From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF84F1381F3 for ; Mon, 24 Dec 2012 23:32:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8AA6221C110; Mon, 24 Dec 2012 23:32:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [74.208.4.195]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F280A21C017 for ; Mon, 24 Dec 2012 23:31:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (66-208-231-133.ubr01a.rte20201.pa.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [66.208.231.133]) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrus2) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0Mbx30-1TXGGr2Gs2-00JkgB; Mon, 24 Dec 2012 18:31:08 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2012 17:31:06 -0600 From: Bruce Hill To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Anyone switched to eudev yet? Message-ID: <20121224233106.GN26547@server> References: <20121218163332.7956f31a@khamul.example.com> <87txrd6pb3.fsf@ist.utl.pt> <20121223182037.1553813f@khamul.example.com> <87bodk7lb6.fsf@ist.utl.pt> <20121224085528.56f535ec@khamul.example.com> <50D85167.9060309@gmail.com> <20121224204817.335033c6@khamul.example.com> <50D8B467.4080100@gmail.com> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:kphQQilgjUqyV5IrvSsEX8R0nENljKCMI5bELLRP3ga XbLKA7mKzEyCo4BV9pPFOsDmgTCURoEhIohB47GHAzePIlrpOm OosYHtNjzmVtnIofP8AfDEri+uYOMOpbobezAgEthBL2aN4LjR QAg9IkDmeVK09smJz+DUL11H2OOtTosLs6rUEisUEWGRC/t+gw iOo6gp2iGJHcZjozODEs7Rn8v4sPj+/h421iZB0RS2+p/JBcBs BGeDHz62jzhPp/pkoIv2SKFnfGg0w+8le1IvtyVUotkJn+SSLI gsKL9hd+pMPBQNCJXTUYHl7fK7PGH3Kq1DLvSc+rAkMTL/4BDu SN3Jasa/rKXXE18OORMww+qfQXG9OvVws49Jn1tk1 X-Archives-Salt: 86fbda0e-af15-4e37-a00f-d919588bb937 X-Archives-Hash: cd4c7c708e89edce0652181276894428 On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 05:23:13PM -0500, Michael Mol wrote: > > Then came the decision to move udev inside /usr, forcing the issue. > Now, it'd been long understood that udev *itself* hadn't been broken. > The explanation given as much as a year earlier was that udev couldn't > control what *other* packages gave it for rules scripts. OK, that's > not strictly udev's fault. That's the fault of packages being depended > on at too early a stage in the boot process. And, perhaps, hotplug > events for some devices _should_ be deferred until the proper > resources for handling it are available. I can think of at least a few > ways you could do that. And, yes, this was a problem systemd was > facing, and wasn't finding a way out of. (Why? I still don't know. > Maybe they didn't want to implement dependency declarations or demand > that packages impement partial functionality to reduce initial > dependencies.) You're stumbling upon it ... just keep hashing it out. The decision to write a new init system (systemd) and do things altogether differently is exactly what caused your previously referred to train wreck. And Kay Sievers collaborating with Lennart on this corrupted udev. Take those two prima donnas out of the udev destruction, and no such init problem exists today ... just as it didn't exist before then, for so many years. Linus didn't tolerate what they did to module and firmware loading: https://lkml.org/lkml/2012/10/2/303 and he placed the blame squarely on Lennart and Kay where it belongs. To quote Linus Torvalds: "What kind of insane udev maintainership do we have? And can we fix it?" Bank on it ... he *will* keep these prima donnas from destroying it. There's quite the historical precedent for such. -- Happy Penguin Computers >') 126 Fenco Drive ( \ Tupelo, MS 38801 ^^ support@happypenguincomputers.com 662-269-2706 662-205-6424 http://happypenguincomputers.com/ Don't top-post: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_post#Top-posting