[gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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I'm in over my head---bigtime. Trying to install a good gentoo setup, to
configure xorg where I have been forced to use the last working video card
in my parts box: a matrox mystique. The system is ok, with A7V600 MB, 512 MB
RAM, and an Athlon XP 2600+. Video is corrupted using Gentoo, no matter what
I've thought of to do. An Ubuntu partition on this box runs this video card
quite well.

I gather that there was a bug in the mga drivers some time ago, and it
appears that the xorg drivers have incorporated the patches I have seen
during my google searches.

I do wonder what to do about framebuffers, though. Tiring of the battle,
after many years of avoiding framebuffers, I finally turned on every
possible framebuffer related option in the kernel, recompiled the kernel,
installed, and ... the machine refused to boot. So I cobbled the system back
together and recompiled, and the system is back to the corruption issues
again. I do note that Ubuntu has some framebuffer modules loaded, and I
would like to learn just how this framebuffer might make my life any easier.
Can someone point to a description of the use of framebuffers? Why does
Gentoo include a no framebuffer kernel on the installation CDs? Is it
adviseable to use fb with the matrox driver on an x86 system?

Description: when scrolling the buffer, some lines are doubled, some are
lost, and using Firefox at least, when I type Ctrl-L, the frame displays
properly until it is scrolled again. I have found descriptions of similar
issues on the Inet, but nothing that has helped get my system to work
properly. Does this symptom ring a bell with anyone?

Thank you for any advice or pointers.

Gentoo is fantastic.

Alan Davis

I

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Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Bob Sanders]

On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 20:50:14 +1000
"Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:

> I gather that there was a bug in the mga drivers some time ago, and it
> appears that the xorg drivers have incorporated the patches I have seen
> during my google searches.
> 

I had one running on Gentoo last year, before the motherboard on an
800 MHz Athlon Slot-A died.  X ran fine.

> I do wonder what to do about framebuffers, though. Tiring of the battle,
> after many years of avoiding framebuffers, 

Have you tried just using - vesa?  Or vga?  It should work.  Turning on everything 
is always a sure way to break a kernel.

> 
> Description: when scrolling the buffer, some lines are doubled, some are
> lost, and using Firefox at least, when I type Ctrl-L, the frame displays
> properly until it is scrolled again. I have found descriptions of similar
> issues on the Inet, but nothing that has helped get my system to work
> properly. Does this symptom ring a bell with anyone?
>

Generally, it's because the gfx card can't refresh from it's internal memory fast enough.
As I recall, the Mystique had an optional memory module, which I have on mine.  Perhaps
its just that your trying to use too high a resolution and hitting the cards performance
limits?

With due respect, save up your pennies and get a current Gfx card.  Should be around
US$42.   Sure, that's a months wages in some parts of the world.  But still - throwing a massively
powerful processor in a system with a dead-end Gfx card is kind of wasteful, unless you're making
this thing into a server. 

Bob 
-  
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gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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Bob:

Your comments are extremely useful. However much I would like to get a newer
graphics card, I am stuck with this one for a few weeks at least. It works
well on an Ubuntu system on a different partition.

How would you recommend to go about trying vesa. That may be what Ubuntu is
doing. Turn on vesa framebuffer?

I backed down to 1024xsomething: vertical lines were scalloped/wavy. Someone
mentioned this would be a timing issue, but I don't know what I'd do to
microadjust timing? xvidtune? I'll try it.

Thanks again.

Alan

On 11/17/05, Bob Sanders <rmsand@concentric.net> wrote:
>
>
> Have you tried just using - vesa? Or vga? It should work. Turning on
> everything
> is always a sure way to break a kernel.
>
> >
> > Description: when scrolling the buffer, some lines are doubled, some are
> > lost, and using Firefox at least, when I type Ctrl-L, the frame displays
> > properly until it is scrolled again. I have found descriptions of
> similar
> > issues on the Inet, but nothing that has helped get my system to work
> > properly. Does this symptom ring a bell with anyone?
> >
>
> Generally, it's because the gfx card can't refresh from it's internal
> memory fast enough.
> As I recall, the Mystique had an optional memory module, which I have on
> mine. Perhaps
> its just that your trying to use too high a resolution and hitting the
> cards performance
> limits?
>
> With due respect, save up your pennies and get a current Gfx card. Should
> be around
> US$42. Sure, that's a months wages in some parts of the world. But still -
> throwing a massively
> powerful processor in a system with a dead-end Gfx card is kind of
> wasteful, unless you're making
> this thing into a server.
>
> Bob
> -
> --
> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Bob Sanders]

On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:56:18 +1000
"Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> How would you recommend to go about trying vesa. That may be what Ubuntu is
> doing. Turn on vesa framebuffer?
> 

Yes.  Under - Device Driver -->  Graphics support --> Select VESA VGA graphics support
	The further down in the Gfx support section --> Console Display Driver Support -->
								<*> VGA text console
								<*> Video mode selection support
								<*> Framebuffer Console support

> I backed down to 1024xsomething: vertical lines were scalloped/wavy. Someone
> mentioned this would be a timing issue, but I don't know what I'd do to
> microadjust timing? xvidtune? I'll try it.
> 

Yes, xvidtune.  Also, it mught be useful to download the mga.o from Matrox and
follow the instructions to replace the one in /usr/X11R6/lib/modules (if I recall
the path correctly).

