From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1240E138334 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2018 08:29:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A7B3BE0A6D; Wed, 14 Nov 2018 08:29:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ot1-x32e.google.com (mail-ot1-x32e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5939AE0A6A for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2018 08:29:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ot1-x32e.google.com with SMTP id w25so13251398otm.13 for ; Wed, 14 Nov 2018 00:29:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=7piTV+ELA8Gm9IrWIgZl1bYNC8k5RbM5sxUJSNEamXg=; b=mDdq7CnoNwVkLACM6Y0VpaiS1A8s9hVysII4jA86bhYjjzvTADNaO4vZxCwUwSE6ZU htPLCD9SEM++9YLbGb51JEZp8rfuCTquCmzdQ0S48fUKTZlXY9os/eLvv14hC40wpgCu dwkoguvukCc3xE+q65eeXFKAWhJJtqKb8VeHv6jrMidB/tapS84MgwPvV3D+gM5e4Zxp wY1Vep0LF0ozGJYSD+7vDV4yaPb+9T33ssbaQYhaFBBnuO0kdiOvnOuMbL0X3j8OCs7U O6ZtyRDbnEMQCcsUVW2w1oyFBGaEvdUYy+ZDCgdqYRupFu7kVE+EBM3YcXFr3J1set96 HASw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=7piTV+ELA8Gm9IrWIgZl1bYNC8k5RbM5sxUJSNEamXg=; b=lRgAXDDFpLjcEgGaOZYdkl6im70H/y8ANcVkpJ2Imt3Tix8TR948BS9FpOgs0URp60 vW5COm95S505otRHHZ0NLzZKQyZ/n6J7zFf60EMxrS9yVe1PF6av1IBDU8VLViPPVteG Hr1tfHEh6dLuc9iVGMcqd2RwzbOStMjtfpVGV3f9jGIVo+JmnuqRptHZc3ofBmrTmrkc PFDmKNIsFcrrMJTSRFA7NFCer0ZVqHMYTETfjh8tGYPFEbrYAjGoDPDlWA8ivAsaUSp+ KGjU/Squ2RkhesmmHSUoI6Rryc45JiHIM/PUHgqihOUfDa6uxGJfig3JA5yhr+opU9sk E6Qg== X-Gm-Message-State: AGRZ1gJDaNSLY0eJb7iP7Um9fThrC4OKX/7uyvCYpDYhMcNcBQAMjAE/ vk1Kmrvp1TZWrPwbzmHLAnTejU8cnV0wFJyHpbqO+g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AJdET5fVtprT+uWBDGG5VBer56DJRKpuM2B0tORetQAcApCdARgIL+bDiPeEqfmg03XOStppLVr4rXl6+bZiFbbRb7A= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7c86:: with SMTP id q6mr583507otn.257.1542184148109; Wed, 14 Nov 2018 00:29:08 -0800 (PST) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20181113183242.GA26771@whubbs1.gaikai.biz> <20181114024643.GA15537@linux1.home> In-Reply-To: From: Raymond Jennings Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 00:28:31 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] rfc: copyright attribution clarifications To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000539474057a9bba78" X-Archives-Salt: 061d7d29-758b-4d42-a4ee-85842491e46a X-Archives-Hash: ef117918afc9681d1556b6265df87898 --000000000000539474057a9bba78 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 12:24 AM Ulrich Mueller wrote: > >>>>> On Wed, 14 Nov 2018, William Hubbs wrote: > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 06:17:17PM -0800, Rich Freeman wrote: > >> So, the purpose of allowing specific copyright holders to be named > >> was to cover cases where we're forking foreign code, not to basically > >> introduce a variant on the BSD advertising clause. IMO people who are > >> only willing to contribute FOSS if their name gets put in a prominent > >> location might do better to contribute elsewhere. > > +1000 > > Maybe the policy for the Gentoo repository should just say that, namely > that traditional copyright notices are only allowed for imported foreign > code. Anything committed directly to the repository and any update of an > existing file would be required to carry the simplified "Gentoo Authors" > copyright notice, without any exceptions allowed. > > Can someone come up with a good wording for this? In my opinion the best wording belongs in python as a check in repoman and the qa scripts monitoring PRs on github ;). > > Do you feel this way about corporations as well? Do you think the > > Linux kernel maintainers should go and rip out all copyright notices > > other than Linus Torvalds and maybe the Linux Foundation? > > Why would corporations be different from individual authors? Under the > legislation here, corporations cannot even hold copyright (or rather, > Urheberrecht) of a work. > > >> The purpose of a copyright notice is to declare that the file is > >> copyrighted, and that is it. > > Exactly. > > >> It isn't a comprehensive list of everybody who holds a copyright on > >> the file. > >> > >> It isn't a revision history. > >> > >> There is no need to list various mixes of years and authors. Just > >> list the first and last year, and whatever copyright holders are > >> necessary. > >> > >> [...] > >> > >> But, if you had to have multiple lines, then just wrap the existing > >> notice. Don't turn it into some kind of revision history. Just list > >> one year range and whatever list of entities you feel compelled to > >> list. That is the proper way to do a notice. > > > No sir, it isn't. > > > Look anywhere outside the Gentoo tree. For that matter, take the Linux > > kernel, or even in the systemd source, there are several places with > > multiple copyright notices in them. > > Are these the only arguments you have? > > To say it again, ebuilds have a copyright notice for exactly two > reasons: > > - to protect us against the "innocent infringement" defense under > U.S. law, and > > - because the GPL-2 requires in section 1 to "appropriately publish > on each copy an appropriate copyright notice". > > For both of these, it is irrelevant what the precise contents of the > notice is. If you made a significant contribution to the file, then you > can claim copyright for it, even if there is no copyright notice at all, > of if you aren't mentioned in it. > > IANAL, but I think the case for being listed there explicitly is very > weak. > > Ulrich > --000000000000539474057a9bba78 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Wed, Nov 14= , 2018 at 12:24 AM Ulrich Mueller <ulm= @gentoo.org> wrote:
>>= >>> On Wed, 14 Nov 2018, William Hubbs wrote:

