From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1IBCHc-0008O5-Bi for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:21:48 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.14.0/8.14.0) with SMTP id l6IGKLQK013753; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:20:21 GMT Received: from ender.volumehost.net (adsl-69-154-123-202.dsl.fyvlar.swbell.net [69.154.123.202]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.14.0/8.14.0) with ESMTP id l6IGFhtH009187 for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:15:43 GMT Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ender.volumehost.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90FA0228C8 for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:15:42 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at volumehost.net Received: from ender.volumehost.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ender.volumehost.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id mU9lhFX140Du for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:15:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from adsl-69-154-123-205.dsl.fyvlar.swbell.net (adsl-69-154-123-205.dsl.fyvlar.swbell.net [69.154.123.205]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ender.volumehost.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2691226E6 for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2007 16:15:40 +0000 (UTC) From: "Boyd Stephen Smith Jr." To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] 2 to 3?? Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2007 11:15:25 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <14178ED3A898524FB036966D696494FB138F1E@messenger.cv63.navy.mil> <200707171227.23899.bss03@volumehost.net> <200707181438.35366.alan@linuxholdings.co.za> In-Reply-To: <200707181438.35366.alan@linuxholdings.co.za> X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart1681532.nkqGWTo5dd"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200707181115.25901.bss03@volumehost.net> X-Archives-Salt: a2c4ed83-75de-4349-b47b-5f2544ac2dee X-Archives-Hash: eae1e023b96b6538f5c9b3c60d08241b --nextPart1681532.nkqGWTo5dd Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Wednesday 18 July 2007, Alan McKinnon wrote=20 about 'Re: [gentoo-user] 2 to 3??': > On Tuesday 17 July 2007, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > > > The TiVo thing was completely within the word and spirit of the > > > GPL. > > > > It was *barely* within the word, and definitely not within the spirit > > of the GPL. =A0Don't beleive me? =A0Ask anyone at the FSF or RMS himsel= f. > > =A0They wrote the thing. > > TiVo did just that and got the A-OK signal and thumbs up from the FSF's > lawyers. That's because you *could* swap out the software on early TiVos. > Sometime later, someone had a hissy fit, FSF reversed their=20 > stated position and suddenly Tivo becomes spawn of satan. Because they started artificially limiting users' freedoms 0, 1, and=20 partially 3. > Tivo had no option, their content providers would never have given them > a license to redistribute content without the mods they did It's not my (or my community's, or my code's) job to support your business= =20 model. If you can't play by the license, then you can't use the software. > It's not the software that is crippled, it's the hardware. No, it's the software because they haven't given it all to us. For=20 software to run on the device it was *designed* to run on it's required to= =20 be signed; therefore, the signature is part of the binary and a derivative= =20 of a GPLv2 work. That work distributed presumably under the GPLv2, which=20 means the source ("preferred format for making modifications") must be=20 provided, and TiVo has not yet published the necessary tools for us to=20 generate our own signatures. They are therefore limiting freedom 1, which limits freedom 0, and=20 indirectly freedom 3, because the community cannot benefit. > So, in what way have Tivo removed people's freedom as > granted by the GPL? Artificially limiting freedoms 0, 1, and 3. The restriction is=20 fundamentally different from a RAM or HD space limit; a binary that does=20 nothing but play pong (well within the hardware capabilities of the TiVo)=20 is still not allowed to run without the signature. Personally, I think TiVo COULD be called out for violating GPLv2, but IANAL= =20 and Eben is and declined to file suit against them. Under the GPLv3,=20 users' freedoms are better protected, and it's quite clear that TiVo=20 would/will be in violation of that license. =2D-=20 Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. ,=3D ,-_-. =3D.=20 bss03@volumehost.net ((_/)o o(\_)) ICQ: 514984 YM/AIM: DaTwinkDaddy `-'(. .)`-'=20 http://iguanasuicide.org/ \_/ =20 --nextPart1681532.nkqGWTo5dd Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.5 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBGnjyd55pqL7G1QFkRAjE1AJsHZnrjro/MvOgyru+ilCX4NztZrwCeLBUp IV2cAGtiqvXFsRn+cYsjqTo= =fi3e -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart1681532.nkqGWTo5dd-- -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list