[gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Alec Warner]

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In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for 2019, as
well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?

I'll leave 1 week for discussion and then assuming the discussion has
concluded we can vote yay / nay on that item.

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Aaron Bauman]

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On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 03:33:26PM -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for 2019, as
> well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> 
> I'll leave 1 week for discussion and then assuming the discussion has
> concluded we can vote yay / nay on that item.

No concerns here. Thank you to Matthew for finding the firm and Robin
for coordinating all the data and past finances!

-- 
Cheers,
Aaron

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Matthew Thode]

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On 20-07-20 15:33:26, Alec Warner wrote:
> In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for 2019, as
> well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> 
> I'll leave 1 week for discussion and then assuming the discussion has
> concluded we can vote yay / nay on that item.

I don't have much of a concern, though I will point out that now that we
have somewhat of a handle on our tax situation we can likely get more
quotes and possibly drop the price.

-- 
Matthew Thode (prometheanfire)

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Michał Górny]

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On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for 2019, as
> well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> 

1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale bookkeeping
this time?

2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
filings by the CPA?

3. Could you get some quotes first?

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny


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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Alec Warner]

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I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org>
wrote:

> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for 2019, as
> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> >
>
> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale bookkeeping
> this time?
>

This is just the filings for now.


>
> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
> filings by the CPA?
>

I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them properly
for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.

Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
making mistakes.


>
> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
>

I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid 1500$ per
tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.)


> --
> Best regards,
> Michał Górny
>
>

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Michał Górny]

Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
>I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
><mgorny@gentoo.org>
>wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
>> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
>2019, as
>> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
>> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
>> >
>>
>> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale bookkeeping
>> this time?
>>
>
>This is just the filings for now.
>
>
>>
>> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
>> filings by the CPA?
>>
>
>I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
>properly
>for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
>
>Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
>making mistakes.
>
>
>>
>> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
>>
>
>I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid 1500$
>per
>tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes. 

Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this year (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?


--
Best regards, 
Michał Górny

Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Matthew Thode]

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On 20-07-21 04:38:17, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
> >I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
> ><mgorny@gentoo.org>
> >wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> >> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
> >2019, as
> >> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> >> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> >> >
> >>
> >> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale bookkeeping
> >> this time?
> >>
> >
> >This is just the filings for now.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
> >> filings by the CPA?
> >>
> >
> >I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
> >properly
> >for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
> >
> >Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
> >making mistakes.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
> >>
> >
> >I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid 1500$
> >per
> >tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes. 
> 
> Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this year (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
> 

Net year over year we've been going up and to the right, so even with
this (admitidly large to my eyes) bill, we are fine.

-- 
Matthew Thode (prometheanfire)

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Alec Warner]

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On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 9:38 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:

> Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> napisał(a):
> >I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
> ><mgorny@gentoo.org>
> >wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> >> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
> >2019, as
> >> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> >> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> >> >
> >>
> >> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale bookkeeping
> >> this time?
> >>
> >
> >This is just the filings for now.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
> >> filings by the CPA?
> >>
> >
> >I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
> >properly
> >for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
> >
> >Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
> >making mistakes.
> >
> >
> >>
> >> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
> >>
> >
> >I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid 1500$
> >per
> >tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.
>
> Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last
> years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this year
> (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
>

Our fiscal year runs July => June. So the fiscal 2020 year just completed.
We don't have complete financials for fiscal 2020 yet. I looked at the
paypal transactions and donations are slightly up from fiscal 2019. We
should have the financials done later in the year (typically around AGM
time.)

-A


>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Michał Górny
>

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Michał Górny]

Dnia July 21, 2020 5:13:29 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org> napisał(a):
>On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 9:38 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
>> Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
>> napisał(a):
>> >I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
>> ><mgorny@gentoo.org>
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
>> >> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
>> >2019, as
>> >> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
>> >> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale
>bookkeeping
>> >> this time?
>> >>
>> >
>> >This is just the filings for now.
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
>> >> filings by the CPA?
>> >>
>> >
>> >I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
>> >properly
>> >for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
>> >
>> >Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
>> >making mistakes.
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
>> >>
>> >
>> >I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid
>1500$
>> >per
>> >tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.
>>
>> Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last
>> years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this
>year
>> (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
>>
>
>Our fiscal year runs July => June. So the fiscal 2020 year just
>completed.
>We don't have complete financials for fiscal 2020 yet. I looked at the
>paypal transactions and donations are slightly up from fiscal 2019. We
>should have the financials done later in the year (typically around AGM
>time.)