> On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 06:17:17PM -0800, Rich Freeman wrote:
>> So, the purpose of allowing specific copyright holders to be named=
>> was to cover cases where we're forking foreign code, not to ba= sically
>> introduce a variant on the BSD advertising clause. IMO people who = are
>> only willing to contribute FOSS if their name gets put in a promin= ent
>> location might do better to contribute elsewhere.

+1000

Maybe the policy for the Gentoo repository should just say that, namely
that traditional copyright notices are only allowed for imported foreign code. Anything committed directly to the repository and any update of an existing file would be required to carry the simplified "Gentoo Author= s"
copyright notice, without any exceptions allowed.

Can someone come up with a good wording for this?

In my opinion the best wording belongs in python as a check in repom= an and the qa scripts monitoring PRs on github ;).
=C2=A0
> Do you feel this way about corporations as well? Do you think the
> Linux kernel maintainers should go and rip out all copyright notices > other than Linus Torvalds and maybe the Linux Foundation?

Why would corporations be different from individual authors? Under the
legislation here, corporations cannot even hold copyright (or rather,
Urheberrecht) of a work.

>> The purpose of a copyright notice is to declare that the file is >> copyrighted, and that is it.

Exactly.

>> It isn't a comprehensive list of everybody who holds a copyrig= ht on
>> the file.
>>
>> It isn't a revision history.
>>
>> There is no need to list various mixes of years and authors.=C2=A0= Just
>> list the first and last year, and whatever copyright holders are >> necessary.
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> But, if you had to have multiple lines, then just wrap the existin= g
>> notice.=C2=A0 Don't turn it into some kind of revision history= .=C2=A0 Just list
>> one year range and whatever list of entities you feel compelled to=
>> list.=C2=A0 That is the proper way to do a notice.

> No sir, it isn't.

> Look anywhere outside the Gentoo tree. For that matter, take the Linux=
> kernel, or even in the systemd source, there are several places with > multiple copyright notices in them.

Are these the only arguments you have?

To say it again, ebuilds have a copyright notice for exactly two
reasons:

- to protect us against the "innocent infringement" defense under=
U.S. law, and

- because the GPL-2 requires in section 1 to "appropriately publish on each copy an appropriate copyright notice".

For both of these, it is irrelevant what the precise contents of the
notice is. If you made a significant contribution to the file, then you
can claim copyright for it, even if there is no copyright notice at all, of if you aren't mentioned in it.

IANAL, but I think the case for being listed there explicitly is very
weak.

Ulrich
--000000000000539474057a9bba78--