From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C6EF138A1A for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:09:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 66460E0983; Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:09:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B40EE0953 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:09:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.4.8] (ppp-94-69-235-185.home.otenet.gr [94.69.235.185]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: hwoarang) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3E60A34078E for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:09:22 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <54E0704D.8020302@gentoo.org> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2015 12:09:17 +0200 From: Markos Chandras User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Gentoo, GitHub, and the Social Contract References: <201502142148.30540.dilfridge@gentoo.org> <1423967017.19532.4.camel@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Archives-Salt: 04a3ae99-2da4-4f45-9464-4222953d934c X-Archives-Hash: f932173623a37f5aa0740d41f0ba9871 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 On 02/15/15 04:57, Ben de Groot wrote: > On 15 February 2015 at 10:23, Mart Raudsepp > wrote: >> On L, 2015-02-14 at 16:37 -0500, Rich Freeman wrote: >>> On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 3:48 PM, Andreas K. Huettel >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> We need to resolve this discussion somehow, by formulating a >>>> clear policy. Which is why I'm putting it up here for >>>> discussion and will ask to add it to the next council meeting >>>> agenda. >>> >>> I tend to agree with what seems to be the general sentiment. >>> As long as we still accept patches via bugzilla/etc, then we >>> aren't "depending" on github. >>> >>> FOSS alternatives are to be preferred, but since we don't have >>> those set up, I don't see why we have to live without anything >>> in the meantime. If somebody wants to host such a thing, I'd >>> encourage them to do so, and work with infra if they'll accept >>> help. >> >> That is a good question. I'm sorry if I am the only one to point >> this out, but: We do NOT have even a WEB VIEW of our OFFICIAL >> overlays to see what is going on there without BLINDLY cloning >> git URIs randomly! Why should contributors care ONE BIT about >> things outside their comfort zone of contributions, which is >> github in many cases these days? After 6 months of complete >> blindness on official overlays, I was eventually pointed at an >> outside cgit which shows what's going on there. >> >> After 2 years of talking, we are still using CVS. >> >> It is not surprising one bit that GitHub is the last hope to >> people hoping to help out, with some folks willing to get their >> contributions to actually MATTER. We have failed the community to >> provide any reasonable free software ways to contribute. So >> semi-open source ways it is. >> >> >> With all the respect to the infra team they have done with their >> existing capabilities, but we need to do better and find better >> ways to achieve what we can with existing resources and fix this >> completely sad state. >> >> >> Mart >> >> > > It is unfortunate that things fall through the cracks at infra, > and more and more useful tools are not provided by services under > gentoo.org, but by personal initiatives and hosted on other > domains. > > For this reason I propose that Sven Wegener, Michał Górny, and > Patrick Lauer be made members of the infra team, because they get > things done that the other infra members don't (for whatever > reason, not pointing fingers here). I'm thinking here about useful > tools such as: > > - https://github.com/gentoo/gentoo-portage-rsync-mirror - > http://cgit.gentooexperimental.org/ - #gentoo-commits bot - > AutoRepoman > I too believe that infra shouldn't be a blocking factor in our development process. If the infra team is not giving what we want to develop software in collaboration with the user community we need to look to other alternatives. If we need to use github or $foobar to facilitate that so be it. Maybe the social contract does not apply 100% anymore and we need to adapt it. Being flexible and relevant is critical for a distro to succeed. We can't simply turn down contributors based on what means they use to contribute. - -- Regards, Markos Chandras -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJU4HBNAAoJEPqDWhW0r/LCLXkQALvcae5yz4d3TA63GD7ISs7g NjE6QGCnsxtIEhq9yTAd+gZtjhnM0dMn31/DCVCSUA77wPqr5UPCCZSGjHujRTo+ GubHjZfvlDq6Rm2geklqGooxXwflg16Ddc6nuwxZDXhrKDifvX1BuEO645JTz1je /mzNtCaSbe2hGabVbrC7wgnfgYzjV1nh8U3zDKiTXFX+AZd8pd0ciCtUwk58wdKy 1peosogTqn2Iahc3XW2NG/J/j/eHnNBy9PCC8+gY0LyJdbVMHKucccRswSUHjlu6 VPlX5UxN+vrZSDI1np8Qk1TvjFh2+iGoT9sEsYE5U5rta8fWmtKAHpvhl92qlC+0 O4BZ6uX20KYx4Wec7b3iUKi3GXnU7Oimw2olz9kZfw6o2oPBrqMORd2Eei4QepAZ OkAlJih6QRhYT3eFVeqX4TYtfVuAcYsTyu7533t64pnNBlV3H0MU93ZVNW48y1Jf /8cW6YkgfpVnvNPT1wIF3+V01IIQfvOpfUzC4wlkwks98v26ySYbokidn4bwoRFs F4QcApdyl9ktTHzkWRj1ll4JuMmYDfvmcHspHkbMRhUWH9W9GzGNwkV5QW9N5Vz8 Moon2DWUWijNtKVmD8w2FHpKsnUUX1ksGk9jcDi/pZmswbGCIysV+Hyh4+qysK+a z/cibkWDZZv9UyVlrs1W =b1N8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----