From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B13EF138010 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 21:37:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4956621C026; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 21:36:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90AAD21C026 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 21:36:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pomiocik.lan (77-255-14-203.adsl.inetia.pl [77.255.14.203]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: mgorny) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 814D533D8E7; Thu, 25 Oct 2012 21:36:56 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2012 23:37:43 +0200 From: =?UTF-8?B?TWljaGHFgiBHw7Nybnk=?= To: "Jesus Rivero (Neurogeek)" Cc: Mike Gilbert , gentoo-python@lists.gentoo.org, python@gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-python] Re: Handling packages not supporting multiple Python implementations Message-ID: <20121025233743.237ff1ec@pomiocik.lan> In-Reply-To: References: <20121023235808.48cc6d9d@pomiocik.lan> Organization: Gentoo X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.8.1 (GTK+ 2.24.13; x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Discussions centering around the Python ecosystem in Gentoo Linux X-BeenThere: gentoo-python@gentoo.org X-BeenThere: gentoo-python@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=PGP-SHA256; boundary="Sig_/gpfHChh2hGBE02bcWiEulGB"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Archives-Salt: 85244143-32b9-4d86-b6fb-50872deb0844 X-Archives-Hash: 563c3817ac4a578333230723bf30444f --Sig_/gpfHChh2hGBE02bcWiEulGB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, 25 Oct 2012 17:25:47 -0400 "Jesus Rivero (Neurogeek)" wrote: > On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 5:00 PM, Mike Gilbert wrote: > > On Tue, Oct 23, 2012 at 5:58 PM, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny wrote: > >> Hello, > >> > >> After starting to deploy python-r1 on packages supporting multiple > >> Python implementations, I believe it is time to start thinking about > >> those packages which don't support that. Firstly, I would like to gain > >> a general feedback/ideas on the possible solutions, without getting too > >> deep into the technical details of it. > >> > >> As far as I can think, we have the following possibilities: > >> > >> > >> 1) Assume that installing stuff for a single Python implementation is > >> deprecated and let the packages rot with the old eclass. > >> > >> It is probably the simplest solution (i.e. not doing anything to > >> address the issue) but truth be told, I doubt this will actually work. > >> People will just keep using the old eclass which doesn't really do much > >> good for those packages... > >> > >> And even if some people will actually start supporting multiple > >> implementations... that may be even worse. Just look at dev-libs/boost > >> to see what I mean. > >> > >> > >> 2) Use a xor-type REQUIRED_USE for those packages. > >> > >> Put the whole set of PYTHON_TARGETS but add a REQUIRED_USE=3D'^^ ( ...= )' > >> for them, effectively requesting only a single implementation being > >> enabled. > >> > >> I believe that this is quite a good solution, at least from > >> the dependency point of view. We clearly express which Python > >> implementations are supported by a particular package and which one was > >> enabled. We can express cross-package dependencies cleanly. > >> > >> The problem lies in user-friendliness. Although with the current > >> default (python2_7 only) it wouldn't cause any trouble, whenever user > >> enables more than a single implementation, every single-implementation > >> package will require package.use adjustment. This will become an even > >> more widespread issue when we decide to re-enable Python 3. > >> > >> To be honest, I don't see any good way around that. > >> > >> > >> 3) Use implicit implementation selection (like python.eclass). > >> > >> Well, as some say, this is a very good solution since it's well tested. > >> Its limitations and brokenness are obvious. Just I doubt it is really > >> worth the effort to write something that bad. > >> > >> The main problem here is that the chosen Python implementation is > >> implicit. Binary packages don't express it. Cross-package dependencies > >> don't express it. User changes the implementation, stuff breaks > >> silently and you end up with some kind of python-updater (why a tool > >> to fix breakage is called 'updater'?!). > >> > >> > >> Do you have any more ideas? Opinions? > >> > > > > Like you, I really can't come up with an ideal solution here. > > > > We really have 2 classes of packages here: > > > > 1. Packages that don't care what version of python you use, but > > install files outside of site-packages. > > > > 2. Packages that build code (like libraries) against a specific > > version of python/libpython. > > > > The implicit implementation selection works fine for #1, but not so wel= l for #2. >=20 > I wonder if we could have a "special target" that could expand to the > current eselected python version. That way, the package not supporting > a multiple targets, could be treated the same as those who do. >=20 > Something like: >=20 > PYTHON_COMPAT=3D( python_current ), or something like that. Well, unless I'm missing something, that's just a tiny implementation detail and I don't like to get that deep already. Unless you are actually suggesting using that special target in deps and so on -- but that effectively means 3) and makes it impossible to cleanly support changing the current Python version. --=20 Best regards, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny --Sig_/gpfHChh2hGBE02bcWiEulGB Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.19 (GNU/Linux) iJwEAQEIAAYFAlCJsSgACgkQfXuS5UK5QB1S4gQAol2wxRm34ZZ3Jmhhlx9HnY3c k9SsvQwJX7PboG60pCMKjCltdjlGNSrtJCl8PDhdx1I56sNGAu+4/Vw1NeHnv8GO 5FHyZUj9mpstPaeGpvuszpltYkxpaUy1AA0iG3u/530RawhjSd0KfWTJpS5L/pwp ZR+jjotquWQTQ+SBUGQ= =fEil -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/gpfHChh2hGBE02bcWiEulGB--