[gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Theo Chatzimichos]

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Hi

I've been discussing with some devrel members in the past about gentoo/user 
and gentoo/contributor cloaks. I though (and it was not only me) that 
gentoo/contributor cloaks are given to ATs and HTs only, so I wanted to give 
gentoo/user cloaks to some people that do various stuff apart from writing code 
(stuff like representing gentoo in conferences, give support to others in 
gentoo localized IRC channels, translate, promote the distro, etc). I've been 
told though that devrel doesn't provide gentoo/user cloaks any more, and what 
could be done is to give gentoo/contributor cloaks to someone if a developer 
can vouch for him. There is no official policy though, Jorge would start a 
discussion but never did, so I'm sending this mail with his approval, to start 
a discussion and finally set a policy.
My opinion is that gentoo/contributor cloaks are very important to be given to 
users. Especially amongst greek community many people like the idea of getting 
a gentoo cloak. But devrel has to keep a list of those people (plus the 
developer who vouched for them), possibly somewhere under the projspace (I 
believe it could be public, yes).
I hope we have a final decision soon, as I don't think it is an easy to solve 
task.
-- 
Theo Chatzimichos (tampakrap) | blog.tampakrap.gr
Gentoo KDE/Qt, Planet, Overlays

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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Mike Frysinger]

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makes sense.  just add some simple xml/text file to the gentoo/xml/proj/... 
space like herds.xml.  then the cloak list can be automated from that.
-mike

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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Petteri Räty]

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On 13.07.2011 05:15, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
> Hi
> 
> I've been discussing with some devrel members in the past about gentoo/user 
> and gentoo/contributor cloaks. I though (and it was not only me) that 
> gentoo/contributor cloaks are given to ATs and HTs only, so I wanted to give 
> gentoo/user cloaks to some people that do various stuff apart from writing code 
> (stuff like representing gentoo in conferences, give support to others in 
> gentoo localized IRC channels, translate, promote the distro, etc). I've been 
> told though that devrel doesn't provide gentoo/user cloaks any more, and what 
> could be done is to give gentoo/contributor cloaks to someone if a developer 
> can vouch for him. There is no official policy though, Jorge would start a 
> discussion but never did, so I'm sending this mail with his approval, to start 
> a discussion and finally set a policy.
> My opinion is that gentoo/contributor cloaks are very important to be given to 
> users. Especially amongst greek community many people like the idea of getting 
> a gentoo cloak. But devrel has to keep a list of those people (plus the 
> developer who vouched for them), possibly somewhere under the projspace (I 
> believe it could be public, yes).
> I hope we have a final decision soon, as I don't think it is an easy to solve 
> task.

Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.

Regards,
Petteri


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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Mike Frysinger]

On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 13:13, Petteri Räty wrote:
> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked

speaking of that, Gentoo GSoC cloaks for people who complete GSoC would be cool
-mike

Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Theo Chatzimichos]

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On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
> 
> Regards,
> Petteri

Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
scratch?
-- 
Theo Chatzimichos | blog.tampakrap.gr
Gentoo KDE/Qt, Planet, Overlays

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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Petteri Räty]

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On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
> On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Petteri
> 
> Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
> Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
> scratch?

I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.

Regards,
Petteri


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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Donnie Berkholz]

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On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
> > On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
> >> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
> >> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
> >> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
> >> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
> >> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Petteri
> > 
> > Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
> > Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
> > scratch?
> 
> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.

Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either 
devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a 
global issue.

-- 
Thanks,
Donnie

Donnie Berkholz
Council Member / Sr. Developer
Gentoo Linux
Blog: http://dberkholz.com

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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Petteri Räty]

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On 15.07.2011 15:40, Donnie Berkholz wrote:
> On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
>> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
>>> On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>>>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>>>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>>>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>>>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>>>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Petteri
>>>
>>> Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
>>> Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
>>> scratch?
>>
>> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
>> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
>> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
>> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.
> 
> Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either 
> devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a 
> global issue.
> 

I think cloaks are a project wide issue. If you think it's best for
devrel to handle it on our own then I suggest we have a council vote
saying that or I can try to get a GLEP for devrel done and include it in
there for responsibilities.

