[gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Lord Sauron]

I dug out of this ancient computer book (Upgrading and Repairing PCs
12th Ed.) this relic technology of the Null Modem Cable.  It's a
twisted Parallel Cable that allows 2 PCs to almost literally talk to
each other.  So, I found in the depths of some old computer hardware
box this old Symantec null modem cable, plugged it between my X40 and
XP Desktop, and hoped for the best.  I was able to configure XP as the
host with no difficulties, however, I'm not sure what to do about
Linux.  I'm looking though Kuroo for things about Null Modems, but I'd
imagine there's a more command-line friendly way to do this, since I
am very much pro-command line.

I know there's always a way to dump commands into LPT1 and pray it
doesn't call the NSA, but I think there's a more elegant way to do
this.  The reason why I decided to play with this relic of computer
communications technology was because it said that it had the capacity
to run at 2MB/sec, which is faster than my networking... or at least
faster than my networking behaves.  I want to shell out about $50 and
get some gigabit ethernet junk from Frys one of these days, (I can
roll my own Cat5e, so it's not a difficult thing) but I just wanted to
test out this null modem stuff.

I honestly am harbouring delusions of using the faster null modem
stuff to directly sync my laptop with a future Linux CVS/Web server,
so that I can have a update of the whole smash in my laptop once a
day, rather than waiting for a slow internet connection remotely.
It's just an idea I'm playing around with, and playing around is good
(99% of the time, anyways).

Thanks for any suggestions of where to start looking.  I'll also be
grepping (sorry, googling) through the Gentoo Wiki, however I don't
expect I'd find anything in there, at least directly related.

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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Gerhard Hoogterp]

On Saturday 24 June 2006 21:49, Lord Sauron wrote:
> I dug out of this ancient computer book (Upgrading and Repairing PCs
> 12th Ed.) this relic technology of the Null Modem Cable.  It's a
> twisted Parallel Cable that allows 2 PCs to almost literally talk to
> each other. 

While there were cables using the parallel port for communication, they always 
needed special software to deal with this. A nul-modem though used to be 
serial and as such worked the normal tty stuff.

For parallel I remember that lantastic-z had a parallel cable and there was 
some other program under dos which used to use a parallel cable. Forgot the 
name, but maybe with a little google and dosbox you have a chance there..

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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Mick]

On 24/06/06, Gerhard Hoogterp <gerhard@frappe.xs4all.nl> wrote:

> While there were cables using the parallel port for communication, they always
> needed special software to deal with this. A nul-modem though used to be
> serial and as such worked the normal tty stuff.

That's right.  Null modems are used for serial connections (i.e. to a
serial console on your Linux box).  Between two machines you would
usually use a null modem cable and set up a new modem connection on
the OS software side so that they communicate using a common protocol,
e.g. tcp/ip.  To send files you could use X Y or Zmodem and a comms
application.

Not entirely sure what a command line approach would be (a getty or
anything that works over tcp/ip I guess?)

Have you looked at this:
http://www.vanemery.com/Linux/Serial/serial-console.html
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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Jerry McBride]

On Saturday 24 June 2006 15:49, Lord Sauron wrote:
> I dug out of this ancient computer book (Upgrading and Repairing PCs
> 12th Ed.) this relic technology of the Null Modem Cable.  It's a
> twisted Parallel Cable that allows 2 PCs to almost literally talk to
> each other.  So, I found in the depths of some old computer hardware
> box this old Symantec null modem cable, plugged it between my X40 and
> XP Desktop, and hoped for the best.  I was able to configure XP as the
> host with no difficulties, however, I'm not sure what to do about
> Linux.  I'm looking though Kuroo for things about Null Modems, but I'd
> imagine there's a more command-line friendly way to do this, since I
> am very much pro-command line.
>

---snip---

The problem you'll face is the protocols on both ends of the wire will have to 
be the same. That said, you won't have much luck. However, I ran a similar 
setup between two linux computers using plip... Something like a poor mans 
ethernet.

Good luck
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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Josh Helmer]

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On Saturday 24 June 2006 12:49 pm, Lord Sauron wrote:
> I honestly am harbouring delusions of using the faster null modem
> stuff to directly sync my laptop with a future Linux CVS/Web server,
> so that I can have a update of the whole smash in my laptop once a
> day, rather than waiting for a slow internet connection remotely.
> It's just an idea I'm playing around with, and playing around is good
> (99% of the time, anyways).

I used to setup linux-based embedded systems running agetty on the serial 
port.  That allowed us to connect to the machine with just a null-modem cable 
(Windows client using hyperterm usually) and login directly if the network 
went screwy.  

