[gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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Hi All,

I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in cups, 
on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one does *not* 
have the hpijs USE set.

Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me if the 
HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI via 
https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?

Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure what 
changed ...

I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems to 
work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the 930c driver 
anyway.
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Dale]

Mick wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in cups, 
> on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one does *not* 
> have the hpijs USE set.
>
> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me if the 
> HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI via 
> https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
>
> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure what 
> changed ...
>
> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems to 
> work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the 930c driver 
> anyway.


I was going to try and test this.  I try to help when ever I can.  Thing
is, the way CUPS works here, you have to have the printer connected to
set it up.  I can't find a option to set up a printer that is not
connected during the set up process.  Maybe I am missing something.  o_O 

Maybe someone else who has that printer can test it.  We hope.

Dale

:-)  :-) 

[gentoo-user] Re: Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[walt]

On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 22:22:32 +0100
Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
> 
> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up
> in cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this
> one does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> 
> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
> if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the
> GUI via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> 
> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
> what changed ...
> 
> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it
> seems to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to
> use the 930c driver anyway.

Sometime in the past few days hpijs came to my attention in a way that
escapes me at the moment, but I remember being puzzled by it.  What is
also puzzling is that hpijs doesn't show up here in the output of eix:

Installed versions:  2.0.4^t(06:49:33 AM 08/28/2015)(X acl dbus java
pam python ssl systemd threads -debug -kerberos -lprng-compat -selinux
-static-libs -usb -xinetd -zeroconf ABI_MIPS="-n32 -n64 -o32"
ABI_PPC="-32 -64" ABI_S390="-32 -64" ABI_X86="32 64 -x32"
ELIBC="-FreeBSD" LINGUAS="-ca -cs -de -es -fr -it -ja -pt_BR -ru"
PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7") Homepage:            http://www.cups.org/
Description:         The Common Unix Printing System

When I run ufed, though, I do see an hpijs useflag described, because
it's listed in /usr/portage/profiles/use.local.desc (dated today).
Here is a good use for the new git-based portage tree (which I'm not
using yet, BTW):

https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/

I just spent 10 minutes searching through the commits related to cups
and I can't find anything about hpijs, but I know there's something
strange going on with that useflag.

Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[wabenbau]

Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi All,
> 
> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up
> in cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this
> one does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> 
> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
> if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the
> GUI via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> 
> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
> what changed ...
> 
> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it
> seems to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to
> use the 930c driver anyway.

I don't have USE flag hpijs set for hplip (3.14.10) and when I modify 
my printer, there are two lines for HP DeskJet 930C shown up:

HP Deskjet 930C Foomatic/cdj550 (en)
HP Deskjet 930c, hpcups 3.14.10 (en)

My USE flags for hplip are:

X doc hpcups libnotify qt4 scanner snmp -fax -hpijs -kde -libusb0 -minimal -parport -policykit -static-ppds

--
Regards
wabe

Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 23:43:51 Dale wrote:
> Mick wrote:
> > Hi All,
> > 
> > I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in
> > cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one
> > does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> > 
> > Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me if
> > the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI via
> > https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> > 
> > Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure what
> > changed ...
> > 
> > I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems
> > to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the
> > 930c driver anyway.
> 
> I was going to try and test this.  I try to help when ever I can.  Thing
> is, the way CUPS works here, you have to have the printer connected to
> set it up.  I can't find a option to set up a printer that is not
> connected during the set up process.  Maybe I am missing something.  o_O
> 
> Maybe someone else who has that printer can test it.  We hope.
> 
> Dale
> 
> :-)  :-)

Thank you Dale,

You don't have to complete the setup of the printer.  Just select Modify 
printer and 'try' to change its driver from the dropdown selection.  You don't 
need to actually change it - just look in there if DeskJet 930c is listed.  
Assuming of course that your hplip was compiled with USE="-hpijs".

