From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B52F1387FD for ; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 14:07:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 756CAE08D1; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 14:07:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ve0-f179.google.com (mail-ve0-f179.google.com [209.85.128.179]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CBA48E0853 for ; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 14:07:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ve0-f179.google.com with SMTP id db12so7291755veb.38 for ; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:07:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=1TSYVOlgcWIs/swVNBw34+zMe8JEJHxwM6ZFagTvzm0=; b=DLSv8cm28aV5iUoc8xNZxQnggfPfN0GeMWETkc3rZXslkDt7ZeFlq7Kd1nPcKxPkLk 38VVOk4kfn8CKOPYDUGftueMrcx4q2B5V02InIDVhVn8W+Nohl2voygFJBaskn9d9AkB xIfIkZ9ZTrGaYItBy3NAGOH7PS+85TVOaCYgidBBnMiMkUKeb+4UWeI3faoaxeY6OSDm Kyb+oqo7pDhyv4Ak54L6hQxnWzsBBd09aEoxsGYN+nw3rIdsPETRdkHCIVolzTTOYKmj g6H2r4q6VbFAY6DmVM5fOsLWVBVbCEdjQH+qCecjs17SNVHr/uZE4mkp72LG5cuNGgh+ 3NIw== Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.220.12.66 with SMTP id w2mr17936619vcw.15.1396188469906; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:07:49 -0700 (PDT) Sender: freemanrich@gmail.com Received: by 10.52.29.142 with HTTP; Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:07:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20140330135240.3d1afcee@pomiot.lan> References: <53342A5F.70903@gentoo.org> <20140330103342.76108bfb@pomiot.lan> <1465789.1S5fJRlZoR@localhost> <20140330135240.3d1afcee@pomiot.lan> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2014 10:07:49 -0400 X-Google-Sender-Auth: A6S-f9xomAT9Wf6WK4LutGGcDDc Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Call for agenda items - Council meeting 2014-04-08 From: Rich Freeman To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: 49ba492f-a852-48e8-b03b-5b69e616df2e X-Archives-Hash: 6041b91cfa4c52c427ddbbd4f69607ff On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 7:52 AM, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny = wrote: > > Why would base-1024 prefixes make any sense when the numbers are > base 10? Numbers are numbers, but they are displayed in base 10 and people commonly think/work in base 10. In the interest of debating specific policy ahead of the meeting, I'll go ahead and propose: Proposal 1 "Whenever practical Developers are encouraged to use SI units and base 10 values (ie 1KB =3D 1000 bytes). They may use base 2 values when this output is more likely to be useful to users (eg in memory hexdumps, etc). Either way, unit prefixes defined in IEC 80000-13 (KB, KiB, etc) must be used so that output is unambiguous. This does not require maintainers to patch upstream code to change its behavior, but they should be applied with code that originates in Gentoo." While I understand the resentment at the redefinition of prefixes that have been in use for decades, the ambiguity of using SI prefixes with non-SI definitions creates confusion and potentially error. I think clarity should always be valued when the change is otherwise cosmetic. So, use MiB or MB as makes sense, but the latter should be the default and should always mean 1000000 bytes. If there is strong objection to my first proposal I offer: Proposal 2 "Whenever practical developers are required to use unit prefixes defined in IEC 80000-13 (KB, KiB, etc) so that output is unambiguous. This does not require maintainers to patch upstream code to change its behavior, but they should be applied with code that originates in Gentoo." This takes no stance on whether 1000 vs 1024 is preferred but still requires the new-style prefixes to remove ambiguity. I strongly advocate that using "KB" to refer to 1024 bytes is a recipe for confusion, if only because everybody who attends a decent school comes out indoctrinated that kilo means something else. Rich