From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from lists.gentoo.org ([140.105.134.102] helo=robin.gentoo.org) by nuthatch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Gk2RJ-0000LW-Us for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 14 Nov 2006 17:51:18 +0000 Received: from robin.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with SMTP id kAEHoSck028821; Tue, 14 Nov 2006 17:50:28 GMT Received: from rasmus.uib.no (rasmus.uib.no [129.177.13.13]) by robin.gentoo.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id kAEHoSn5018693 for ; Tue, 14 Nov 2006 17:50:28 GMT Received: from nille.uib.no (smtp.student.uib.no) [129.177.13.20] by rasmus.uib.no with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Gk2QU-0004xe-Oq; Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:50:27 +0100 Received: from apal.ii.uib.no ([127.0.0.1]) [129.177.16.81] by smtp.student.uib.no with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Gk2QU-0006UF-Fh; Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:50:26 +0100 Message-ID: <455A01EA.2000209@gentoo.org> Date: Tue, 14 Nov 2006 18:50:34 +0100 From: Karl Trygve Kalleberg Organization: Genoo Foundation User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.7 (X11/20060918) Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-java@gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 To: David Herron CC: Gentoo-Java Mailing List Subject: Re: [gentoo-java] Java going GPL; Stallman approves -- News at 11:00 References: <200611130008.24137.greg@tassone.net> <4558E44A.10806@ii.uib.no> <455904C7.5080705@sun.com> In-Reply-To: <455904C7.5080705@sun.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-checked-clean: by exiscan on rasmus X-Scanner: f244da0d146a3d5c10b61132fa6485c1 http://tjinfo.uib.no/virus.html X-UiB-SpamFlag: NO UIB: -9.4 hits, 8.0 required X-UiB-SpamReport: spamassassin found; -9.0 Message received from UIB -0.4 Did not pass through any untrusted hosts X-Archives-Salt: bc22bc86-9c89-425a-9eab-1d2b8b50d5a3 X-Archives-Hash: 6619118a7cfedccb1328bc23f58bc9e3 David Herron wrote: > Karl, I agree completely. > > We have been looking at this question for some time. Clearly in the JDK > sources we have code that supports Linux, and we have code which > supports SPARC, but not these two at the same time. It turns out to be > a little difficult to bring those two together. I appreciate the engineering difficulties here, but I don't think they are insurmountable given some time, motivation and elbow grease. > I would think that in the not too far distant future there could be > project(s) like you say working together in the openjdk project to > support the JDK on new architectures and maybe new operating systems. > e.g. The Free BSD team and that ilk might want to collaborate with us > more directly now that our licenses are more open. > > How would *you* prefer that the collaboration would work? > > I know our preference is for the collaboration to be in the bounds of > the openjdk project site. The governance and contribution procedures > are a work in progress at the moment. You can see on the openjdk > project site the contribution process. So, e.g., if you had a > Gentoo-specific source change to make, you could submit it through that > contribution process. My experience with other projects, such as Eclipse, tells me that it would be preferable to have one common repository upstream (that's with you guys) for collecting and sharing patches used in the packaging process. It turns out that many patches used by distro A are also very useful for distro B -- this is a pretty established fact by now. Another established fact is that we (the package maintainers on various distros) spend a lot of time digging through each other's repos and home pages looking for interesting patches for common problems. This is pure waste of time. With Eclipse, we're combating this with a new project, see http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/linux-distro/ Basically, the Eclipse Linux Distro project is a staging ground for fixes/patches/improvements to Eclipse that are specific to Linux (I don't think we're against *BSD in any way -- they've just not been part of the process so far). The patches that end up in the Eclipse "Linux Distro" project will not be automatically placed into the main Eclipse code base. They will most likely simmer in the Eclipse Linux Distro for some time, and during that time, it's up to the various distros whether they want to apply it or not. Some patches might eventually make it into the main Eclipse code base, many won't. But even for those that won't, chances are that they'll be maintained as the main Eclipse code base evolves, since they are often shared across distros, and because maintainers from the various distros have accesss to the Linux Distro code base. Perhaps a similar model will work for the JDK (which is our primary concern ATM -- other projects like J2EE might follow), say a "JDK Linux Distro" subproject of the OpenJDK. However, it is vitally important to keep the barriers for accessing and working on the code base in such a JDK Linux Distro low. I wouldn't mind having to sign the necessary CAs to commit to the JDK Linux Distro subproject, but I *would* mind if some Sun engineer needs to bless my code every time I have a patch to share with the other packagers. "Patch blessing" should only be necessary when code is taken from the JDK Linux Distro staging ground and put into the OpenJDK proper. Since the Eclipse Linux Distro project is still in its infancy, it's too early to tell how well this model works, but if I were in the Sun JDK team, I'd keep an eye out for it and see how well it turns out to work. "A beginning is a very delicate time", as some fictitious princess once said. Cheers, -- Karl T -- gentoo-java@gentoo.org mailing list