My 930C is a USB printer, but I have a little ethernet to USB printer server 
that I access it through.  This is a monodirectional lpd server, so all the 
hplip GUI to report printer status is not working.  It doesn't bother me as 
printing is a rare occasion and all users know what to do if it runs out of 
ink.

Printing was all working fine on this PC until a couple of days ago, so I 
wonder if I removed something in /etc/portage/* to cause this ...
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 01:45:14 walt wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 22:22:32 +0100
> 
> Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi All,
> > 
> > I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up
> > in cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this
> > one does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> > 
> > Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
> > if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the
> > GUI via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> > 
> > Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
> > what changed ...
> > 
> > I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it
> > seems to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to
> > use the 930c driver anyway.
> 
> Sometime in the past few days hpijs came to my attention in a way that
> escapes me at the moment, but I remember being puzzled by it.  What is
> also puzzling is that hpijs doesn't show up here in the output of eix:
> 
> Installed versions:  2.0.4^t(06:49:33 AM 08/28/2015)(X acl dbus java
> pam python ssl systemd threads -debug -kerberos -lprng-compat -selinux
> -static-libs -usb -xinetd -zeroconf ABI_MIPS="-n32 -n64 -o32"
> ABI_PPC="-32 -64" ABI_S390="-32 -64" ABI_X86="32 64 -x32"
> ELIBC="-FreeBSD" LINGUAS="-ca -cs -de -es -fr -it -ja -pt_BR -ru"
> PYTHON_TARGETS="python2_7") Homepage:            http://www.cups.org/
> Description:         The Common Unix Printing System
> 
> When I run ufed, though, I do see an hpijs useflag described, because
> it's listed in /usr/portage/profiles/use.local.desc (dated today).
> Here is a good use for the new git-based portage tree (which I'm not
> using yet, BTW):
> 
> https://gitweb.gentoo.org/repo/gentoo.git/
> 
> I just spent 10 minutes searching through the commits related to cups
> and I can't find anything about hpijs, but I know there's something
> strange going on with that useflag.

It is a flag for hplip rather than cups.
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 02:11:44 wabenbau@gmail.com wrote:
> Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi All,
> > 
> > I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up
> > in cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this
> > one does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> > 
> > Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
> > if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the
> > GUI via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> > 
> > Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
> > what changed ...
> > 
> > I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it
> > seems to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to
> > use the 930c driver anyway.
> 
> I don't have USE flag hpijs set for hplip (3.14.10) and when I modify
> my printer, there are two lines for HP DeskJet 930C shown up:
> 
> HP Deskjet 930C Foomatic/cdj550 (en)
> HP Deskjet 930c, hpcups 3.14.10 (en)
> 
> My USE flags for hplip are:
> 
> X doc hpcups libnotify qt4 scanner snmp -fax -hpijs -kde -libusb0 -minimal
> -parport -policykit -static-ppds
> 
> --
> Regards
> wabe

Thank you wabe.  This is just how I recalled this should be and confirms my 
suspicions that hpijs is not needed.  I am at a loss as to why 930c suddenly 
disappeared from the list of available drivers.  I am also at the latest 
stable hplip-3.14.10.

Could this be btrfs playing up and messing up cups?  O_o

-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Dale]

Mick wrote:
> On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 23:43:51 Dale wrote:
>> Mick wrote:
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in
>>> cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one
>>> does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
>>>
>>> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me if
>>> the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI via
>>> https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
>>>
>>> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure what
>>> changed ...
>>>
>>> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems
>>> to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the
>>> 930c driver anyway.
>> I was going to try and test this.  I try to help when ever I can.  Thing
>> is, the way CUPS works here, you have to have the printer connected to
>> set it up.  I can't find a option to set up a printer that is not
>> connected during the set up process.  Maybe I am missing something.  o_O
>>
>> Maybe someone else who has that printer can test it.  We hope.
>>
>> Dale
>>
>> :-)  :-)
> Thank you Dale,
>
> You don't have to complete the setup of the printer.  Just select Modify 
> printer and 'try' to change its driver from the dropdown selection.  You don't 
> need to actually change it - just look in there if DeskJet 930c is listed.  
> Assuming of course that your hplip was compiled with USE="-hpijs".
>
> My 930C is a USB printer, but I have a little ethernet to USB printer server 
> that I access it through.  This is a monodirectional lpd server, so all the 
> hplip GUI to report printer status is not working.  It doesn't bother me as 
> printing is a rare occasion and all users know what to do if it runs out of 
> ink.
>
> Printing was all working fine on this PC until a couple of days ago, so I 
> wonder if I removed something in /etc/portage/* to cause this ...