Bob
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gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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On 11/18/05, Bob Sanders <rmsand@concentric.net> wrote:
>
> Also, it mught be useful to download the mga.o from Matrox and
> follow the instructions to replace the one in /usr/X11R6/lib/modules (if I
> recall
> the path correctly).
>

I did download this driver, and when I installed, a message was generated
that the version was wrong. Maybe I'll try again, and just install it
anyway.

Thanks again. I'll try these ideas.

Alan

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Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Bob Sanders]

On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:11:58 +1000
"Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:


> I did download this driver, and when I installed, a message was generated
> that the version was wrong. Maybe I'll try again, and just install it
> anyway.
> 

I wonder if the HAL use flag needs to be set to use the driver?  It's a new USE flag this
year and may cause a re-compile of Xorg if an emerge -uDNav world is done after
setting it.

Bob
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-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Walter Dnes]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 12:56:18AM +1000, Alan E. Davis wrote

> I backed down to 1024xsomething: vertical lines were scalloped/wavy.
> Someone mentioned this would be a timing issue, but I don't know
> what I'd do to microadjust timing? xvidtune? I'll try it.

  There are two set of constraints...

  1) See the page http://koala.ilog.fr/cgi-bin/nph-colas-modelines which
can generate custom modelines for you system.  You need to know the max
and min frquencies (horizontal and verticl) for your monitor.  I've
managed to get 2048x1536 running on my NEC Multisync95... wheeeeee!!!

  2) You mentioned it was an ancient card.  How much RAM does it have?
Under X, here are the RAM requirements...
   8 bit colour (256 colours) => 1 byte per pixel
  16 bit colour (65536 colours) => 2 bytes per pixel
  24 bit colour (16777216 colours) = 4 (yes, *FOUR*) bytes per pixel.
A 1-megabyte video card will give 1152 x 864 at 256 colours or 800 x 600
at 65536 colours.

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> In linux /sbin/init is Job #1
My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[kashani]

Walter Dnes wrote:
>   2) You mentioned it was an ancient card.  How much RAM does it have?
> Under X, here are the RAM requirements...
>    8 bit colour (256 colours) => 1 byte per pixel
>   16 bit colour (65536 colours) => 2 bytes per pixel
>   24 bit colour (16777216 colours) = 4 (yes, *FOUR*) bytes per pixel.
> A 1-megabyte video card will give 1152 x 864 at 256 colours or 800 x 600
> at 65536 colours.
> 

The Mystique has 4mb of RAM upgradeable to 8mb IIRC. It was likely new 
in '95-'96 as I scraped together $140 to by the slightly better Matrox 
Millennium used off Ebay in '96. The Mystique did not do well at higher 
resolutions, which is why I went with the Millennium. I'd shoot for 
800x600 and go from there.

kashani
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Hans-Werner Hilse]

Hi,

On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:56:18 +1000
"Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:

> I backed down to 1024xsomething: vertical lines were scalloped/wavy. Someone
> mentioned this would be a timing issue, but I don't know what I'd do to
> microadjust timing? xvidtune? I'll try it.

That won't help. I'm currently using a mystique and am having the very
same problem. It's _very_ easy to circumvent but requires a recompile
of xorg. The fix still hasn't made it into xorg CVS. Maybe time to
write another bug report. But i think I remember having written one for
XFree86, which behaved the same way. I was told that it was merely a
timing issue but AFAIK this isn't configurable und it was fixed in 4.5.
But I never tried that out.

To "fix" the issue, I usually did the following:
1. $ emerge xorg-x11
   waited after the moment when everything is unpacked and patched and hit CTRL-Z
2. $ vi /var/tmp/portage/xorg-x11.../work/xc/programs/Xserver/hw/xfree86/drivers/mga/mga_storm.c

search for the lines:
|/* MGAISBUSY() reportedly causes a freeze for Mystique revision 2 and older */
|    if (!(pMga->Chipset == PCI_CHIP_MGA1064 && (pMga->ChipRev >= 0 && pMga->ChipRev <= 2)))
|        while(MGAISBUSY());

Reading the comment exactly, it is easy to fix it (i.e. it couldn't work for Rev. 2):
|    if (!(pMga->Chipset == PCI_CHIP_MGA1064 && (pMga->ChipRev >= 0 && pMga->ChipRev < 2)))
(i.e., changing "<= 2" to "< 2")

3. $ fg
   to continue the suspended emerge job

I'd suggest making a binary package and saving it somewhere...


-hwh
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gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Walter Dnes]

On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 11:57:12PM -0600, kashani wrote

> The Mystique has 4mb of RAM upgradeable to 8mb IIRC. It was likely
> new in '95-'96 as I scraped together $140 to by the slightly better
> Matrox Millennium used off Ebay in '96. The Mystique did not do well
> at higher resolutions, which is why I went with the Millennium. I'd
> shoot for 800x600 and go from there.

