FE37 BA6E 1A97 4375 1903 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/VNloKx=hIWkX=TbB02XaC05"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Originating-smarthost01b-IP: [82.69.83.178] Feedback-ID: 82.69.83.178 X-Archives-Salt: 3fe8d5b8-03d2-42bc-b4f8-f68725749827 X-Archives-Hash: 8110d8023cac315c17347694d78b3d1c --Sig_/VNloKx=hIWkX=TbB02XaC05 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:34:03 +0100, Marc Joliet wrote: > > I've no idea how good systemd is. It's not been through the normal > > process of choice and selection that other successful packages have. What process was that? The one where distro maintainers decide what to include in *their* distros? Isn't that how all packages, including systemd, make it into a distro. Debian even had a public debate and vote on it. You seem to be implying that systemd got into those distros by some stealth process, maybe a trojan or even osmosis? > > It was forced on people. Nothing has been forced on anyone because no one is forced to accept the distro maintainers chosen defaults. > > But being forced to have a binary system > > log, being forced (so I have heard) to have an http server > > running, ...., doesn't make it an attractive package for me. =20 >=20 > *All* of this is "so I have heard". What happened to researching stuff > as the better alternative to speaking out of your ass? The systemd debate is different in that instead of fanboys that ignore the facts, the loudest arguers are a hate club that make up their own "facts". I'm amazed that all those developers at Debian, Red Hat, Arch and other distros ignored all these facts when they are normally so technically astute. Still, what to experienced developers know when compared to mailing list and forum posters... --=20 Neil Bothwick Sir! Romulan warbird decloaki\xBB\xAE\xF5\xF7\xFC\xC1 NO CARRIER --Sig_/VNloKx=hIWkX=TbB02XaC05 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEE8k9T/rX16EJxEKG692eFu0QSMJgFAloxIUAACgkQ92eFu0QS MJgwHA/+JDXPaYr/9Cccl6PgrQpCHX+RfrqXIRqFOuUJ7aXFekDmxVsq9vVV6WCu kh7fDxgyzXR0SBa6PFNMLrRXSO2/PNEUN4HjjYuQSAnvTjY1vo7VbJ1A8IoQQHik rLDW6VzVwF8e2xdDvDy8ECPRINhF6FjdwVkSMGwX7B/K3w1uNvfX2D5o8jTerikI ph72PRcbRb4F2QznSoHDaTp07wqzdKXImuPVTgh7GVVQlFg+SfVN2NgSemH9L7NO yWgZsxKMljSwvv0OsdQtTvLUBveBEopLyl0bWIaVThnT8WSOtCKWn+2Bshn2ePsI YvQB7OQpg7IMCOD0LIogmeUmfK/g4jgaJtJ8NSr1Jplynm0poNbkuwTzHoT96rmv 9AzdyVWzVyKM2LBH/i0vdI6V/vnwnW5TAFlCA/yRGDUdf1qCbv9zAVMFgoWgdrf9 R1DT6dvFBtRRDK43Iujrs3s3qh/XUXkarTQrcl8ZxHM/gug1R1UP/hg1h7UdytCp 801STLovz2AqAN1Wbd0z+5syCPDDiquYjhNt1WJwpTa9XgbDmK9b4iblwKgjuj1+ XY7t+Fs+IsmclLD5JjfwkLo0IE6ZfJU3/kGSPWewolEwdbhavzzOYwWhmevMJrWr lTIupZIL8ZIEvDGsEAI2c/Vxmp1VgrnvhJO5/1f7P959nQLQaPo= =iuEo -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/VNloKx=hIWkX=TbB02XaC05--