I get the same option just trying to modify my current printer.  It
doesn't list anything, it just shows the printer I currently have set
up.  Even if I tell it I want to add another printer, it still shows my
current printer.  I can't find a way to get it to list them.  Maybe it
is a setting somewhere that I have that makes mine work different.

Dale

:-)  :-) 

Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 08:12:56 Dale wrote:
> Mick wrote:
> > On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 23:43:51 Dale wrote:
> >> Mick wrote:
> >>> Hi All,
> >>> 
> >>> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in
> >>> cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one
> >>> does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
> >>> 
> >>> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
> >>> if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI
> >>> via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
> >>> 
> >>> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
> >>> what changed ...
> >>> 
> >>> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems
> >>> to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the
> >>> 930c driver anyway.
> >> 
> >> I was going to try and test this.  I try to help when ever I can.  Thing
> >> is, the way CUPS works here, you have to have the printer connected to
> >> set it up.  I can't find a option to set up a printer that is not
> >> connected during the set up process.  Maybe I am missing something.  o_O
> >> 
> >> Maybe someone else who has that printer can test it.  We hope.
> >> 
> >> Dale
> >> 
> >> :-)  :-)
> > 
> > Thank you Dale,
> > 
> > You don't have to complete the setup of the printer.  Just select Modify
> > printer and 'try' to change its driver from the dropdown selection.  You
> > don't need to actually change it - just look in there if DeskJet 930c is
> > listed. Assuming of course that your hplip was compiled with
> > USE="-hpijs".
> > 
> > My 930C is a USB printer, but I have a little ethernet to USB printer
> > server that I access it through.  This is a monodirectional lpd server,
> > so all the hplip GUI to report printer status is not working.  It
> > doesn't bother me as printing is a rare occasion and all users know what
> > to do if it runs out of ink.
> > 
> > Printing was all working fine on this PC until a couple of days ago, so I
> > wonder if I removed something in /etc/portage/* to cause this ...
> 
> I get the same option just trying to modify my current printer.  It
> doesn't list anything, it just shows the printer I currently have set
> up.  Even if I tell it I want to add another printer, it still shows my
> current printer.  I can't find a way to get it to list them.  Maybe it
> is a setting somewhere that I have that makes mine work different.
> 
> Dale
> 
> :-)  :-)

OK, I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box and I remerged 
hplip.  Guess what?  The 930c driver re-appeared on the list.  So I am now 
doubly paranoid that the btrfs is playing up ...

-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Alan McKinnon]

