[gentoo-server] Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[gentoo-server] Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Pandu Poluan]

So, anyone have any experience using kernel 3.0 as Xen Dom0?

(I have some idea of starting a Gentoo-variant-based Xen platform in
the vein of XCP/XenServer)

Rgds,


-- 
--
Pandu E Poluan - IT Optimizer
My website: http://pandu.poluan.info/

Re: [gentoo-server] Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Saturday, August 13, 2011 04:15:44 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
> So, anyone have any experience using kernel 3.0 as Xen Dom0?

Not yet, it is in the todo-list though.
Just waiting for a period where I can do the upgrade and afford a down-time 
with restoring backups if things go wrong.

> (I have some idea of starting a Gentoo-variant-based Xen platform in
> the vein of XCP/XenServer)

What exactly are you thinking of implementing?

--
Joost

[gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Pandu Poluan]

(Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)

I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P

Okay, more seriously: Since Dom0 must be as efficient as possible, I
personally think Gentoo should be one of the best.

The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
*initially*, etc.

That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
'submetadistro', if you will :P

Just some daydream, please don't flame or ridicule me :)

Rgds,


On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> On Saturday, August 13, 2011 04:15:44 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>> So, anyone have any experience using kernel 3.0 as Xen Dom0?
>
> Not yet, it is in the todo-list though.
> Just waiting for a period where I can do the upgrade and afford a down-time
> with restoring backups if things go wrong.
>
>> (I have some idea of starting a Gentoo-variant-based Xen platform in
>> the vein of XCP/XenServer)
>
> What exactly are you thinking of implementing?
>
> --
> Joost
>
>


-- 
--
Pandu E Poluan - IT Optimizer
My website: http://pandu.poluan.info/

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:

> Rgds,
> 
> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> > On Saturday, August 13, 2011 04:15:44 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
> >> So, anyone have any experience using kernel 3.0 as Xen Dom0?
> > 
> > Not yet, it is in the todo-list though.
> > Just waiting for a period where I can do the upgrade and afford a
> > down-time with restoring backups if things go wrong.
> > 
> >> (I have some idea of starting a Gentoo-variant-based Xen platform in
> >> the vein of XCP/XenServer)
> > 
> > What exactly are you thinking of implementing?
> > 

> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)

(Fixed this for you)

> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P

A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet though.

> Okay, more seriously: Since Dom0 must be as efficient as possible, I
> personally think Gentoo should be one of the best.

With Dom0 only containing the bare minimum to function, yes, I would agree.

> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
> *initially*, etc.

I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates would 
help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
- File
- LVM
- physical partitions

> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
> 'submetadistro', if you will :P

A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....) as 
required.

> Just some daydream, please don't flame or ridicule me :)

Apart from the name, I think it's a good idea and I would be willing to work 
on this as well.

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Pandu Poluan]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>
>> Rgds,
>>
>> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>> > On Saturday, August 13, 2011 04:15:44 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>> >> So, anyone have any experience using kernel 3.0 as Xen Dom0?
>> >
>> > Not yet, it is in the todo-list though.
>> > Just waiting for a period where I can do the upgrade and afford a
>> > down-time with restoring backups if things go wrong.
>> >
>> >> (I have some idea of starting a Gentoo-variant-based Xen platform in
>> >> the vein of XCP/XenServer)
>> >
>> > What exactly are you thinking of implementing?
>> >
>
>> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)
>
> (Fixed this for you)
>
>> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
>> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P
>
> A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet though.
>

No worry. I know it sounds too... wishy-washy/unserious.

Had originally wanted to call it "Xentoo", but some might mistake it
for Xen2, or worse Xen 2.0.

Ah well... We'll think of something later :-)

>> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
>> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
>> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
>> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
>> *initially*, etc.
>
> I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates would
> help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
> - File
> - LVM
> - physical partitions
>

By domU here, do you mean Gentoo domU's or general domU's?

