From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E7961389E2 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2014 14:28:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 97801E08B0; Sat, 29 Nov 2014 14:28:44 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.muc.de (colin.muc.de [193.149.48.1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4C4E0E0867 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2014 14:28:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 92411 invoked by uid 3782); 29 Nov 2014 14:28:40 -0000 Received: from acm.muc.de (pD951A074.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [217.81.160.116]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 29 Nov 2014 15:28:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 3936 invoked by uid 1000); 29 Nov 2014 14:28:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 14:28:15 +0000 To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Gentoo's future directtion ? Message-ID: <20141129142815.GB3752@acm.acm> References: <54764D1E.1080201@xunil.at> <54768398.60701@yourstruly.sx> <547689B4.6010606@yourstruly.sx> <5476A3B1.1050403@gentoo.org> <5478A482.2030203@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) From: Alan Mackenzie X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-Archives-Salt: 0e60aacf-2f90-4ea1-a481-016cf532ca34 X-Archives-Hash: 0881d723a9e8d794b3bf212c4adc6353 Hello, everybody. On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 07:09:07AM +0000, Martin Vaeth wrote: > hasufell wrote: > > Martin Vaeth: > >> hasufell wrote: > >>>> With rsync I believe you can exclude categories: > >>>> http://www.gentoo-wiki.info/TIP_Exclude_categories_from_emerge_sync > >>> That is uninformed. > >> I think he is right. > >>> check the --depth option of git. You can even clone specific tags with > >>> --depth=1. > >> Every tag will still contain all categories: > >> AFAIK, with git, it is not possible to update everyting but e.g. *access* > >> *kde* *i10n* *gnome* if you know that you will never install an > >> ebuild from these categories. > > My max DL rate is ~700KiB/s and is the limiting factor. > My concern is not the time but the total volume (there are still > often limitations involved), and perhaps even more important, > the disk usage, especially compared with methods like squashfs(+aufs). > It simply is a fact that with git you have to download and store a > lot of unnecessary information (if you are not a developer and do > not use a heavy system): not only git metadata but also > unneeded categories. > So for non-developers, downloading with git does not necessarily > make sense. > That being said, please do not consider this as an argument against > a change to git: For developers it has only advantages, and AFAIK, > it is not planned to cancel other download methods anyway. Speaking as a developer in a project which has just converted to git, I can assure you that git has tremendous disadvantages, even compared with cvs. Principally, git does not have a high level model of version control concepts, so that using git is somewhat analogous to programming in assembler. Both give you tremendous control and the ability to do practically anything, including shooting yourself in the foot. So that instead of conceptualising a "branch" (as you would do with Mercurial, Bazaar, Subversion, or even CVS), you need to think about "commits reachable from a certain head (excluding commits reachable from some other head)". git is very difficult to learn, compared with, say Mercurial. To compare, if you do $ git help branch, you get a man page ~180 lines long dumped on you, and that's taking up the full width of my 240 character wide screen. If you do $ hg help branch, you get a 27 line concise summary, max. ~80 characters wide, which nonetheless is pretty much complete. git has become very popular (much as systemd has), possibly because programmers are frustrated at not being able to write in assembler any more. (At least, that's my theory). Like systemd, it has established a stranglehold on its domain. But severe disadvantages it most definitely has. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).