On 17/09/2015 19:36, Mick wrote:
> On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 08:12:56 Dale wrote:
>> Mick wrote:
>>> On Wednesday 16 Sep 2015 23:43:51 Dale wrote:
>>>> Mick wrote:
>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>
>>>>> I just noticed that the driver for my old printer no longer shows up in
>>>>> cups, on one of my PCs.  Comparison with other PCs shows that this one
>>>>> does *not* have the hpijs USE set.
>>>>>
>>>>> Could someone who also does not have hpijs set in their hplip tell me
>>>>> if the HP DeskJet 930C selection is missing, when they load up the GUI
>>>>> via https://127.0.0.1:631 and then try to modify a printer?
>>>>>
>>>>> Until this week there wasn't a problem with this PC so I am not sure
>>>>> what changed ...
>>>>>
>>>>> I've set it up with DeskJet 932c for now without USE=hpijs and it seems
>>>>> to work, so I am in two minds if I need hpijs or if I need to use the
>>>>> 930c driver anyway.
>>>>
>>>> I was going to try and test this.  I try to help when ever I can.  Thing
>>>> is, the way CUPS works here, you have to have the printer connected to
>>>> set it up.  I can't find a option to set up a printer that is not
>>>> connected during the set up process.  Maybe I am missing something.  o_O
>>>>
>>>> Maybe someone else who has that printer can test it.  We hope.
>>>>
>>>> Dale
>>>>
>>>> :-)  :-)
>>>
>>> Thank you Dale,
>>>
>>> You don't have to complete the setup of the printer.  Just select Modify
>>> printer and 'try' to change its driver from the dropdown selection.  You
>>> don't need to actually change it - just look in there if DeskJet 930c is
>>> listed. Assuming of course that your hplip was compiled with
>>> USE="-hpijs".
>>>
>>> My 930C is a USB printer, but I have a little ethernet to USB printer
>>> server that I access it through.  This is a monodirectional lpd server,
>>> so all the hplip GUI to report printer status is not working.  It
>>> doesn't bother me as printing is a rare occasion and all users know what
>>> to do if it runs out of ink.
>>>
>>> Printing was all working fine on this PC until a couple of days ago, so I
>>> wonder if I removed something in /etc/portage/* to cause this ...
>>
>> I get the same option just trying to modify my current printer.  It
>> doesn't list anything, it just shows the printer I currently have set
>> up.  Even if I tell it I want to add another printer, it still shows my
>> current printer.  I can't find a way to get it to list them.  Maybe it
>> is a setting somewhere that I have that makes mine work different.
>>
>> Dale
>>
>> :-)  :-)
> 
> OK, I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box and I remerged 
> hplip.  Guess what?  The 930c driver re-appeared on the list.  So I am now 
> doubly paranoid that the btrfs is playing up ...
> 

Or, someone deleted the ppd and the re-emerge put it back :-)

As the saying goes "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained
by stupidity"


-- 
Alan McKinnon
alan.mckinnon@gmail.com

[gentoo-user] Re: Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[james]

Mick <michaelkintzios <at> gmail.com> writes:

> Thank you wabe.  This is just how I recalled this should be and confirms my 
> suspicions that hpijs is not needed.  I am at a loss as to why 930c suddenly 
> disappeared from the list of available drivers.  I am also at the latest 
> stable hplip-3.14.10.


Hello Mick,

This package cannot hurt. It's probably not the problem but you never know.
I've used it to fix other things.  I assuming you got it hook up on usb?

sys-apps/hwids


Your 930C Deskjet is in there

https://usb-ids.gowdy.us/usb.ids


Cups is a funny (not so funny, actually) app. They fix one thing
and hose another, all the time.

I keep many backups of /etc/cups as the upgrade sometime modify
perfectly fine files. If the hwids does hot help, then
examine the usb bus to makesure it stillworks. My hp printer
qot real intermittant on the ethernet. The plastic part of the 
RJ45 connector broke, inside. Stange failure, so I just tape
the ethernet cable.   You got somthing weird. Check the data
cable, as I assumed it was USB.

hth,
James

Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 20:25:57 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 17/09/2015 19:36, Mick wrote:

> > OK, I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box and I
> > remerged hplip.  Guess what?  The 930c driver re-appeared on the list. 
> > So I am now doubly paranoid that the btrfs is playing up ...
> 
> Or, someone deleted the ppd and the re-emerge put it back :-)

Hmm ... now, who would that be, when I'm the only one with root access to this 
box?  O_o

> As the saying goes "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained
> by stupidity"

Yeah, right, I don't have to answer that.  :-p
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Alan McKinnon]

