From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1R1lCk-0006Av-G5 for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2011 20:28:10 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4AB1D21C262; Thu, 8 Sep 2011 20:27:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from karnak.local (cpc2-lutn10-2-0-cust603.9-3.cable.virginmedia.com [81.97.90.92]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 996AB21C1E9 for ; Thu, 8 Sep 2011 20:25:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by karnak.local (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B8603003 for ; Thu, 8 Sep 2011 21:25:38 +0100 (BST) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new using ClamAV at karnak.local Received: from karnak.local ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (karnak.local [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mDIRTElyDyLa for ; Thu, 8 Sep 2011 21:25:36 +0100 (BST) Received: from karnak.local (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by karnak.local (Postfix) with ESMTP id E03F53002 for ; Thu, 8 Sep 2011 21:25:36 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 21:25:31 +0100 From: David W Noon To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] /dev/sda* missing at boot Message-ID: <20110908212531.69422844@karnak.local> In-Reply-To: References: <201108191109.34984.michaelkintzios@gmail.com> <20110907050952.GA2588@linux1> <4E66FFFA.2020600@gmail.com> <201109071923.39954.Dan.Johansson@dmj.nu> <20110907235457.691be720@zaphod.digimed.co.uk> <20110908023729.45d1b985@karnak.local> <20110908174424.49e613b3@karnak.local> <20110908190500.05ebac1f@karnak.local> Organization: Luton Operatic Society X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.7.9 (GTK+ 2.24.4; i686-pc-linux-gnu) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=PGP-SHA1; boundary="Sig_/ZfcEG8HAdJRhe_fUwTkXucH"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Archives-Salt: X-Archives-Hash: 1e84157d6385cb41ab21b97628dba91d --Sig_/ZfcEG8HAdJRhe_fUwTkXucH Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, 8 Sep 2011 15:13:55 -0400, Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s wrote abou= t Re: [gentoo-user] /dev/sda* missing at boot: > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 2:05 PM, David W Noon > wrote: [snip] > > I don't know if the kernel offers any particular blessing to any > > hotplug handler. >=20 > udev is the device manager for the Linux kernel. It replaced devfs. One can use mdev just as readily as udev. > It's related, but doesn't (necessarily) need to be the same that the > user space part. >=20 > Yeah, udev is mandatory in the kernel, unless you use a traditional > /dev directory. But udev isn't actually part of the kernel. Only hotplug support is actually in the kernel. The udev daemon is started during the sysinit run-level and it connects itself to hotplug support. [snip] > >> Dracut automatizes this. Is a non-problem. > > > > If dracut actually worked ... >=20 > What doesn't work for you? Since dracut is not yet stable, I don't have any problems with it because I don't use it. But it does have quite a few open bugs in Gentoo's Bugzilla, and I suspect many more in other distro's bug trackers. > > During the "do stuff" phase, /usr is also writeable, which is > > undesirable on production systems. =C2=A0That's the *original* problem > > with merging a read-only /usr with /. [We seem to be going in > > circles with this one.] >=20 > It's the same when you upgrade the system. If you don't allow rw in > /user *ever*, then you are not allowed to upgrade. Which I was chewed > up because I said it was an alternative. Production systems have strictly scheduled change-control windows, usually only once or twice a year. Having to schedule database changes to match application change-control would not be workable. That is why /etc cannot be mounted read-only and still have /usr secured as read-only. This brings us back to a requirement that / and /usr be physically separate filesystems. [snip] > > I have about 6 or 7 backup jobs that run during the night and > > parse /etc/mtab to see if they need to place a copy of the backup > > onto an external medium. =C2=A0These examine the mount options and don't > > understand the non-standard options offered by Linux > > in /proc/mounts. >=20 > Really? You cannot grep -v those options to another file and make the > jobs read this other file? I would use gawk rather than grep. But since I have code that already works, why should I need to develop a new script? > In my experience that sounds like a problem with the jobs. They work currently. Moreover, my rootfs is not read-only. It is not desirable to have the rootfs mounted read-only because of this problem and the other problems it causes. But for production systems it is desirable for /usr to be mounted read-only and only made writeable during a change-control window. [snip] > > They already don't do that. >=20 > Well, then you already know what to do. Indeed I do. --=20 Regards, Dave [RLU #314465] *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* dwnoon@ntlworld.com (David W Noon) *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* --Sig_/ZfcEG8HAdJRhe_fUwTkXucH Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAk5pJMAACgkQc9/LpQ70v49wBgCglz17IJmZOjzX5jSKq8/eZS1A MeoAnjX/fRsRVURxTKQwLyVdg/AxHZD3 =zTNs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/ZfcEG8HAdJRhe_fUwTkXucH--