* [gentoo-releng] USE="acl" in profiles
@ 2004-09-20 16:41 Benjamin Judas
2004-09-21 13:13 ` [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] " Chris Gianelloni
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Benjamin Judas @ 2004-09-20 16:41 UTC (permalink / raw
To: gentoo-dev; +Cc: gentoo-releng
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There is a slight problem regarding the USE-Settings in the profiles:
GRP_STAGE23_USE="ipv6 pam tcpd readline nls ssl gpm perl python berkdb acl ncurses"
As you can see, this defines acl. Now:
USE="x86 oss apm arts avi berkdb bitmap-fonts crypt cups encode foomaticdb gdbm
gif gpm gtk gtk2 imlib jpeg kde gnome libg++ libwww mad mikmod motif mpeg ncurses
nls oggvorbis opengl pam pdflib png python qt quicktime readline sdl slang spell
ssl svga tcpd truetype X xml2 xmms xprint xv zlib"
This doesn't define acl.
This could break things if users don't set USE="acl" on bootstrap/emerge system.
Possible solutions could be to either remove acl from GRP_STAGE23_USE or add it to
USE. The first solution would cause everybody using acl to not be able to install without
any problems. Putting it into USE would cause an overhead for everybody. The overhead
doesn't seem to be that big, but...well...it's an overhead.
What do you think about it and how do you think this should be solved?
Regards,
Benni
--
Benjamin Judas
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Gentoo-developer http://dev.gentoo.org/~beejay
Giessen, Germany http://www.gentoo.org
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] USE="acl" in profiles
2004-09-20 16:41 [gentoo-releng] USE="acl" in profiles Benjamin Judas
@ 2004-09-21 13:13 ` Chris Gianelloni
2004-09-21 19:00 ` Ned Ludd
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chris Gianelloni @ 2004-09-21 13:13 UTC (permalink / raw
To: gentoo-dev; +Cc: gentoo-releng
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On Mon, 2004-09-20 at 12:41, Benjamin Judas wrote:
> There is a slight problem regarding the USE-Settings in the profiles:
>
> GRP_STAGE23_USE="ipv6 pam tcpd readline nls ssl gpm perl python berkdb acl ncurses"
>
> As you can see, this defines acl. Now:
>
> USE="x86 oss apm arts avi berkdb bitmap-fonts crypt cups encode foomaticdb gdbm
> gif gpm gtk gtk2 imlib jpeg kde gnome libg++ libwww mad mikmod motif mpeg ncurses
> nls oggvorbis opengl pam pdflib png python qt quicktime readline sdl slang spell
> ssl svga tcpd truetype X xml2 xmms xprint xv zlib"
>
> This doesn't define acl.
>
> This could break things if users don't set USE="acl" on bootstrap/emerge system.
> Possible solutions could be to either remove acl from GRP_STAGE23_USE or add it to
> USE. The first solution would cause everybody using acl to not be able to install without
> any problems. Putting it into USE would cause an overhead for everybody. The overhead
> doesn't seem to be that big, but...well...it's an overhead.
>
> What do you think about it and how do you think this should be solved?
We should not remove the ability to install using acl. I also think
that it is required for somethings (hardened?) and should stay. I think
my main problem is I don't understand how the situation is broken.
Could you perhaps paint a better picture for me (and all the other
devs)?
--
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering - Operations/QA Manager
Games - Developer
Gentoo Linux
Is your power animal a penguin?
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* [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] USE="acl" in profiles
2004-09-21 13:13 ` [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] " Chris Gianelloni
@ 2004-09-21 19:00 ` Ned Ludd
2004-09-21 20:43 ` Chris Gianelloni
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Ned Ludd @ 2004-09-21 19:00 UTC (permalink / raw
To: wolf31o2; +Cc: gentoo-dev, gentoo-releng
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On Tue, 2004-09-21 at 09:13, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> On Mon, 2004-09-20 at 12:41, Benjamin Judas wrote:
> > There is a slight problem regarding the USE-Settings in the profiles:
> >
> > GRP_STAGE23_USE="ipv6 pam tcpd readline nls ssl gpm perl python berkdb acl ncurses"
> >
> > As you can see, this defines acl. Now:
> >
> > USE="x86 oss apm arts avi berkdb bitmap-fonts crypt cups encode foomaticdb gdbm
> > gif gpm gtk gtk2 imlib jpeg kde gnome libg++ libwww mad mikmod motif mpeg ncurses
> > nls oggvorbis opengl pam pdflib png python qt quicktime readline sdl slang spell
> > ssl svga tcpd truetype X xml2 xmms xprint xv zlib"
> >
> > This doesn't define acl.