On 18/09/2015 00:26, Mick wrote:
> On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 20:25:57 Alan McKinnon wrote:
>> On 17/09/2015 19:36, Mick wrote:
> 
>>> OK, I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box and I
>>> remerged hplip.  Guess what?  The 930c driver re-appeared on the list. 
>>> So I am now doubly paranoid that the btrfs is playing up ...
>>
>> Or, someone deleted the ppd and the re-emerge put it back :-)
> 
> Hmm ... now, who would that be, when I'm the only one with root access to this 
> box?  O_o
> 
>> As the saying goes "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained
>> by stupidity"
> 
> Yeah, right, I don't have to answer that.  :-p
> 


When you said "I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box"
I figured it wasn't yours, that it had users, and you were the guy with
the problem of sorting it out, and you needed some pointy haired bosses'
permission to do it at all.

Seems that's not actually the case?

-- 
Alan McKinnon
alan.mckinnon@gmail.com

Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Mick]

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On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 23:33:57 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 18/09/2015 00:26, Mick wrote:
> > On Thursday 17 Sep 2015 20:25:57 Alan McKinnon wrote:
> >> On 17/09/2015 19:36, Mick wrote:
> >>> OK, I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box and I
> >>> remerged hplip.  Guess what?  The 930c driver re-appeared on the list.
> >>> So I am now doubly paranoid that the btrfs is playing up ...
> >> 
> >> Or, someone deleted the ppd and the re-emerge put it back :-)
> > 
> > Hmm ... now, who would that be, when I'm the only one with root access to
> > this box?  O_o
> > 
> >> As the saying goes "never ascribe to malice what is adequately explained
> >> by stupidity"
> > 
> > Yeah, right, I don't have to answer that.  :-p
> 
> When you said "I managed to get 10 minutes access to the offending box"
> I figured it wasn't yours, that it had users, and you were the guy with
> the problem of sorting it out, and you needed some pointy haired bosses'
> permission to do it at all.
> 
> Seems that's not actually the case?

It is indeed the case, with the pointy haired boss being the missus and the 
box in question a production desktop. :-))

I have to admit that I can't recall messing up with the ppd files, or indeed 
ever using hpijs on this box.

A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up as a 
result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs nor fsck showed 
up anything.

The OS is on a single SSD (no RAID), with some caches and busy fs mounted on a 
spinning disk.  I have some backups in case of DR, but after a while a 
corrupted fs will have migrated to the back ups.
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10

[Marc Joliet]

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On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
>A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up as a 
>result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs nor fsck
>showed up anything.

I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you meant by 
fsck?

>The OS is on a single SSD (no RAID), with some caches and busy fs mounted on
>a  spinning disk.  I have some backups in case of DR, but after a while a
>corrupted fs will have migrated to the back ups.

With btrfs, if there really was silent corruption, you wouldn't be able to 
access the file in the single disk case, so no, I don't think it actually 
would propagate to the backup (although perhaps you don't use btrfs 
exclusively, in which case it of course could).  Though keep in mind that 
corruption can happen in a variety of ways, e.g., application-level or 
firmware bugs.

-- 
Marc Joliet
--
"People who think they know everything really annoy those of us who know we
don't" - Bjarne Stroustrup

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Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Mick]

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On Friday 18 Sep 2015 17:16:54 Marc Joliet wrote:
> On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
> >A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up as
> >a result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs nor fsck
> >showed up anything.
> 
> I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you meant
> by fsck?

Am I supposed to run scrub with I do not have a RAID running?  I thought scrub 
was meant for comparing checksums between mirrored fs - have I got this wrong?


> >The OS is on a single SSD (no RAID), with some caches and busy fs mounted
> >on a  spinning disk.  I have some backups in case of DR, but after a
> >while a corrupted fs will have migrated to the back ups.
> 
> With btrfs, if there really was silent corruption, you wouldn't be able to
> access the file in the single disk case, so no, I don't think it actually
> would propagate to the backup (although perhaps you don't use btrfs
> exclusively, in which case it of course could).  Though keep in mind that
> corruption can happen in a variety of ways, e.g., application-level or
> firmware bugs.

