From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A18E5138334 for ; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 14:09:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4F6C4E0936; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 14:09:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-pf1-f169.google.com (mail-pf1-f169.google.com [209.85.210.169]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 160EEE0877 for ; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 14:09:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pf1-f169.google.com with SMTP id 19so8910478pfa.4 for ; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 07:09:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=gVazHM6keXhq5alahW6nwzFGKaN6azdXt8NLTBItJR0=; b=MoFuEj39TSA2ffSj0vKiAkXq8DrICvwsMIDb0boYpZvMMFD5We4pRAs/8DjKkl96as zSjE14c6H3IjFjD4QGJnXKMnQ9dv5upEUOPEh9kouQ0ttXSoq68+RfCafOasDehc/os7 TbVPsOlLlborSGM7VAwzbgWX7AwOrzFSKxsPAQNlUOj9HdYohdNvsnRH7LGN5RcrzsI4 oJB0Kjro13eEV4G6VH3pjPyO7qKTSfxU0ftF/uB7wMhbfvOGrhmYP/2X6jkbXC4J1HeB BKg/NUp1scUiBcCyqzsmS/oO807gwuMC52Ucnzd5OIPrfqz6XUdw50MMIREiP/nTMmN/ UA7w== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVBYxyFizz+fw3Fc92td8soW+8x2j7XiTNuuQZFDj1M2v3Js+UF S24ySjuOtm0bKqfcYJvIVLD4pqt9+Od1l/SNbcJ8DA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyT6N+cePBanF8JXwR4py83ZX7nxr7icnn0TribicLnJa8FSwgeE4VzuDBk8v+8hEMb9dGTcg7KcHcj5FX5yr0= X-Received: by 2002:a63:5009:: with SMTP id e9mr24950354pgb.396.1560348588262; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 07:09:48 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Rich Freeman Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:09:35 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Deferred decision: Forums (specifically OTW) To: gentoo-project Cc: Dirkjan Ochtman Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Archives-Salt: f3b96ae1-ba28-4b7f-a2c6-6b6c9176ed44 X-Archives-Hash: 6cbdd42958d8ffa18622ae51641d9990 On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 9:00 AM Alec Warner wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 4:13 AM Rich Freeman wrote: >> > > (a) I believe that the CoC is a tool to achieve a goal. The goal is to apply a policy to have a community where people feel its safe to contribute. Also to have a community where people feel like they actually WANT to contribute. Why would I want to be a part of an organization that is constantly slinging mud on the mailing lists? Why would I even want to read these lists? Ultimately the many volunteers who give their time to Gentoo deserve to have a place where they can do it in reasonable harmony. Some disagreement is inevitable and just a direct result of our mission. However, there are many disagreements that could come up that have nothing to do with our mission, and part of the reason for the CoC is so that people understand that this just isn't the place to discuss those other things. >> >> Well, that is easy enough. If there isn't any legal reason to object >> to a change, then don't. If there is, then please speak up before >> somebody does something bad. > > > I'm not convinced my duty as a trustee ends at legal. The *community* has no representation on the Council at all (users don't get to vote) and so I struggle to see how the *community* is represented. So, first, you don't have to have a vote to be represented by somebody. And, second, anybody in the community has the opportunity to vote by contributing. Not every voice is equally important to listen to, and the ones casting the votes are arguably the voice that are most worth listening to. > To help Gentoo's development, the community provides a continuous stream of feedback and contributes to the various aspects of the Gentoo distribution. Indeed, and all those who do contribute in this way already get to vote for Council, and if somebody feels they have been missed they should apply for dev status so that this can be fixed. In any case, the job of the Trustees is to facilitate Gentoo's mission, not interfere with those chosen to lead it... -- Rich