Are you saying that we haven't been negatively impacted by the pandemic? 

>
>-A
>
>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best regards,
>> Michał Górny
>>


--
Best regards, 
Michał Górny

Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Alec Warner]

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On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 10:39 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:

> Dnia July 21, 2020 5:13:29 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> napisał(a):
> >On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 9:38 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> >> napisał(a):
> >> >I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
> >> ><mgorny@gentoo.org>
> >> >wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> >> >> > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
> >> >2019, as
> >> >> > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> >> >> > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale
> >bookkeeping
> >> >> this time?
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >This is just the filings for now.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
> >> >> filings by the CPA?
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
> >> >properly
> >> >for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
> >> >
> >> >Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
> >> >making mistakes.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> 3. Could you get some quotes first?
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid
> >1500$
> >> >per
> >> >tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.
> >>
> >> Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last
> >> years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this
> >year
> >> (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
> >>
> >
> >Our fiscal year runs July => June. So the fiscal 2020 year just
> >completed.
> >We don't have complete financials for fiscal 2020 yet. I looked at the
> >paypal transactions and donations are slightly up from fiscal 2019. We
> >should have the financials done later in the year (typically around AGM
> >time.)
>
> Are you saying that we haven't been negatively impacted by the pandemic?
>

I'm saying the paypal donations look similar. It's not a complete
accounting (sometimes people give us money not through paypal.)

If you want a full accounting I recommend waiting for the report at the
AGM; this is me just trying to get you an estimated answer quickly. Does
that make sense?

-A


>
> >
> >-A
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Best regards,
> >> Michał Górny
> >>
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Michał Górny
>

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Michał Górny]

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On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 22:55 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 10:39 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
> 
> > Dnia July 21, 2020 5:13:29 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> > napisał(a):
> > > On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 9:38 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> > > > napisał(a):
> > > > > I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
> > > > > <mgorny@gentoo.org>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> > > > > > > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes for
> > > > > 2019, as
> > > > > > > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns with
> > > > > > > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale
> > > bookkeeping
> > > > > > this time?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > This is just the filings for now.
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > > 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have previous
> > > > > > filings by the CPA?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
> > > > > properly
> > > > > for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
> > > > > making mistakes.
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > > 3. Could you get some quotes first?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid
> > > 1500$
> > > > > per
> > > > > tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.
> > > > 
> > > > Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare last
> > > > years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this
> > > year
> > > > (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > Our fiscal year runs July => June. So the fiscal 2020 year just
> > > completed.
> > > We don't have complete financials for fiscal 2020 yet. I looked at the
> > > paypal transactions and donations are slightly up from fiscal 2019. We
> > > should have the financials done later in the year (typically around AGM
> > > time.)
> > 
> > Are you saying that we haven't been negatively impacted by the pandemic?
> > 
> 
> I'm saying the paypal donations look similar. It's not a complete
> accounting (sometimes people give us money not through paypal.)
> 
> If you want a full accounting I recommend waiting for the report at the
> AGM; this is me just trying to get you an estimated answer quickly. Does
> that make sense?
> 

Well, you didn't answer me how it compares but I've dug it up anyway.

So if I read the financial reports right, cash donations in the last
years were around (I'm ignoring the fees, GSoC income, etc.):

FY2016: $12.5k
FY2017: $11.5k
FY2018: $23k

So FY2019 should be similar.

If the price remained at $1.5k a year, this would be around 7% of cash
donations.  Isn't this a bit much?