-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Rich Freeman]

On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Friday 18 Sep 2015 17:16:54 Marc Joliet wrote:
>> On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
>> >A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up as
>> >a result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs nor fsck
>> >showed up anything.
>>
>> I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you meant
>> by fsck?
>
> Am I supposed to run scrub with I do not have a RAID running?  I thought scrub
> was meant for comparing checksums between mirrored fs - have I got this wrong?
>

You can actually run scrub on a non-raid btrfs setup.  Btrfs will
report any errors that it detects (using the checksumming in the
filesystem), but it would not be able to fix errors unless you have it
storing redundant data somewhere (even on non-raid it still stores
redundant metadata by default, and you can choose to do this with data
as well which protects against block-level failures but not disk-level
failures, obviously).

However, you'd have gotten the same errors in dmesg just trying to
read the files - btrfs checks the checksum on all file read
operations.  That is a big part of the value of both btrfs and zfs.

-- 
Rich

Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Mick]

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On Friday 18 Sep 2015 19:15:50 Rich Freeman wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Friday 18 Sep 2015 17:16:54 Marc Joliet wrote:
> >> On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
> >> >A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up
> >> >as a result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs
> >> >nor fsck showed up anything.
> >> 
> >> I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you
> >> meant by fsck?
> > 
> > Am I supposed to run scrub with I do not have a RAID running?  I thought
> > scrub was meant for comparing checksums between mirrored fs - have I got
> > this wrong?
> 
> You can actually run scrub on a non-raid btrfs setup.  Btrfs will
> report any errors that it detects (using the checksumming in the
> filesystem), but it would not be able to fix errors unless you have it
> storing redundant data somewhere (even on non-raid it still stores
> redundant metadata by default, and you can choose to do this with data
> as well which protects against block-level failures but not disk-level
> failures, obviously).
> 
> However, you'd have gotten the same errors in dmesg just trying to
> read the files - btrfs checks the checksum on all file read
> operations.  That is a big part of the value of both btrfs and zfs.

Ah!  V interesting ... can I run scrub with mounted partitions, or do I have 
to do it from a LiveCD?

-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Rich Freeman]

On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 2:19 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Friday 18 Sep 2015 19:15:50 Rich Freeman wrote:
>> On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Friday 18 Sep 2015 17:16:54 Marc Joliet wrote:
>> >> On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
>> >> >A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played up
>> >> >as a result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the logs
>> >> >nor fsck showed up anything.
>> >>
>> >> I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you
>> >> meant by fsck?
>> >
>> > Am I supposed to run scrub with I do not have a RAID running?  I thought
>> > scrub was meant for comparing checksums between mirrored fs - have I got
>> > this wrong?
>>
>> You can actually run scrub on a non-raid btrfs setup.  Btrfs will
>> report any errors that it detects (using the checksumming in the
>> filesystem), but it would not be able to fix errors unless you have it
>> storing redundant data somewhere (even on non-raid it still stores
>> redundant metadata by default, and you can choose to do this with data
>> as well which protects against block-level failures but not disk-level
>> failures, obviously).
>>
>> However, you'd have gotten the same errors in dmesg just trying to
>> read the files - btrfs checks the checksum on all file read
>> operations.  That is a big part of the value of both btrfs and zfs.
>
> Ah!  V interesting ... can I run scrub with mounted partitions, or do I have
> to do it from a LiveCD?

I didn't check, but I suspect you can only run scrub on a mounted
partition.  I also suspect that fsck probably has an option to do
something equivalent offline.

You do get the error-detection anyway just by reading files, and if
you just ran find on your filesystem and catted every file you have to
/dev/null that would actually accomplish the same thing as long as
you're not in a redundant mode (simply reading all the files doesn't
guarantee that all copies of each file are checked).

The main reason for doing a scrub is to detect latent issues, and if
you have redundancy that means you can auto-correct them today, rather
than discovering them a month from now when the drive containing the
only good copy fails.  Even if you don't have redundancy maybe you
rotate your backups every 30 days and detecting the error might mean
having the ability to go back and restore a good copy of the file
before it is completely replaced with bad copies.

