From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DECC8138E20 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 20:31:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 91CFFE0EE7; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 20:30:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtpq2.tb.mail.iss.as9143.net (smtpq2.tb.mail.iss.as9143.net [212.54.42.165]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 842FDE0EE1 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 20:30:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [212.54.42.136] (helo=smtp5.tb.mail.iss.as9143.net) by smtpq2.tb.mail.iss.as9143.net with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WGwkK-0004dZ-K8 for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:30:56 +0100 Received: from 53579160.cm-6-8c.dynamic.ziggo.nl ([83.87.145.96] helo=data.antarean.org) by smtp5.tb.mail.iss.as9143.net with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WGwkJ-0000CH-C9 for gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:30:56 +0100 Received: from www.antarean.org (net.lan.antarean.org [10.20.13.13]) by data.antarean.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB48D4B for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:30:26 +0100 (CET) Received: from 10.55.16.19 (SquirrelMail authenticated user joost) by www.antarean.org with HTTP; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:30:26 +0100 Message-ID: <07e951d3b8ab89a11b8d471ceecd31ce.squirrel@www.antarean.org> In-Reply-To: References: <52FF84CE.2050301@libertytrek.org> <52FF9D58.3000608@libertytrek.org> <201402152023.10543.michaelkintzios@gmail.com> <5300DD51.5060207@libertytrek.org> <53010A8E.2050909@googlemail.com> <53012691.6040503@googlemail.com> <5ea6afc66880871ddec1398bab1e1f17.squirrel@www.antarean.org> <31f183759cbab018caa5523ab4974175.squirrel@www.antarean.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:30:26 +0100 Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Debian just voted in systemd for default init system in jessie From: "J. Roeleveld" To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.22 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Ziggo-spambar: + X-Ziggo-spamscore: 1.2 X-Ziggo-spamreport: BAYES_50=0.8,RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.982,RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.574 X-Ziggo-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Status: No X-Spam-Flag: No X-Archives-Salt: b81709b6-aae3-407d-a11e-58e44c4d939b X-Archives-Hash: 1266375731b4131490193373e3483cee On Thu, February 20, 2014 06:24, Canek Pel=C3=A1ez Vald=C3=A9s wrote: > On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 2:50 AM, J. Roeleveld wrot= e: >> On Tue, February 18, 2014 15:37, Canek Pel=C3=83=C2=A1ez Vald=C3=83=C2= =A9s wrote: >>> On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 3:54 AM, J. Roeleveld >>> wrote: >> Same question applies, can I disable these code-paths during >> compile-time? > > No you can't; if you wanted the journal to work exactly as rsyslog (or > syslog-ng), then there is no reason to use the journal. Its raison > d'=C3=AAtre is the new features it brings. > > If you don't want those features, don't use the journal. Which means, don't use systemd, as it's all or nothing there. >> I do not see the need to have to spend time to change working code to = be >> able to handle different formats. > > Well, I prefer it when someone does the work for me. So do I, but I doubt the systemd developers are willing to change all my scripts and monitoring tools to work with systemd. >> Additionally, the use of "tail -f" and "grep" allows me to check the >> logs >> real-time for debugging purposes. > > journalctl -f > > Checks the logs in real time. Again, [1]. > >> Having to use a seperate tool that converts some proprietary binary >> format >> to human readable/scriptable single-line logs makes no sense. > > Its not proprietary; the source code is available, you can write your > own parser if you want. The binary format is to be able to do O(log n) > searches, that's it. It's a performance optimization. The specification for Office Open XML is also available. I do not see Libreoffice or Openoffice properly supporting that yet either, even thoug= h there is great demand and a large development team (with sufficient financing) available. >> It all sounds too much like the MS Windows Event-viewer to me. > > Never used it. It's a binary, indexed logging system that is part of the OS. Sounds similar to journald. >> Too many events with no usefull logging information (And I am referrin= g >> to >> OS-level messages as to why default services are not starting) > > systemctl status apache2.service > > (see [2]) will print the status of the Apache web server, and also the > last lines from the logs. You can control how many lines. You can > check also with the journal, as I showed up. /etc/init.d/apache2 status will also tell me if it is running. And which logs? On a host with only 1 domain pointing to it, I have 6 logfiles for apache= . And that is the default configuration. And what I was referring to was the useless info found in the event-log for services that are not written to actually use it. -- Joost