From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F4D71387FD for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2014 17:32:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 21A25E0AE1; Sun, 6 Apr 2014 17:32:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 55DF3E0ADC for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2014 17:32:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.1.11] (pool-108-39-152-11.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net [108.39.152.11]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: zerochaos) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 175DC33FAD8 for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2014 17:31:59 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <53418FE8.4030200@gentoo.org> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2014 13:33:28 -0400 From: "Rick \"Zero_Chaos\" Farina" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Call for agenda items - Council meeting 2014-04-08 References: <53342A5F.70903@gentoo.org> <201404061435.00789.dilfridge@gentoo.org> <53414CD2.4030100@gentoo.org> <53416E80.40605@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: <53416E80.40605@gentoo.org> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Archives-Salt: 4d622b81-14c1-460c-ab43-5066a96126f3 X-Archives-Hash: b6e18e479a8b05a3e26f12db4eb2db25 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 04/06/2014 11:10 AM, Samuli Suominen wrote: > > On 06/04/14 15:47, hasufell wrote: >> Andreas K. Huettel: >>> 5) The council encourages teams maintaining central parts of Gentoo >>> to accept new developers as team members and teach them the >>> required knowledge and intricacies. We consider this important to >>> ensure long-term continuity and increase the bus factor in critical >>> areas. >> >> >> Or don't accept them as team members in the first place, which is >> perfectly fine if you can still contribute as a non-team member. > > I agree, new developers shouldn't be allowed in the QA team, there > should be some 5 year limit > at least as safe kludge to avoid disrespect like this: > > #gentoo-qa, yesterday: > > 21:37 <@Zero_Chaos> floppym: honestly there are a few "senior" gentoo > developers which could be shot in the head for all I care. I fully stand by my statements. There are a few senior developers who feel they can do whatever they like. They ignore policy, revert things others have done to improve gentoo, or otherwise make major changes without consulting anyone. Since this statement was made in the context of a similar discussion about "senior" developers I'd like to add that it's not just one person, nor is it just senior developers who have this issue. The big difference is that the newer developers often respond to a polite "please stop reverting changes" while the "senior" developers think they are god's immortal gifts to gentoo and above reproach. To anyone that thinks they can do whatever they like, all the time, no matter what policy they are breaking, know that will not abide. Thanks, Zero_Chaos PS> Incidentally, this comment actually wasn't even about you, if you go back and check the context you can probably plainly see that. But of course that is neither here nor there. > > #gentoo-qa, today: > > 09:16 <@xiaomiao> if you don't ... well ... one dev more or less isn't > *that* much difference, we can deal with it > 09:17 <@xiaomiao> blah policy ... it took me months just to get PMS > fixed with a two-line patch > > Publicly stating he doesn't care about policies, I read that as only > caring about his personal opinion and then, > abusing the powers gained from the membership. > >> Letting someone in and then starting to teach him seems like the wrong >> approach to me. >> >> We should encourage the opposite order. > > I agree. Specially when some of the new developers who gain a QA > membership think it elevates them into higher > platform than others who have been involved for years, making them > stubborn, in a way they don't listen to others. > > I didn't want to send this mail, but I felt I had to, because this has > gone too far. > > - Samuli > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.22 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJTQY/oAAoJEKXdFCfdEflKG+4P/Re2F/dPl+1/9C4bl1tKk6UX e4jluXXrPvDfdAdmL68wMZromzjCwlirvIh4/svCIXkFlAWXGhS82MH+zFbbKLVO ETyfxsGgU/Iu9rLl8Cj883eRq+hMtHdBTMKuc0p00NJqLhdgxP291Cj5tk7xAe/H 6JF06C8j2scW9VTCufIaU2UZas94hIrr6Xem174sVvtcfN3CvQrWeRnabYupuBOW dLBcKQokzUkZvwLAivFX3CSGR9O2HeFLMcYx8lQEFmx5026IchcSFthlF1R0FxDf 4IarjnjlKK+K9r6OFMiRxT/yWKoVgAmGj4M6Xt1qgF/0z4e/eV8PkuR2jBYnB0pH Ey40Hru9X18LzFAAH4Sr+fyejwJ/goQ4CLcdihD+X0wD0Ht03JBPxaATMWuQ8hiC q8BKNdgDRH39iSXR013U8CyS6rAZYNTn6WRVaUfrLeFuT8ndBIzQ4SKCboprJ4Lg fQAFW3zku5EHYKyuU2GgiDi03nD67rlyZvopC0ddrqKNxX0G4bNwzUhEN40UkUK4 mn6QhGBW47ROLmguNQof4hcNyERWCRT1YIs9TqT8sW1bf8hFw+hdJFojBh6M92YT t9X0dSHi32QuTg3ch6DTJ0RR3HAtEGkezpfYRcMUFF0NJ3+sXVTpSG9YFpbW87Nv tejgkL3jJu8ojDp6C1VF =jvZk -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----