Citrix XenServer's 'template' feature comes to mind...

>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
>
> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....) as
> required.
>

Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.

Rgds,
-- 
FdS Pandu E Poluan
~ IT Optimizer ~

 • Blog : http://pepoluan.tumblr.com
 • Linked-In : http://id.linkedin.com/in/pepoluan

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[J. Roeleveld]

On Mon, August 15, 2011 8:18 am, Pandu Poluan wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>> On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>
>>> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)
>>
>> (Fixed this for you)
>>
>>> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
>>> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P
>>
>> A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet
>> though.
>>
>
> No worry. I know it sounds too... wishy-washy/unserious.
>
> Had originally wanted to call it "Xentoo", but some might mistake it
> for Xen2, or worse Xen 2.0.
>
> Ah well... We'll think of something later :-)

Xentoo doesn't sound too bad, actually.

>>> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
>>> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
>>> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
>>> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
>>> *initially*, etc.
>>
>> I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates
>> would
>> help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
>> - File
>> - LVM
>> - physical partitions
>
> By domU here, do you mean Gentoo domU's or general domU's?

Any domU. As far as I am aware, any domU can be configured to use any
block-backend for the partitions/drives.

> Citrix XenServer's 'template' feature comes to mind...

Along with cloning/copying/export/....?
VMWare ESX has similar options.

>>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
>>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
>>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
>>
>> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....) as
>> required.
>
> Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.

That way we can also set default USE-flags suitable for when using Xen.

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Pandu Poluan]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 16:08, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> On Mon, August 15, 2011 8:18 am, Pandu Poluan wrote:
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>> On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>>> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)
>>>
>>> (Fixed this for you)
>>>
>>>> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
>>>> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P
>>>
>>> A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet
>>> though.
>>>
>>
>> No worry. I know it sounds too... wishy-washy/unserious.
>>
>> Had originally wanted to call it "Xentoo", but some might mistake it
>> for Xen2, or worse Xen 2.0.
>>
>> Ah well... We'll think of something later :-)
>
> Xentoo doesn't sound too bad, actually.
>
>>>> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
>>>> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
>>>> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
>>>> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
>>>> *initially*, etc.
>>>
>>> I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates
>>> would
>>> help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
>>> - File
>>> - LVM
>>> - physical partitions
>>
>> By domU here, do you mean Gentoo domU's or general domU's?
>
> Any domU. As far as I am aware, any domU can be configured to use any
> block-backend for the partitions/drives.
>
>> Citrix XenServer's 'template' feature comes to mind...
>
> Along with cloning/copying/export/....?
> VMWare ESX has similar options.
>

Cloning/copying, check (both "fast storage-based clone" and "full copy")

Export, check.

Move/migrate, check.

If we want similar features, we really should learn about XCP & XAPI
[http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XAPI_Developer_Guide]

XCP is Citrix XenServer's "engine", released free a couple of months ago.

XAPI is the 'smartness' of XenServer, and thus a part of XCP
[http://xen.org/products/cloudxen.html]

>>>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
>>>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
>>>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
>>>
>>> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....) as
>>> required.
>>
>> Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.
>
> That way we can also set default USE-flags suitable for when using Xen.
>

Gotcha :-)

I'm going to try out on my company's VMware boxes (the guys at
xen-users said that Xen runs okay on VMware, albeit without HVM domU
support).

Rgds,
-- 
FdS Pandu E Poluan
~ IT Optimizer ~

 • Blog : http://pepoluan.tumblr.com
 • Linked-In : http://id.linkedin.com/in/pepoluan

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[J. Roeleveld]