> >
> > This could break things if users don't set USE="acl" on bootstrap/emerge system.
> > Possible solutions could be to either remove acl from GRP_STAGE23_USE or add it to
> > USE. The first solution would cause everybody using acl to not be able to install without
> > any problems. Putting it into USE would cause an overhead for everybody. The overhead
> > doesn't seem to be that big, but...well...it's an overhead.
> >
> > What do you think about it and how do you think this should be solved?
>
> We should not remove the ability to install using acl. I also think
> that it is required for somethings (hardened?) and should stay. I think
> my main problem is I don't understand how the situation is broken.
> Could you perhaps paint a better picture for me (and all the other
> devs)?
drop it++
Some USE flags almost need maintainers (and this is one of them). There
are special patches that have to be applied to packages that don't seem
to be going upstream. Sometimes these are patches that conflict with the
natural course of upgrading/version bumps of packages and the complete
logic has to be reworked. When these conflicts happen where the acl flag
conflicts said patches are simply dropped. So I'm thinking that a full
bootstrap is currently only half arse with USE=acl and not a complete
solution.
If somebody/existing dev is willing to take on the responsibility for
said flag then hey great leave it in the stages but as is it's
incomplete as I've pointed out.
And as josh has pointed out hardened does not need it in anyway shape or
form.
Furthermore it's quite a confusing USE flag name to begin with.
What's it really needed for?
Gentoo supports atleast 3 types of access control systems that I can
think of so not sure why this one has to be so descriptive.
--
Ned Ludd <solar@gentoo.org>
Gentoo (hardened,security,infrastructure,embedded,toolchain) Developer
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] USE="acl" in profiles
2004-09-21 19:00 ` Ned Ludd
@ 2004-09-21 20:43 ` Chris Gianelloni
2004-09-21 20:59 ` Ned Ludd
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chris Gianelloni @ 2004-09-21 20:43 UTC (permalink / raw
To: gentoo-dev; +Cc: gentoo-releng
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On Tue, 2004-09-21 at 15:00, Ned Ludd wrote:
> On Tue, 2004-09-21 at 09:13, Chris Gianelloni wrote:
> > On Mon, 2004-09-20 at 12:41, Benjamin Judas wrote:
> > > There is a slight problem regarding the USE-Settings in the profiles:
> > >
> > > GRP_STAGE23_USE="ipv6 pam tcpd readline nls ssl gpm perl python berkdb acl ncurses"
> > >
> > > As you can see, this defines acl. Now:
> > >
> > > USE="x86 oss apm arts avi berkdb bitmap-fonts crypt cups encode foomaticdb gdbm
> > > gif gpm gtk gtk2 imlib jpeg kde gnome libg++ libwww mad mikmod motif mpeg ncurses
> > > nls oggvorbis opengl pam pdflib png python qt quicktime readline sdl slang spell
> > > ssl svga tcpd truetype X xml2 xmms xprint xv zlib"
> > >
> > > This doesn't define acl.
> > >
> > > This could break things if users don't set USE="acl" on bootstrap/emerge system.
> > > Possible solutions could be to either remove acl from GRP_STAGE23_USE or add it to
> > > USE. The first solution would cause everybody using acl to not be able to install without
> > > any problems. Putting it into USE would cause an overhead for everybody. The overhead
> > > doesn't seem to be that big, but...well...it's an overhead.
> > >
> > > What do you think about it and how do you think this should be solved?
> >
> > We should not remove the ability to install using acl. I also think
> > that it is required for somethings (hardened?) and should stay. I think
> > my main problem is I don't understand how the situation is broken.