  1024x768 at 24bits (16 million colours) should be doable.

-- 
Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> In linux /sbin/init is Job #1
My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca
-- 
gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list

Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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I think Hans's idea makes sense, since it was the file storm.c that was
patched in the first place by others. I'll have to wait, because I've
started a new gentoo install due to problems detecting the /boot partition
in my machine. I botched an attempt to move data from that partition to the
/ partition.

I have been able to do 1064x768 at 16 or 24 bits. Even 1100something x
something worked, perhaps not as perfectly.

Thank you for so many great answers, in great depth. I will see what comes
about in a day or two. It's tricky to do this on a dialup.

Alan Davis

On 11/20/05, Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 11:57:12PM -0600, kashani wrote
>
> > The Mystique has 4mb of RAM upgradeable to 8mb IIRC. It was likely0
> > new in '95-'96 as I scraped together $140 to by the slightly better
> > Matrox Millennium used off Ebay in '96. The Mystique did not do well
> > at higher resolutions, which is why I went with the Millennium. I'd
> > shoot for 800x600 and go from there.
>
> 1024x768 at 24bits (16 million colours) should be doable.
>
> --
> Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> In linux /sbin/init is Job #1
> My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca
> --
> gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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Following up:  The solution proposed by Hans was somewhat successful.  The
buffer update problem has apparently been solved  at a higher  of 1024x768.

Wavy vertical lines are still evident.  This I can ignore, however.   At 862

On 11/21/05, Alan E. Davis <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I think Hans's idea makes sense, since it was the file storm.c that was
> patched in the first place by others.  I'll have to wait, because I've
> started a new gentoo install due to problems detecting the /boot partition
> in my machine.  I botched an attempt to move data from that partition to the
> / partition.
>
> I have been able to do 1064x768 at 16 or 24 bits.  Even 1100something x
> something worked, perhaps not as perfectly.
>
> Thank you for so many great answers, in great depth.  I will see what
> comes about in a day or two.  It's tricky to do this on a dialup.
>
> Alan Davis
>
> On 11/20/05, Walter Dnes <waltdnes@waltdnes.org> wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 11:57:12PM -0600, kashani wrote
> >
> > > The Mystique has 4mb of RAM upgradeable to 8mb IIRC. It was likely0
> > > new in '95-'96 as I scraped together $140 to by the slightly better
> > > Matrox Millennium used off Ebay in '96. The Mystique did not do well
> > > at higher resolutions, which is why I went with the Millennium. I'd
> > > shoot for 800x600 and go from there.
> >
> >   1024x768 at 24bits (16 million colours) should be doable.
> >
> > --
> > Walter Dnes < waltdnes@waltdnes.org> In linux /sbin/init is Job #1
> > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca
> > --
> > gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> >
> >
>

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Re: [gentoo-user] Dinosaur Matrox Mystique: corruption

[Alan E. Davis]

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More information: at a lower clock, even at 1024x768 the lines seem to be
less of a problem.  At 832x624, this artifact is not apparent.

Thank you for all the help.

Alan

On 11/25/05, Alan E. Davis <lngndvs@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Following up:  The solution proposed by Hans was somewhat successful.  The
> buffer update problem has apparently been solved  at a higher  of 1024x768.
>
> Wavy vertical lines are still evident.  This I can ignore, however.   At
> 862
> On 11/21/05, Alan E. Davis <lngndvs@gmail.com > wrote:
> >
> > I think Hans's idea makes sense, since it was the file storm.c that was
> > patched in the first place by others.  I'll have to wait, because I've
> > started a new gentoo install due to problems detecting the /boot partition
> > in my machine.  I botched an attempt to move data from that partition to the
> > / partition.
> >
> > I have been able to do 1064x768 at 16 or 24 bits.  Even 1100something x
> > something worked, perhaps not as perfectly.
> >
> > Thank you for so many great answers, in great depth.  I will see what
> > comes about in a day or two.  It's tricky to do this on a dialup.
> >
> > Alan Davis
> >
> > On 11/20/05, Walter Dnes < waltdnes@waltdnes.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Fri, Nov 18, 2005 at 11:57:12PM -0600, kashani wrote
> > >
> > > > The Mystique has 4mb of RAM upgradeable to 8mb IIRC. It was likely0
> > > > new in '95-'96 as I scraped together $140 to by the slightly better
> > > > Matrox Millennium used off Ebay in '96. The Mystique did not do well
> > >
> > > > at higher resolutions, which is why I went with the Millennium. I'd
> > > > shoot for 800x600 and go from there.
> > >
> > >   1024x768 at 24bits (16 million colours) should be doable.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Walter Dnes < waltdnes@waltdnes.org> In linux /sbin/init is Job #1
> > > My musings on technology and security at http://tech_sec.blog.ca
> > > --
> > > gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
> > >
> > >
> >
>

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