On Mon, August 15, 2011 2:22 pm, Pandu Poluan wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 16:08, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>> On Mon, August 15, 2011 8:18 am, Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>>>> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)
>>>>
>>>> (Fixed this for you)
>>>>
>>>>> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
>>>>> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P
>>>>
>>>> A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet
>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>
>>> No worry. I know it sounds too... wishy-washy/unserious.
>>>
>>> Had originally wanted to call it "Xentoo", but some might mistake it
>>> for Xen2, or worse Xen 2.0.
>>>
>>> Ah well... We'll think of something later :-)
>>
>> Xentoo doesn't sound too bad, actually.
>>
>>>>> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
>>>>> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
>>>>> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
>>>>> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
>>>>> *initially*, etc.
>>>>
>>>> I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates
>>>> would
>>>> help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
>>>> - File
>>>> - LVM
>>>> - physical partitions
>>>
>>> By domU here, do you mean Gentoo domU's or general domU's?
>>
>> Any domU. As far as I am aware, any domU can be configured to use any
>> block-backend for the partitions/drives.
>>
>>> Citrix XenServer's 'template' feature comes to mind...
>>
>> Along with cloning/copying/export/....?
>> VMWare ESX has similar options.
>>
>
> Cloning/copying, check (both "fast storage-based clone" and "full copy")
>
> Export, check.
>
> Move/migrate, check.
>
> If we want similar features, we really should learn about XCP & XAPI
> [http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XAPI_Developer_Guide]
>
> XCP is Citrix XenServer's "engine", released free a couple of months ago.
>
> XAPI is the 'smartness' of XenServer, and thus a part of XCP
> [http://xen.org/products/cloudxen.html]

Check...

>>>>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
>>>>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
>>>>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
>>>>
>>>> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....)
>>>> as
>>>> required.
>>>
>>> Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.
>>
>> That way we can also set default USE-flags suitable for when using Xen.
>>
>
> Gotcha :-)
>
> I'm going to try out on my company's VMware boxes (the guys at
> xen-users said that Xen runs okay on VMware, albeit without HVM domU
> support).

I think starting with a list of packages and use-flags needed to get PV
and HVM domains running would be a good starting point.
Then, we can put that into a profile and create a stage4 tar-file with
current versions.

I think it would be a good idea to try to continue on this with the
maintainers for Xen on Gentoo?

--
Joost

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Pandu Poluan]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 19:47, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> On Mon, August 15, 2011 2:22 pm, Pandu Poluan wrote:
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 16:08, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>> On Mon, August 15, 2011 8:18 am, Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> On Sunday, August 14, 2011 07:20:18 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
>>>>>> On 2011-08-14, Joost Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> (Sorry for top-posting. Gmail Java mobile client sucks.)
>>>>>
>>>>> (Fixed this for you)
>>>>>
>>>>>> I was thinking of something similar to XCP ... but with Gentoo as the
>>>>>> Dom0. I'll call it GeDZux (Gentoo Domain Zero Linux) :P
>>>>>
>>>>> A different name would be prefered by myself, not got an idea yet
>>>>> though.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No worry. I know it sounds too... wishy-washy/unserious.
>>>>
>>>> Had originally wanted to call it "Xentoo", but some might mistake it
>>>> for Xen2, or worse Xen 2.0.
>>>>
>>>> Ah well... We'll think of something later :-)
>>>
>>> Xentoo doesn't sound too bad, actually.
>>>
>>>>>> The problem would be how to 'streamline' the installation of a
>>>>>> GeDZux-based Xen Platform. The SysAdmin already has lots of things to
>>>>>> think about; he/she doesn't need to think (too much) about which USE
>>>>>> flags to use, what CFLAGS to put in, which packages to emerge
>>>>>> *initially*, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree, tools to quickly generate/close new domUs based on templates
>>>>> would
>>>>> help as well. With different options for where the disks are stored:
>>>>> - File
>>>>> - LVM
>>>>> - physical partitions
>>>>
>>>> By domU here, do you mean Gentoo domU's or general domU's?
>>>
>>> Any domU. As far as I am aware, any domU can be configured to use any
>>> block-backend for the partitions/drives.
>>>
>>>> Citrix XenServer's 'template' feature comes to mind...
>>>
>>> Along with cloning/copying/export/....?
>>> VMWare ESX has similar options.
>>>
>>
>> Cloning/copying, check (both "fast storage-based clone" and "full copy")
>>
>> Export, check.
>>
>> Move/migrate, check.
>>
>> If we want similar features, we really should learn about XCP & XAPI
>> [http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XAPI_Developer_Guide]
>>
>> XCP is Citrix XenServer's "engine", released free a couple of months ago.
>>
>> XAPI is the 'smartness' of XenServer, and thus a part of XCP
>> [http://xen.org/products/cloudxen.html]
>
> Check...
>
>>>>>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
>>>>>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo variant, a
>>>>>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
>>>>>
>>>>> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel, bridge,....)
>>>>> as
>>>>> required.
>>>>
>>>> Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.
>>>
>>> That way we can also set default USE-flags suitable for when using Xen.
>>>
>>
>> Gotcha :-)
>>
>> I'm going to try out on my company's VMware boxes (the guys at
>> xen-users said that Xen runs okay on VMware, albeit without HVM domU
>> support).
>
> I think starting with a list of packages and use-flags needed to get PV
> and HVM domains running would be a good starting point.
> Then, we can put that into a profile and create a stage4 tar-file with
> current versions.
>