-- 
Best regards,
Michał Górny


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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Rich Freeman]

On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 7:08 AM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
> FY2016: $12.5k
> FY2017: $11.5k
> FY2018: $23k
>
> So FY2019 should be similar.
>
> If the price remained at $1.5k a year, this would be around 7% of cash
> donations.  Isn't this a bit much?

I have a relative who is part of an accounting business and I suspect
they wouldn't even talk to a small business for less than $1k.  Being
a small organization isn't super-efficient - the compliance
requirements are the same as a medium-sized one and the money
available is less.

I do my own taxes, and it would probably cost me hundreds of dollars
to pay somebody else to do it for me, despite this not really being
hard for me to do.  Some of that is risk - I already know my finances
and I collect my data in a way that makes it easier to deal with, and
I don't have any risk that somebody else left something out which gets
me in trouble.  A CPA has liability/insurance/etc and they have to
carefully go through your records to make sure they look complete and
gather data.  They also have to deal with billing/taxes/etc since
money is changing hands.

I guess a CS analogy would be the difference between writing a simple
shell script vs hiring somebody else to write a simple shell script -
just think of the questions you'd ask in designing such a thing to
make sure that you're eliciting any hidden requirements, and how much
more effort it takes to do it right vs what you'd just cobble together
for yourself.  Then throw a layer of contracts/billing/etc on top of
that.

Now, certainly the cost to maintain the books ought to be less than
the cost to initially get them cleaned up.  However, the provider
might have been being generous with their rate or treating us as a
loss-leader.

We could DIY it, but IMO that is REALLY risky given our track record.
I think at the very least we should have a few solid years behind us
and multiple people familiar with the process who are eager to take
something like this on before risking that.  Then keep in mind the
first time you have to pick up the phone to call in help you're going
to get the consulting rate.

-- 
Rich

Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Alec Warner]

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On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 4:08 AM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:

> On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 22:55 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> > On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 10:39 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org> wrote:
> >
> > > Dnia July 21, 2020 5:13:29 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org>
> > > napisał(a):
> > > > On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 9:38 PM Michał Górny <mgorny@gentoo.org>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Dnia July 21, 2020 4:31:22 AM UTC, Alec Warner <antarus@gentoo.org
> >
> > > > > napisał(a):
> > > > > > I drove.On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 8:10 PM Michał Górny
> > > > > > <mgorny@gentoo.org>
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Mon, 2020-07-20 at 15:33 -0700, Alec Warner wrote:
> > > > > > > > In our previous fiscal year we hired a firm to do our taxes
> for
> > > > > > 2019, as
> > > > > > > > well as a number of previous years. Are there any concerns
> with
> > > > > > > > retaining this firm for the 2020 tax year?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1. Are we talking about 'just' the filings or full-scale
> > > > bookkeeping
> > > > > > > this time?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This is just the filings for now.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > 2. How hard would it be to do it ourselves, given we have
> previous
> > > > > > > filings by the CPA?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't know anyone who could do them properly. I cannot do them
> > > > > > properly
> > > > > > for certain. The tax return last year was 14 pages.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Obviously I could file something; but there are penalties for
> > > > > > making mistakes.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > 3. Could you get some quotes first?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I haven't asked for a price from the CPA yet. Last year we paid
> > > > 1500$
> > > > > > per
> > > > > > tax year (and per 1, this payment was just for taxes.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh, one more thing I've forgotten to ask. How does this compare
> last
> > > > > years' donations, and what are our prospective donations for this
> > > > year
> > > > > (based on received so far vs 1st half last year)?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Our fiscal year runs July => June. So the fiscal 2020 year just
> > > > completed.
> > > > We don't have complete financials for fiscal 2020 yet. I looked at
> the
> > > > paypal transactions and donations are slightly up from fiscal 2019.
> We
> > > > should have the financials done later in the year (typically around
> AGM
> > > > time.)
> > >
> > > Are you saying that we haven't been negatively impacted by the
> pandemic?
> > >
> >
> > I'm saying the paypal donations look similar. It's not a complete
> > accounting (sometimes people give us money not through paypal.)
> >
> > If you want a full accounting I recommend waiting for the report at the
> > AGM; this is me just trying to get you an estimated answer quickly. Does
> > that make sense?
> >
>
> Well, you didn't answer me how it compares but I've dug it up anyway.
>

