From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B016D138334 for ; Wed, 3 Jul 2019 11:14:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3AC0BE086F; Wed, 3 Jul 2019 11:14:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-pg1-f176.google.com (mail-pg1-f176.google.com [209.85.215.176]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DACFEE086C for ; Wed, 3 Jul 2019 11:14:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pg1-f176.google.com with SMTP id z75so1077580pgz.5 for ; Wed, 03 Jul 2019 04:14:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=ChJDvIUIBlHdNxCHjcLNnPfNz2q048/vRKVoABKa10E=; b=e84EjVgEJL548RpQr/6IF5CP5uuOi2uuz2Hli6SFh5LYBnbI9DkpYQWSxR/11dAtkj eU3EQ9z4GHmpveu2ViBPVygQYl401B7g5T5McmO7w7/0wVYjGfB5+TUN0A1/MDBYolaC 9WPWAh2iO/16X8xOjl+TrJG3y1pBQ4a7BAojbiuGIo2r9zMqIJ5cPvvNGCduEM2DV38t 9sByzwSdcXcusvmvBGfyYEb3RZ628Wb89ttprxJJxCwzqPIQGZlQYn572KflGmhb0D6F f+O7mKOSlLYqM3wtR7B03RUGjedp1tqOJsWow7AJH2BVuo/CloMQlOKhbsPBf/jSIOGO 6b6A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXl2Eu9ggvO3A18k1gANl/RcFQjn7dufAVRvCoGgCJGzxpKbIcg k58znKqCwLfPkv4yrvZPc6yV+Svd9sb470eISdygRg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzKBLgstI0si/uVf5pudEsNI0Q3ux92Imt8or7yo3gmXqF7ReSAv/JLoO8+JFQ6F/eXqNLZbNkACKDne6WCrWc= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:3724:: with SMTP id u33mr11967420pjb.19.1562152444339; Wed, 03 Jul 2019 04:14:04 -0700 (PDT) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190615124220.fcf0c08b22481d5bc6c2dbe0@gentoo.org> <20190615124933.b2f20fde0b47509e6b54f989@gentoo.org> <20190625011818.73fb7c1948a0a3d124a0d9db@gentoo.org> <20190628144924.334336020d7a31deed0b6749@gentoo.org> <8e865f8b-5f6c-e555-ed53-7186898df6f5@gentoo.org> <4a423877-c053-7693-4f85-223b5a6e064c@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: <4a423877-c053-7693-4f85-223b5a6e064c@gentoo.org> From: Rich Freeman Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2019 07:13:52 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Questions for Gentoo Council nominees: GLEP 76 To: gentoo-project Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Archives-Salt: f335fd88-9348-45c3-8447-9c6304493ac4 X-Archives-Hash: abb3f6ec53e77f64ab678e4b012b86ab On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 12:31 AM desultory wrote: > > You based your argument on your preference, as opposed to reality. This entire thread is about preference. The reality is that you need to use your real name to contribute to Gentoo right now. You would prefer that it be otherwise. There is no harm in expressing that. > Accepting and providing payments are fairly basic operations > for legal entities to engage in, even if the foundation were to be > dissolved there would still be financial transactions apropos Gentoo. If we were operating under an umbrella org, Gentoo would not be legally responsible for these activities. Also, I believe that these activities should STILL be minimized, ideally towards zero. Physical servers and bank accounts are vulnerabilities that can be disrupted. The less you depend on them, the more resilient you are. If Gentoo were nothing more than a git repo it would be almost impossible to disrupt its operations as these are trivially replicated. If the services it did run were entirely open they would be trivially mirrored (I mean open everything - not just the upstream code, but all our configs/etc - obviously short of the credentials). Yes, I'm obviously speaking aspirationally, but the principle is still valid. IMO FOSS solutions for replacing some of the infra-heavy existing solutions like bugzilla are lacking, so this could be a long road. However, anytime we deploy something new we should be asking whether any Gentoo user can trivially replicate the entire service based on our documentation and published data (ideally with a few lines), ideally including even authentication (no reason a Gentoo credential shouldn't work on a non-Gentoo site in a world where federation is common). If the answer is no, then we're creating a dependency on some black box that could be taken away from us. > In that case, you are advocating for having no: passwords, password > hashes, private e-mail (including security related correspondence), no > encryption keys, no signing keys, no pre-release code, no closed source > code, no code not meant for release for any reason at all, no > confidential data at all, and probably other things that I neglected to > list. None of those are really PII. However, we should certainly be minimizing our dependence on all of these. We should depend on actual PII even less, and I'm skeptical that we need to retain this at all if we stop operating a legal entity. I'm not saying that we'll ever reach zero, but anytime we can accomplish our goals without resorting to using the laundry list of stuff you just provided, we should. -- Rich