I assume those are packages and use-flags on the dom0? I agree.

Anyways, good news: I may soon land my grubby hands on an unused IBM
Server. It's a new-ish one, AFAICT, so it should support VT-x.

We can thus test HVM domU's, yay!

> I think it would be a good idea to try to continue on this with the
> maintainers for Xen on Gentoo?
>

Aren't they on this list, too?

Rgds,
-- 
FdS Pandu E Poluan
~ IT Optimizer ~

 • Blog : http://pepoluan.tumblr.com
 • Linked-In : http://id.linkedin.com/in/pepoluan

Re: [gentoo-server] Re: Xen Dom0 using kernel 3.0

[Joost Roeleveld]

On Monday, August 15, 2011 08:30:04 PM Pandu Poluan wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 19:47, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> > On Mon, August 15, 2011 2:22 pm, Pandu Poluan wrote:
> >> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 16:08, J. Roeleveld <joost@antarean.org> wrote:
> >>> On Mon, August 15, 2011 8:18 am, Pandu Poluan wrote:
> >>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 02:29, Joost Roeleveld
> >>>>>> That is, how to provide sensible defaults yet not irreversibly
> >>>>>> removing Gentoo's freedom. So, GeDZux will be a Gentoo
> >>>>>> variant, a
> >>>>>> 'submetadistro', if you will :P
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> A profile putting all the necessary tools (xen, kernel,
> >>>>> bridge,....)
> >>>>> as
> >>>>> required.
> >>>> 
> >>>> Aha! Good idea. Let me learn how to make a profile then.
> >>> 
> >>> That way we can also set default USE-flags suitable for when using
> >>> Xen.
> >> 
> >> Gotcha :-)
> >> 
> >> I'm going to try out on my company's VMware boxes (the guys at
> >> xen-users said that Xen runs okay on VMware, albeit without HVM domU
> >> support).
> > 
> > I think starting with a list of packages and use-flags needed to get PV
> > and HVM domains running would be a good starting point.
> > Then, we can put that into a profile and create a stage4 tar-file with
> > current versions.
> 
> I assume those are packages and use-flags on the dom0? I agree.
> 
> Anyways, good news: I may soon land my grubby hands on an unused IBM
> Server. It's a new-ish one, AFAICT, so it should support VT-x.
> 
> We can thus test HVM domU's, yay!

I've got 2 machines that can run HVM.
I am planning on setting one of these up for dual boot into xen for testing 
purposes already.
The other is already running Xen, but not done any HVM on there yet.

> > I think it would be a good idea to try to continue on this with the
> > maintainers for Xen on Gentoo?
> 
> Aren't they on this list, too?

I don't know. If this were gentoo-user, then i'd assume so.