The thing I remember most about the whole process was that running over a 
serial connection was slow as molasses.  You need to set a baud rate on the 
line (the server and client must agree on the rate) and you basically get 
dial-up speeds.  If there is a way to coax 2Mb/s out of the thing I never 
found it.

If you are looking for a linux client, look for a program called kermit.   
It's been at least 5 years since I last used it, but I believe that is what 
we used to use.

Josh

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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Lord Sauron]

On 6/25/06, Josh Helmer <joshhelmer@cox.net> wrote:
> On Saturday 24 June 2006 12:49 pm, Lord Sauron wrote:
> > I honestly am harbouring delusions of using the faster null modem
> > stuff to directly sync my laptop with a future Linux CVS/Web server,
> > so that I can have a update of the whole smash in my laptop once a
> > day, rather than waiting for a slow internet connection remotely.
> > It's just an idea I'm playing around with, and playing around is good
> > (99% of the time, anyways).
>
> I used to setup linux-based embedded systems running agetty on the serial
> port.  That allowed us to connect to the machine with just a null-modem cable
> (Windows client using hyperterm usually) and login directly if the network
> went screwy.
>
> The thing I remember most about the whole process was that running over a
> serial connection was slow as molasses.  You need to set a baud rate on the
> line (the server and client must agree on the rate) and you basically get
> dial-up speeds.  If there is a way to coax 2Mb/s out of the thing I never
> found it.

I have it on extremely good authority that it goes 2MB/sec.

> If you are looking for a linux client, look for a program called kermit.
> It's been at least 5 years since I last used it, but I believe that is what
> we used to use.

I'll start looking for Kermit now.  Thanks.

-- 
========== GCv3.12 ==========
GCS d-(++) s+: a? C++ UL+>++++ P+
L++ E--- W+(+++) N++ o? K? w--- O? M+
V? PS- PE+ Y-(--) PGP- t+++ 5? X R tv-- b+
                DI+++ D+ G e* h- !r !y
========= END GCv3.12 ========
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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[John J. Foster]

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On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 12:46:16PM -0700, Lord Sauron wrote:

> I have it on extremely good authority that it goes 2MB/sec.
> 
it's always a good thing to question authority.

> I'll start looking for Kermit now.  Thanks.
> 
emerge -av kermit

later,
festus
-- 
It is not unusual for those at the wrong end of the club to have a
clearer picture of reality than those who wield it.
                                                      Noam Chomsky

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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Gerhard Hoogterp]

On Sunday 25 June 2006 22:02, John J. Foster wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 12:46:16PM -0700, Lord Sauron wrote:
> > I have it on extremely good authority that it goes 2MB/sec.
>
> it's always a good thing to question authority.

Well, the used protocol has to do with it too.. and what I remember from my 
BBS days is that kermit is extremely reliable and runs on more or less 
everything, but also that it does give a new meening to the word slow.. 
zmodem or even sealink would already improve a lot.. 

> > I'll start looking for Kermit now.  Thanks.
>
> emerge -av kermit

or net-dialup/lrzsz for x- yor z-modem.. (and forget x-modem.. it's as slow 
as..)



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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[John J. Foster]

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On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 10:20:39PM +0200, Gerhard Hoogterp wrote:
> On Sunday 25 June 2006 22:02, John J. Foster wrote:
> > On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 12:46:16PM -0700, Lord Sauron wrote:
> > > I have it on extremely good authority that it goes 2MB/sec.
> >
> > it's always a good thing to question authority.
> 
> Well, the used protocol has to do with it too.. and what I remember from my 
> BBS days is that kermit is extremely reliable and runs on more or less 
> everything, but also that it does give a new meening to the word slow.. 
> zmodem or even sealink would already improve a lot.. 
> 
Man, this thread hurts. I _had_ forgotten fighting kermit to communicate
to a Prime 650 (running Primos 18 something I think). God that was
awful!

later,
festus
-- 
It is not unusual for those at the wrong end of the club to have a
clearer picture of reality than those who wield it.
                                                      Noam Chomsky

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Re: [gentoo-user] Null Modem Cables Between Windoze XP and Linux

[Daniel Iliev]

Minicom is also a program that works OK.
Another approach would be to run ppp over the serial line  and make the windows log
into the Linux dial-in server. (actually its the way ISPs worked with modem users
years ago)

But if that's not a matter of pure testing I'd say its a waste of time for
transfering files. You can make/get yourself a crossover cable and connect the
machines through their LAN Cards over Ethernet at speed near 100mbits/s. It's the
thing I would do.

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Best regards,
Daniel

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