Regards,
Petteri


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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Markos Chandras]

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Hash: SHA512

On 15/07/2011 05:22 μμ, Petteri Räty wrote:
> On 15.07.2011 15:40, Donnie Berkholz wrote:
>> On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
>>> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
>>>> On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>>>>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>>>>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>>>>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>>>>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>>>>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Petteri
>>>>
>>>> Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
>>>> Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
>>>> scratch?
>>>
>>> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
>>> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
>>> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
>>> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.
>>
>> Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either 
>> devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a 
>> global issue.
>>
> 
> I think cloaks are a project wide issue. If you think it's best for
> devrel to handle it on our own then I suggest we have a council vote
> saying that or I can try to get a GLEP for devrel done and include it in
> there for responsibilities.
> 
> Regards,
> Petteri
> 
Are you sure this issue falls under the devrel's umbrella? Seems more
appropriate for userrel. Regarding the GLEP for devrel, are you talking
about this?

http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.project/1112

We can add it to our agenda as well

- -- 
Regards,
Markos Chandras / Gentoo Linux Developer / Key ID: B4AFF2C2
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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Petteri Räty]

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On 16.07.2011 22:00, Markos Chandras wrote:
> On 15/07/2011 05:22 μμ, Petteri Räty wrote:
>> On 15.07.2011 15:40, Donnie Berkholz wrote:
>>> On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
>>>> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>>>>>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>>>>>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>>>>>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>>>>>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>>>>>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Petteri
>>>>>
>>>>> Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
>>>>> Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
>>>>> scratch?
>>>>
>>>> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
>>>> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
>>>> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
>>>> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.
>>>
>>> Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either 
>>> devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a 
>>> global issue.
>>>
> 
>> I think cloaks are a project wide issue. If you think it's best for
>> devrel to handle it on our own then I suggest we have a council vote
>> saying that or I can try to get a GLEP for devrel done and include it in
>> there for responsibilities.
> 
>> Regards,
>> Petteri
> 
> Are you sure this issue falls under the devrel's umbrella? Seems more
> appropriate for userrel. Regarding the GLEP for devrel, are you talking
> about this?
> 

Merging userrel to devrel has been my and Jorge's agenda for quite a
while now.

>
> http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.project/1112
> 
> We can add it to our agenda as well
> 

Yes we could vote on that verbatim too but it would be more beneficial
to do check if something should be changed while at it.

Regards,
Petteri



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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Markos Chandras]

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Hash: SHA512

On 15/07/2011 03:40 ??, Donnie Berkholz wrote:
> On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
>> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
>>> On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>>>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>>>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>>>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>>>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>>>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Petteri
>>>
>>> Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP. 
>>> Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from 
>>> scratch?
>>
>> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
>> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
>> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
>> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.
> 
> Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either 
> devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a 
> global issue.
> 
Yes this makes sense. This fits better to userrel project[1] than the
devrel one. I am not sure of the actual status for this project though.
Besides that, is there a way to retrieve the current list of
gentoo/{contributor,user} cloaks somehow? We can use a table in userrel
project page like this one

<user> - <email> - <cloak> - <developer who requested the cloak> - <reason>

[1]http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/userrel/

- -- 
Regards,
Markos Chandras / Gentoo Linux Developer / Key ID: B4AFF2C2
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Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Mike Frysinger]

