Denis,

I also want to make the point that I'm not forgetting your own recent pain
with respect to Gentoo and the way some things are run.  I urge you to
please keep in mind that the only way to change it is to not lash out
because of the pain (lashing out usually has the unfortunate side-effect
that people who had nothing to do with causing you anger still get hurt by
your reaction to them), but to accept it and work on healing it instead.

Healing the pain is a lot more vulnerable, but it's also more honest, and I
believe it can be done.  I've seen it happen.  Within Gentoo.  With people
who thought they were enemies.  Within the last 6 months (right, you
two?).  Maybe 7 (I was in Zambia at the time).

Thanks,

Seemant



On 4 July 2014 12:15, Seemant Kulleen <seemantk@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Denis,
>
> You're obviously frustrated (and you might even be giving voice to more
> than just your own feeling, here).
>
> I didn't read Rich's replies as ordering anyone around.  In fact, I dare
> say Rich is very consistent at suggesting and discussing, but I have yet to
> witness him order someone around on this list.
>
> I have had no personal interaction with him (ever), but he doesn't seem
> like an order-around kinda guy here.
>
> Having said all of that, there's a LOT of baggage around Gentoo's
> leadership. You (Denis) know from our private conversations that that
> baggage started around 2002/3 and that I've been carrying a lot of
> emotional baggage as well.
>
> But this is 2014. This is now, this is a time that we can shed baggage,
> because it serves no other purpose than to weigh us down. There's nobody
> left to blame.
>
> I ask, as user, that you please take a more charitable approach to
> everyone on the team with the simple understanding that everyone in their
> own way just wants to improve Gentoo.
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Seemant
>
>
>
> On 4 July 2014 12:06, Denis Dupeyron <calchan@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jul 4, 2014 at 12:43 PM, Seemant Kulleen <seemantk@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > I'm sorry to speak publicly, but isn't this email exactly the kind of
>> > attitude we're trying to reverse. As a senior member of the project, I
>> > really would hope you set a better example of the change that you,
>> yourself,
>> > have said you wanted to see.
>>
>> You are perfectly right to speak publicly. The point I was trying to
>> make in this email is very simple. The only good way of changing how a
>> team operates, for better or worse, is to join it. Ordering people
>> around without actually doing anything only works if you're the one
>> signing the paychecks.
>>
>> Have we reached a point where council members are such divas that they
>> can't even be told when they missed a perfectly good opportunity to
>> shut up?
>>
>> Denis.
>>
>>
>