From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1N4L47-0001tB-MH for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 21:00:52 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 09D5CE07EB; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 21:00:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ew0-f222.google.com (mail-ew0-f222.google.com [209.85.219.222]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEDA8E07EB for ; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 21:00:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ewy22 with SMTP id 22so339859ewy.14 for ; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 14:00:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:from:to:subject:date :user-agent:references:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:message-id; bh=0a9vfHA3H0EXM581GOmNdT3xaNw9uJ8gKHhqpOCZiak=; b=VVVE5WsWCZRjXdFbmISYwGi9E7W4oV69qgtEXvVp7UVQ68WK7zM5JPFq4uHdFzT3W5 BqVK7xi3aSwd8cx3a1YRAWXZEzbpYcyqAHyDkLikN5+jrlV3Dtc1dMqdDZsL8IRE3+jg EJepnA6ytblkIMjQmBx3LvCCRmHuZEst1cejM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:message-id; b=Sll8nXU1M5wEX+uDe7p5jzgkezZ9zacQLL70HW3/Ev0x3u2q6sldgKmpzO3zBktXWO LIrJIyYkZB1mIn6sMFN3g3AaQbR0WopKg+Bf9n/o7//h2lL6sSa1x6gDUoCMJIav+cD2 CARRD95t307ZRpXxrrAyzekAZEeV1ceUN2kDg= Received: by 10.216.87.69 with SMTP id x47mr2293119wee.97.1257022849083; Sat, 31 Oct 2009 14:00:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nazgul.localnet (196-210-153-40-rrdg-esr-2.dynamic.isadsl.co.za [196.210.153.40]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 23sm759396eya.12.2009.10.31.14.00.47 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sat, 31 Oct 2009 14:00:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Alan McKinnon To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] More about hal Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 22:59:47 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.12.2 (Linux/2.6.31-zen5; KDE/4.3.2; x86_64; ; ) References: <87y6mrb9sn.fsf@newsguy.com> <4AEC9FD2.4090003@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <4AEC9FD2.4090003@gmail.com> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200910312259.48015.alan.mckinnon@gmail.com> X-Archives-Salt: ad24ed3d-0337-46ca-8d92-5960c6770ab0 X-Archives-Hash: 273c4272e731ce34d9ba208c55b2f0f3 On Saturday 31 October 2009 22:36:34 Dale wrote: > Harry Putnam wrote: > > When I noticed the thread here about `hal' that started a while back > > it caused me enough curiousity that i ran eix -Ic ^hal$ but found I > > have no `hal' installed. > > > > I have keep up with updates somewhat better than usual the last few > > months but don't remember when hal went away... I do remember having > > some trouble with keyboard/mouse, and hal not starting, but that was > > quite a while back. > > > > I don't remember making a conscious effort to get rid of hal either. > > > > Evey thing seems to work ok here. I do notice a problem on bootup > > where the keyboard/mouse I have attached to a KVM does not become > > usable until AFTER the grub prompt. Somewhere between there and the > > appearance of the login prompt it becomes usable. But that has gone > > on at least a yr if not longer. > > > > So is there something wrong if I have no hal installed. Is it just > > not necessary or has it been replaced? > > I think it goes to show that a computer can work fine without hal. > Somebody nudge the KDE folks. Doesn't KDE require hal? There's no valid technical reason why an app *must* use hal. An app can try and do all hardware detection by itself, but it just makes more sense to use one common layer for that rather than every app doing essentially the same action. KDE-4 itself does not directly require hal. Solid does though: $ equery depends hal * Searching for hal ... app-emulation/wine-1.1.32 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) app-laptop/laptop-mode-tools-1.52 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) app-misc/hal-cups-utils-0.6.19 (>=sys-apps/hal-0.5.10) app-misc/hal-info-20090716 (>=sys-apps/hal-0.5.10) kde-base/solid-4.3.2 (>=sys-apps/hal-0.5.9) media-gfx/gimp-2.6.7 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) media-libs/libgphoto2-2.4.7 (hal ? >=sys-apps/hal-0.5) media-libs/libgpod-0.7.2 (hal ? =sys-apps/hal-0.5*) media-video/gxine-0.5.903 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) media-video/vlc-1.0.3_rc (hal ? sys-apps/hal) net-misc/networkmanager-0.7.1_p20090824 (>=sys-apps/hal-0.5.10) sys-apps/pcsc-lite-1.5.5 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) sys-power/pm-utils-1.2.5 (>=sys-apps/hal-0.5.10) x11-base/xorg-server-1.7.1 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) x11-drivers/xf86-input-synaptics-1.2.0 (hal ? sys-apps/hal) x11-libs/e_dbus-9999 (sys-apps/hal) There's nothing wrong with the *idea* of hal; it's the implementation of that app that makes it an utter piece of shit. It's called "feature-creep". Even it's author knows this (but apparently many distros do not) which is why he deprecated hal and started over with devicekit. -- alan dot mckinnon at gmail dot com