Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Is gnome becoming obligatory?

["J. Roeleveld" <joost@antarean.org>]

On Friday, December 15, 2017 4:05:41 AM CET Kai Krakow wrote:
> Am Thu, 14 Dec 2017 08:54:59 +0100 schrieb J. Roeleveld:
> >> Some historical correctnesses about Canek:
> >> 
> >> - He has been here for years - He has contributed here for years - He
> >> supports systemd and has offered more help and explanation about
> >> systemd to it's users on this list than any other single person, bar
> >> none - He has never, not once, slagged off SysV Init, OpenRC or any
> >> other init system, ot the creators or the users - He has never posted
> >> rude or inflamatory comments about anyone arguing against him - He has
> >> never resorted to ad-hominem and never posted any knee jerk opinions
> >> about any other poster wrt their stance on init systems
> > 
> > +1 I may not agree with Canek on all things:
> > - I do dislike systemd, especially on Centos where disabling services
> > doesn't always work past a reboot
> 
> Well, I think you're falling the pitfall expecting "disable" makes a unit
> unstartable. That is not the case. Disabling a unit only removes it from
> the list of units starting on your own intent. It can still be pulled it
> as a (required) dependency.

Makes sense

> If you really want it never being started, you need to mask the unit.
> It's then no longer visible to the dependency resolver as if it were not
> installed at all.

This is not listed anywhere easy to find in google.

> The verbs disable and enable are arguably a bit misleading, while the
> verbs mask and unmask are not really obvious. But if you think of it, it
> actually makes sense.

Actually, it doesn't. But lets not discuss naming conventions. A lot of tools 
have ones where I fail to see the logic.
It's a shame that option is not easily findable. And not knowing it exists, 
means checking man-pages and googling for them doesn't happen either.

> If you "rc-update del" a service, you wouldn't
> prevent it from being started neither, just because OpenRC is still able
> to pull it in as a dependency.

True, except with OpenRC, all the config is located together. Not mostly in /
usr/.... somewhere with overrides in /etc/...
I dislike all tools that split their config in this way.

> So it's actually not an argument for why you'd dislike systemd. ;-)

The lack of easily findable documentation on how to stop a service from 
starting, even as a dependency, is a reason. (not singularly against systemd).
Systemd, however, has an alternative.

--
Joost