Maybe I'm misunderstanding. To me "this year" is fiscal 2021 (the year we
just began) and last year is fiscal 2020 (the year that just ended in June)
We have no published numbers for fiscal 2020 (the books are not complete)
so I provided an estimate for fiscal 2020 and I said it looked similar to
fiscal 2019 for paypal donations. So when you said "how does it compare to
last years donations" I felt like my answer was well intentioned. But now I
see you wrote "years'" and maybe you meant multiple "like how does it
compare to the last five years" which makes your reply below make more
sense ;)


>
> So if I read the financial reports right, cash donations in the last
> years were around (I'm ignoring the fees, GSoC income, etc.):
>
> FY2016: $12.5k
> FY2017: $11.5k
> FY2018: $23k
>

The Fiscal 2019 numbers are at
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Foundation:Gentoo_Foundation_Finances_FY2019


>
> So FY2019 should be similar.
>

FY2019: $16404, but remember this is July 2018 - June 2019

As I said before, I don't have the FY2020 numbers. I expect them to be
north of $10,000 and they cover July 2019 - June 2020.


> If the price remained at $1.5k a year, this would be around 7% of cash
> donations.  Isn't this a bit much?


NetBSD spends about 3-5k a year on legal and operational expenses according
to their filings. If we hired this accountant for Tax and Bookkeeping our
expenses would be somewhere around 4k a year. So this seems in the right
ballpark of costs for these tasks. I agree 7% is high. However because we
are spending about the same as the peer organizations I have looked at, I'm
not confident we can effectively reduce these costs very much without
impacting the work product. There are penalties and fines for doing the
taxes wrong so i'm less eager to hire a very cheap CPA to do them.

-A


>




> --
> Best regards,
> Michał Górny
>
>

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Francisco Blas Izquierdo Riera (klondike)]

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El 21/7/20 a las 19:41, Alec Warner escribió:
> NetBSD spends about 3-5k a year on legal and operational expenses according to their filings. If we hired this accountant for Tax and Bookkeeping our expenses would be somewhere around 4k a year. So this seems in the right ballpark of costs for these tasks. I agree 7% is high. However because we are spending about the same as the peer organizations I have looked at, I'm not confident we can effectively reduce these costs very much without impacting the work product. There are penalties and fines for doing the taxes wrong so i'm less eager to hire a very cheap CPA to do them.
Plus an accountant who is not a CPA cannot, under most circumstances, represent the Foundation in front of the IRS during an audit. Given the Foundation's current history I wouldn't be surprised if it  gets audited.

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Re: [gentoo-nfp] [Discussion and vote] Hire CPA for Fiscal 2020 taxes

[Rich Freeman]

On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 1:46 PM Francisco Blas Izquierdo Riera
(klondike) <klondike@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
> El 21/7/20 a las 19:41, Alec Warner escribió:
>
> NetBSD spends about 3-5k a year on legal and operational expenses according to their filings. If we hired this accountant for Tax and Bookkeeping our expenses would be somewhere around 4k a year. So this seems in the right ballpark of costs for these tasks. I agree 7% is high. However because we are spending about the same as the peer organizations I have looked at, I'm not confident we can effectively reduce these costs very much without impacting the work product. There are penalties and fines for doing the taxes wrong so i'm less eager to hire a very cheap CPA to do them.
>
> Plus an accountant who is not a CPA cannot, under most circumstances, represent the Foundation in front of the IRS during an audit. Given the Foundation's current history I wouldn't be surprised if it  gets audited.

Honestly, in our current state I think our emphasis should be on
compliance, not cost-cutting.  You have to master the basics before
you start getting fancy.

Plus switching CPAs after the first year we've actually gotten things
done right doesn't seem wise.

This is the cost of properly running an organization.  It would be one
thing if everything were fine spending less, but it hasn't been.

-- 
Rich