From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([69.77.167.62] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1KfWNu-0001iX-72 for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:10 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9337DE04C0; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E573E04C0 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3379067C07 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:08 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at gentoo.org X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 required=5.5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from smtp.gentoo.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp.gentoo.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NVk1pPeuD16j for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ey-out-1920.google.com (ey-out-1920.google.com [74.125.78.149]) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 353A26664D for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:58:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ey-out-1920.google.com with SMTP id 4so1138846eyg.6 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:58:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender :to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references :x-google-sender-auth; bh=NRATTQig5j5XLYurzluHnbUZ18AXg6HONyocPGpM0JA=; b=MGKwTRtGxyZx95H+7uf33c+SMSZhsDAK2avzsArRRtGxZmfnSklsw6ap5HYAV850sN PGsjY0T/ffl+7/PvhxCUQXG4owJOu5atzseqwN6sZ8jC4w5KzshT2/WNBU8MCzwVFYAG I5qDsmboys2Z+iEHA4Q3hVqAebP+McytF99lo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references:x-google-sender-auth; b=KjgXPWnoiL0xMj8nx6G1h4E6uwAoeOMfv6HybmDriux+ajJTJ10hNhyLakgkxlkqeL ETqhie0LhjLWgnb2z8LYVDbGpEaOe04Et7HOsLPT5i2ZXnn6yL21E6YunouzkelXyedM QSqarLTR7RVMosY8hEw0r00WhvBPCjUgHGSTI= Received: by 10.210.124.15 with SMTP id w15mr956444ebc.115.1221555480871; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.210.136.20 with HTTP; Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <17c6771e0809160158r4dd76e40qf44144d65b30840f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2008 09:58:00 +0100 From: "Andrew John Hughes" Sender: gnu.andrew.rocks@gmail.com To: "Alon Bar-Lev" Subject: Re: [gentoo-java] icedtea6 bootstrap Cc: gentoo-java@lists.gentoo.org In-Reply-To: <9e0cf0bf0809142112w70b06774l539cbce4940d30cc@mail.gmail.com> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-java@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <9e0cf0bf0809140538v70975cd1la9582c6e7ab2f0f3@mail.gmail.com> <20080914203857.GA17566@rivendell.middle-earth.co.uk> <9e0cf0bf0809142112w70b06774l539cbce4940d30cc@mail.gmail.com> X-Google-Sender-Auth: dc3fc4b0b2eefb13 X-Archives-Salt: 8c5afca9-d78c-4f7f-abf5-8b7065a3dbb0 X-Archives-Hash: 9632c1fc0a7adbfbdfbc2949b7cd021e 2008/9/15 Alon Bar-Lev : > On 9/14/08, Andrew John Hughes wrote: >> On 15:38 Sun 14 Sep , Alon Bar-Lev wrote: >> > Hello, >> > >> > I just curious... How do you see the boostrap process for normal users? >> > >> > You need jdk to setup icedtea... So we have somekind of loop... >> >> >> Yes, such a bootstrap issue is hardly limited to IcedTea. >> The same occurs with gcc for example, and other Free Java VMs. > > This is OK to have these issues, I just want user to be able to setup > their configuration correctly and easily. > >> > Users who do not want non open source package to run on their computers should: >> > >> > 1. Install gcj >> > 2. Install icedtea >> > 3. Reinstall icedtea so it compiles with icedtea and drop gcj dependency??? >> > 4. Uninstall gcj >> > >> >> >> You don't need stage 3 (there is no 'gcj dependency'), and stage 4 is completely optional. >> Other Free VMs can be used, but they also have bootstrap issues. > > Great! > >> In the long run, we probably need a binary option for lower spec. machines, >> as I've already said. > > I don't like binaries... we really need to find a way to build from source. > There is a way to build from source... but it's always going to be one that's a little complicated and have high requirements (~6gb disk space, a long build time). It may not be possible to build it on some machines. >> > Portage do not support these sequences... >> > >> >> >> Well this is probably a flaw in portage then, but the solution is only >> a two-step emerge process: >> >> emerge gcj-jdk >> emerge icedtea6 >> >> I don't think that's inherently difficult. > > You forgot: > java-config -S icedtea6 > emerge --unmerge gcj-jdk > I didn't forgot the second of these because it's not something I'd do or recommend. It's a waste of time rebuilding gcc again. IcedTea doesn't provide the AOT compilation that gcj does, which is used by other ebuilds. > It is not difficult for me or you. It is difficult for regular user > who want open source jdk and doing emerge openoffice for example. The > first jdk will be pulled... If the first jdk is gcj then this will be > installed and used by openoffice. If you want to use icedtea then you > need to complete some more stages. Most users will need some help. > well, the obvious solution is to depend on gcj-jdk directly, but even more people whined about this when we used to do it. >> > So we have several options: >> > 1. Have users do this manually. >> > 2. Create a script similar to crossdev that perform the sequence. >> > 3. Add a private gcj build into the compile stage of icedtea, and drop >> > the jdk dependency. >> > >> >> >> I don't see any problem with 1. Why is gcj not enabled in the bootstrap >> gcc on the install CDs? > > Because it takes space and not needed for many configurations. > > I think a simple script in the spirit of crossdev will enable users to > correctly and quickly set up their jdk. > Well, feel free to contribute and maintain one then. > Alon. > -- Andrew :-) Support Free Java! Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath http://openjdk.java.net PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net) Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8