-- 
Rich

Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Mick]

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On Friday 18 Sep 2015 19:30:49 Rich Freeman wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 2:19 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Friday 18 Sep 2015 19:15:50 Rich Freeman wrote:
> >> On Fri, Sep 18, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > On Friday 18 Sep 2015 17:16:54 Marc Joliet wrote:
> >> >> On Friday 18 September 2015 10:31:01 Mick wrote:
> >> >> >A couple of months ago the akonadi DB went sideways and kmail played
> >> >> >up as a result.  Again I was suspicious of btrfs, but neither the
> >> >> >logs nor fsck showed up anything.
> >> >> 
> >> >> I take it "btrfs scrub" didn't turn up anything, or is that what you
> >> >> meant by fsck?
> >> > 
> >> > Am I supposed to run scrub with I do not have a RAID running?  I
> >> > thought scrub was meant for comparing checksums between mirrored fs -
> >> > have I got this wrong?
> >> 
> >> You can actually run scrub on a non-raid btrfs setup.  Btrfs will
> >> report any errors that it detects (using the checksumming in the
> >> filesystem), but it would not be able to fix errors unless you have it
> >> storing redundant data somewhere (even on non-raid it still stores
> >> redundant metadata by default, and you can choose to do this with data
> >> as well which protects against block-level failures but not disk-level
> >> failures, obviously).
> >> 
> >> However, you'd have gotten the same errors in dmesg just trying to
> >> read the files - btrfs checks the checksum on all file read
> >> operations.  That is a big part of the value of both btrfs and zfs.
> > 
> > Ah!  V interesting ... can I run scrub with mounted partitions, or do I
> > have to do it from a LiveCD?
> 
> I didn't check, but I suspect you can only run scrub on a mounted
> partition.  I also suspect that fsck probably has an option to do
> something equivalent offline.
> 
> You do get the error-detection anyway just by reading files, and if
> you just ran find on your filesystem and catted every file you have to
> /dev/null that would actually accomplish the same thing as long as
> you're not in a redundant mode (simply reading all the files doesn't
> guarantee that all copies of each file are checked).
> 
> The main reason for doing a scrub is to detect latent issues, and if
> you have redundancy that means you can auto-correct them today, rather
> than discovering them a month from now when the drive containing the
> only good copy fails.  Even if you don't have redundancy maybe you
> rotate your backups every 30 days and detecting the error might mean
> having the ability to go back and restore a good copy of the file
> before it is completely replaced with bad copies.

Thank you Rich, I ran 'btrfs scrub start /" and it found zero problems.  dmesg 
and syslog clean too. 
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Stefan G. Weichinger]

Am 2015-09-18 um 23:58 schrieb Mick:

>> The main reason for doing a scrub is to detect latent issues, and
>> if you have redundancy that means you can auto-correct them
>> today, rather than discovering them a month from now when the
>> drive containing the only good copy fails.  Even if you don't
>> have redundancy maybe you rotate your backups every 30 days and
>> detecting the error might mean having the ability to go back and
>> restore a good copy of the file before it is completely replaced
>> with bad copies.
> 
> Thank you Rich, I ran 'btrfs scrub start /" and it found zero
> problems.  dmesg and syslog clean too.

I wrote (= googled something and adapted it a bit) some
btrfs-scrub.service and .timer for doing that once a week (systemd
environment):

$ cat btrfs-scrub.service
[Unit]
Description=Check volume for errors
Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub
After=fstrim.service

[Service]
Type=oneshot
ExecStart=/bin/sh -c 'for i in $(grep btrfs /proc/mounts  | cut -d" "
-f1 | sort -u | grep dev); do echo scrubbing $i; btrfs scrub start -Bd
$i; done'
IOSchedulingClass=idle
CPUSchedulingPolicy=idle

$ cat btrfs-scrub.timer
[Unit]
Description=Check volume for errors once a week
Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub

