From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9F4E138334 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2019 15:33:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6F80DE0878; Wed, 19 Jun 2019 15:33:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (dev.gentoo.org [IPv6:2001:470:ea4a:1:5054:ff:fec7:86e4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48DD8E0874 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2019 15:33:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from linux1.home (cpe-66-68-48-101.austin.res.rr.com [66.68.48.101]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: williamh) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 87B5A3464CE for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2019 15:33:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: (nullmailer pid 18274 invoked by uid 1000); Wed, 19 Jun 2019 14:32:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 09:32:13 -0500 From: William Hubbs To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Questions for Gentoo Council nominees: Gentoo as hobbyist distro Message-ID: <20190619143213.GA18156@linux1.home> Mail-Followup-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org References: <20190615124220.fcf0c08b22481d5bc6c2dbe0@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Project discussion list X-BeenThere: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org Reply-To: gentoo-project@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.1 (2018-07-13) X-Archives-Salt: 9d70d9ae-4756-4999-b9cd-c47ca1bf2ff4 X-Archives-Hash: 680029743554889176b72d7d84c1a636 --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Jun 16, 2019 at 08:09:38PM +0200, Micha=C5=82 G=C3=B3rny wrote: > On Sat, 2019-06-15 at 12:42 +0300, Andrew Savchenko wrote: > Some developers were recently complaining that we're turning Gentoo into > a hobbyist distro and that's apparently bad. >=20 > Do you think Gentoo should allow for experimental and unstable features, > and possibly breaking changes that make Gentoo more interesting for > hobbyists? Or should we block breaking changes and become more > conservative for users who prefer stable distribution with minimal > maintenance burden? This is sort of vague, but I do have a couple of thoughts on the matter. I have heard of production users deciding to use full ~ keywords, e.g. ACCEPT_KEYWORDS=3D"~amd64" This has never been a good idea, production users should be using the opposite, because ~ packages will have breakages from time to time. I don't know how it is now, but I know that keeping the stable tree relevant has been a big issue for us in the past for a number of reasons, and I still think we should improve that. Never breaking backward compatibility is not possible. The best we can do is provide a smooth transition forward for users. Unfortunately, sometimes, manual intervention must happen. For example, the migration to the 17.1 profiles had no other option. At the package level, backward compatibility depends a lot on what upstreams do. It is up to the individual package maintainers to make sure that upgrades happen as smoothly as possible -- automatically where possible, but if this is not possible, upgrading instructions should be available to the user some way. Other than that, I'm not sure how to answer this. I would be open to a discussion to try to figure it out. Thanks, William --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iF0EARECAB0WIQTVeuxEZo4uUHOkQAluVBb0MMRlOAUCXQpHaQAKCRBuVBb0MMRl OFSvAKCbTIBqzdpy6bNcRvkdRm2BKyxtAQCdEvru+Gq0lWHNfAm+jtafW9h8FW8= =GIO8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --qMm9M+Fa2AknHoGS--