On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 08:40, Donnie Berkholz wrote:
> On 20:39 Thu 14 Jul     , Petteri Räty wrote:
>> On 14.07.2011 20:32, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
>> > On Thursday 14 of July 2011 20:13:55 Petteri Räty wrote:
>> >> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>> >> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>> >> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>> >> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>> >> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>> >
>> > Not interested in joining devrel, sorry, but I could start writing the GLEP.
>> > Is there an existing one about cloaks that we could improve, or start from
>> > scratch?
>>
>> I am not aware of any of the existing GLEPs covering the matter so from
>> scratch is probably required. For the GLEP I think it's enough if we
>> keep things simple and just list the conditions for getting and keeping
>> each type of cloak and the process of getting requesting a cloak.
>
> Why should this be a GLEP? Seems like it should be covered by either
> devrel or userrel, no need for the council to get involved as it's not a
> global issue.

in the past, we made Gentoo e-mail forward rewards a Council issue as
the project in general couldnt agree on it, and they (being elected
representation to decided project-wide issues) finished it off.

in this case, i dont see anyone who doesnt want this to happen, so we
can probably delegate it to userrel, have them formulate a plan (seems
like we've got all the pieces already), and then just post the result
here for all to review.
-mike

Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Andreas K. Huettel]

Am Donnerstag, 14. Juli 2011, 19:13:55 schrieb Petteri Räty:
>
> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
> 

After the policies have been figured out I can maintain this; I think it's a 
very good idea to make contributor cloaks available to eager supporters.

-- 
Andreas K. Huettel (dilfridge)
Gentoo Linux developer
kde, sci, arm, tex

Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[David Abbott]

On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 6:11 AM, Andreas K. Huettel
<dilfridge@gentoo.org> wrote:
> Am Donnerstag, 14. Juli 2011, 19:13:55 schrieb Petteri Räty:
>>
>> Keeping a list and periodically going through it seems fine to me. Are
>> you or someone else interested in joining devrel to get this implemented
>> and maintained? The policy should probably be written as a GLEP and I
>> can help with that but until GSoC is over I am pretty much fully booked
>> for Gentoo time so I would like to avoid championing it at this point.
>>
>
> After the policies have been figured out I can maintain this; I think it's a
> very good idea to make contributor cloaks available to eager supporters.
>
> --
> Andreas K. Huettel (dilfridge)
> Gentoo Linux developer
> kde, sci, arm, tex
>
>

I also would be willing to help out.
Regards,
David

-- 
David Abbott (dabbott)
Gentoo
http://dev.gentoo.org/~dabbott/

Re: [gentoo-project] gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks

[Markos Chandras]

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On 07/13/2011 03:15 AM, Theo Chatzimichos wrote:
> Hi
> 
> I've been discussing with some devrel members in the past about
> gentoo/user and gentoo/contributor cloaks. I though (and it was not
> only me) that gentoo/contributor cloaks are given to ATs and HTs
> only, so I wanted to give gentoo/user cloaks to some people that do
> various stuff apart from writing code (stuff like representing gentoo
> in conferences, give support to others in gentoo localized IRC
> channels, translate, promote the distro, etc). I've been told though
> that devrel doesn't provide gentoo/user cloaks any more, and what 
> could be done is to give gentoo/contributor cloaks to someone if a
> developer can vouch for him. There is no official policy though,
> Jorge would start a discussion but never did, so I'm sending this
> mail with his approval, to start a discussion and finally set a
> policy. My opinion is that gentoo/contributor cloaks are very
> important to be given to users. Especially amongst greek community
> many people like the idea of getting a gentoo cloak. But devrel has
> to keep a list of those people (plus the developer who vouched for
> them), possibly somewhere under the projspace (I believe it could be
> public, yes). I hope we have a final decision soon, as I don't think
> it is an easy to solve task.

I am sorry but my attempt to bring this to the Council did not succeed.
- From what I gathered, group-contacts alone are responsible to take care
of that which brings us back to square 0. Good luck with your effort to
move this forward ;)

- -- 
Regards,
Markos Chandras / Gentoo Linux Developer / Key ID: B4AFF2C2
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