[Timer]
OnCalendar=weekly
AccuracySec=1h
Persistent=true

[Install]
WantedBy=timers.target

Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[Mick]

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On Saturday 19 Sep 2015 21:14:00 Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
> Am 2015-09-18 um 23:58 schrieb Mick:
> >> The main reason for doing a scrub is to detect latent issues, and
> >> if you have redundancy that means you can auto-correct them
> >> today, rather than discovering them a month from now when the
> >> drive containing the only good copy fails.  Even if you don't
> >> have redundancy maybe you rotate your backups every 30 days and
> >> detecting the error might mean having the ability to go back and
> >> restore a good copy of the file before it is completely replaced
> >> with bad copies.
> > 
> > Thank you Rich, I ran 'btrfs scrub start /" and it found zero
> > problems.  dmesg and syslog clean too.
> 
> I wrote (= googled something and adapted it a bit) some
> btrfs-scrub.service and .timer for doing that once a week (systemd
> environment):
> 
> $ cat btrfs-scrub.service
> [Unit]
> Description=Check volume for errors
> Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub
> After=fstrim.service
> 
> [Service]
> Type=oneshot
> ExecStart=/bin/sh -c 'for i in $(grep btrfs /proc/mounts  | cut -d" "
> -f1 | sort -u | grep dev); do echo scrubbing $i; btrfs scrub start -Bd
> $i; done'
> IOSchedulingClass=idle
> CPUSchedulingPolicy=idle
> 
> $ cat btrfs-scrub.timer
> [Unit]
> Description=Check volume for errors once a week
> Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub
> 
> [Timer]
> OnCalendar=weekly
> AccuracySec=1h
> Persistent=true
> 
> [Install]
> WantedBy=timers.target

Thank you Stefan, I will probably look into doing the same for openrc.
-- 
Regards,
Mick

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Re: [gentoo-user] BTRFS problem? [WAS Quick check on net-print/hplip-3.14.10]

[J. Roeleveld]

On 19 September 2015 22:24:19 CEST, Mick <michaelkintzios@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Saturday 19 Sep 2015 21:14:00 Stefan G. Weichinger wrote:
>> Am 2015-09-18 um 23:58 schrieb Mick:
>> >> The main reason for doing a scrub is to detect latent issues, and
>> >> if you have redundancy that means you can auto-correct them
>> >> today, rather than discovering them a month from now when the
>> >> drive containing the only good copy fails.  Even if you don't
>> >> have redundancy maybe you rotate your backups every 30 days and
>> >> detecting the error might mean having the ability to go back and
>> >> restore a good copy of the file before it is completely replaced
>> >> with bad copies.
>> > 
>> > Thank you Rich, I ran 'btrfs scrub start /" and it found zero
>> > problems.  dmesg and syslog clean too.
>> 
>> I wrote (= googled something and adapted it a bit) some
>> btrfs-scrub.service and .timer for doing that once a week (systemd
>> environment):
>> 
>> $ cat btrfs-scrub.service
>> [Unit]
>> Description=Check volume for errors
>> Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub
>> After=fstrim.service
>> 
>> [Service]
>> Type=oneshot
>> ExecStart=/bin/sh -c 'for i in $(grep btrfs /proc/mounts  | cut -d" "
>> -f1 | sort -u | grep dev); do echo scrubbing $i; btrfs scrub start
>-Bd
>> $i; done'
>> IOSchedulingClass=idle
>> CPUSchedulingPolicy=idle
>> 
>> $ cat btrfs-scrub.timer
>> [Unit]
>> Description=Check volume for errors once a week
>> Documentation=man:btrfs-scrub
>> 
>> [Timer]
>> OnCalendar=weekly
>> AccuracySec=1h
>> Persistent=true
>> 
>> [Install]
>> WantedBy=timers.target
>
>Thank you Stefan, I will probably look into doing the same for openrc.

Crontab (or one of its alternatives) would be your friend here. :)

--
Joost
-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.