> > Could you perhaps paint a better picture for me (and all the other
> > devs)?
>
>
> drop it++
It is dropped in the newly-created default-linux/x86/2004.3 profile. It
is, in fact, the only change at the moment. I am not sure if we will
see any other changes at this point in the profile before 2004.3, but I
still wouldn't recommend people switching to it simply because we
might... *grin*
> Some USE flags almost need maintainers (and this is one of them). There
> are special patches that have to be applied to packages that don't seem
> to be going upstream. Sometimes these are patches that conflict with the
> natural course of upgrading/version bumps of packages and the complete
> logic has to be reworked. When these conflicts happen where the acl flag
> conflicts said patches are simply dropped. So I'm thinking that a full
> bootstrap is currently only half arse with USE=acl and not a complete
> solution.
>
> If somebody/existing dev is willing to take on the responsibility for
> said flag then hey great leave it in the stages but as is it's
> incomplete as I've pointed out.
>
> And as josh has pointed out hardened does not need it in anyway shape or
> form.
>
> Furthermore it's quite a confusing USE flag name to begin with.
> What's it really needed for?
>
> Gentoo supports atleast 3 types of access control systems that I can
> think of so not sure why this one has to be so descriptive.
Hey, man... removing it is fine by me. That's like 2 more packages that
don't get added to the LiveCD and take up room.
--
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering - Operations/QA Manager
Games - Developer
Gentoo Linux
Is your power animal a penguin?
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] USE="acl" in profiles
2004-09-21 20:43 ` Chris Gianelloni
@ 2004-09-21 20:59 ` Ned Ludd
2004-09-21 21:22 ` Chris Gianelloni
0 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Ned Ludd @ 2004-09-21 20:59 UTC (permalink / raw
To: wolf31o2; +Cc: gentoo-dev, gentoo-releng
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> > Gentoo supports atleast 3 types of access control systems that I can
> > think of so not sure why this one has to be so descriptive.
>
> Hey, man... removing it is fine by me. That's like 2 more packages that
> don't get added to the LiveCD and take up room.
Hey man.. :-)
I hope you didn't misinterpret the last mail as any sort of attack on or
towards you. The RE: to you was just as good as anybody in my minds eye.
Glad your able to save a few cpu cycles and QA becomes much cleaner and
simpler for/by default.
-peace
--
Ned Ludd <solar@gentoo.org>
Gentoo (hardened,security,infrastructure,embedded,toolchain) Developer
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* [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] USE="acl" in profiles
2004-09-21 20:59 ` Ned Ludd
@ 2004-09-21 21:22 ` Chris Gianelloni
0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Chris Gianelloni @ 2004-09-21 21:22 UTC (permalink / raw
To: solar; +Cc: gentoo-dev, gentoo-releng
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On Tue, 2004-09-21 at 16:59, Ned Ludd wrote:
> Hey man.. :-)
>
> I hope you didn't misinterpret the last mail as any sort of attack on or
> towards you. The RE: to you was just as good as anybody in my minds eye.
I didn't think that was an attack at all. I was trying to be a little
humorous, since I was pretty much for the removal all along and you went
into this pretty long, but quite informative spiel on the evils of
USE=acl.
> Glad your able to save a few cpu cycles and QA becomes much cleaner and
> simpler for/by default.
Definitely. In fact, I had tried to remove the acl/attr packages at one
point and it broke things like "ls", so needless to say I was a bit
miffed. My current stance on the LiveCD is any byte saved is one less
byte wasted on the mirrors.
> -peace
Ditto...
--
Chris Gianelloni
Release Engineering - Operations/QA Manager
Games - Developer
Gentoo Linux
Is your power animal a penguin?
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2004-09-20 16:41 [gentoo-releng] USE="acl" in profiles Benjamin Judas
2004-09-21 13:13 ` [gentoo-releng] Re: [gentoo-dev] " Chris Gianelloni
2004-09-21 19:00 ` Ned Ludd
2004-09-21 20:43 ` Chris Gianelloni
2004-09-21 20:59 ` Ned Ludd
2004-09-21 21:22 ` Chris Gianelloni
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