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Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 19:51:55 -0700
From: "Andrew Nishihira" <andrewmorio@gmail.com>
To: gentoo-installer@lists.gentoo.org
Subject: Re: [gentoo-installer] Major GLI Redesign!
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Than-you very much for the up-to-date progress. Congratulations for all the
hard work done up to now.I look forwards your release. Anything good to make
Gentoo installation easier for more people.
On 10/17/06, Preston Cody <codeman@gentoo.org> wrote:
>
> Greetings and salutations,
> In GLI's 2.5 years or so of existence, we have achieved almost all of
> the goals of the project. The first main goal of GLI was to make a
> fully automated installation program that would work off of profiles,
> be non-interactive, and architecture-generic. The other main goal was
> to make an installer that could be used by end users for their
> desktops without having to know XML and with pretty, easy-to-use
> frontends that would help boost the reputation of Gentoo as not just a
> super-l33t distro.
>
> We have struggled and faught hard to achieve both goals at the same
> time, but alas they are simply too different to be able to handle both
> and do a *good job* at both.
> The main problem, as was to be expected, is partitioning. Andrew
> Gaffney has spent ages working on trying to support every insaine and
> idiotic combination of partitions that users try to create, but there
> are millions of combinations and the simple truth is we can't do it
> right for everyone, and we're tired of the endless stream of people
> complaining why their drive with 6 primaries isn't being supported.
> Also, with the current partitioning, it is extremely hard to support
> raid or lvm or other architectures in general for that matter.
>
> After seeing the simplicity and ease of Quickstart, the solution
> became clear: admit failure and split/branch GLI. So here's the plan:
>
> Quickstart will become the primary method for automated installations.
> It is designed to be able to be netbooted and will be the installer
> integrated into Scire. It may also be added to the minimal livecd at
> some point (why not, right?). Quickstart works with blank drives
> only, and is not too user-friendly. Currently no frontend or
> configurator exists though I have plans for a web-based one that will
> plug in to Scire nicely.
>
> GLI will be refactored to become slightly more interactive. There
> will probably be about four main steps/stopping points/actions that
> will occur.
> 1. Setup networking, logfiles, chroot_dir and such.. i.e. all the
> client_configuration stuff. This already is done interactively from
> the two main frontends. We can thus chuck the entire client_profile
> (yea!!!!)
> 2. Drop to cfdisk or diskdruid to let the user do partitioning and
> probably filesystem formatting too. This lets the user deal with
> partitioning themselves and thus we don't get the blame when they
> screw it up! :)
> 3. Define mountpoints.. these will replace the partition layout in the
> install profile. Then we fetch/install the stage tarball and/or
> portage. We will still keep the dynamic stage3 (as well as making
> command-line tools for its use), because the installer-livecd isn't
> changing. Having this step separate lets us choose profiles and
> gather updated info about things like USE flags.
> 4. Everything else. There really isn't much benefit to separate out
> the rest of the steps. We'll let people drop to a shell to make their
> own kernel config, but I don't see much beyond that and I still like
> the ability to configure at once and then let it go for a while.
>
> These changes will drastically simplify the partitioning code and make
> GLI much easier to port to other architectures.
>
> The plan is to release a version of GLI like it is now with bugfixes
> only for 2007.0 and target the new GLI (god forbid, should we call it
> GLI 2.0? <cringe>) for 2007.1. If enough progress has been made, we
> can try to put an experimental copy on the livecd and hide it (doesn't
> make much sence to have an entirely different /experimental livecd
> just for that). The new GLI will be written first and foremost with
> gli-dialog as the frontend. The GTK frontend is quite bloated and a
> pain to change and maintain, so it may disappear entirely and that is
> ok by the installer devs.
>
> That's about it, if you have any questions/comments, feel free to post
> them. This list has like no traffic so it could use some discussion
> every once and awhile.
> Have a pleasant day,
>
> -Codeman
> -Installer Project Co-Lead.
> --
> gentoo-installer@gentoo.org mailing list
>
>
--
Andrew
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Than-you very much for the up-to-date progress. Congratulations for all the hard work done up to now.I look forwards your release. Anything good to make Gentoo installation easier for more people.<br><br>
<div><span class="gmail_quote">On 10/17/06, <b class="gmail_sendername">Preston Cody</b> <<a href="mailto:codeman@gentoo.org">codeman@gentoo.org</a>> wrote:</span>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">Greetings and salutations,<br>In GLI's 2.5 years or so of existence, we have achieved almost all of<br>the goals of the project. The first main goal of GLI was to make a
<br>fully automated installation program that would work off of profiles,<br>be non-interactive, and architecture-generic. The other main goal was<br>to make an installer that could be used by end users for their<br>desktops without having to know XML and with pretty, easy-to-use
<br>frontends that would help boost the reputation of Gentoo as not just a<br>super-l33t distro.<br><br>We have struggled and faught hard to achieve both goals at the same<br>time, but alas they are simply too different to be able to handle both
<br>and do a *good job* at both.<br>The main problem, as was to be expected, is partitioning. Andrew<br>Gaffney has spent ages working on trying to support every insaine and<br>idiotic combination of partitions that users try to create, but there
<br>are millions of combinations and the simple truth is we can't do it<br>right for everyone, and we're tired of the endless stream of people<br>complaining why their drive with 6 primaries isn't being supported.<br>Also, with the current partitioning, it is extremely hard to support
<br>raid or lvm or other architectures in general for that matter.<br><br>After seeing the simplicity and ease of Quickstart, the solution<br>became clear: admit failure and split/branch GLI. So here's the plan:<br><br>Quickstart will become the primary method for automated installations.
<br>It is designed to be able to be netbooted and will be the installer<br>integrated into Scire. It may also be added to the minimal livecd at<br>some point (why not, right?). Quickstart works with blank drives<br>only, and is not too user-friendly. Currently no frontend or
<br>configurator exists though I have plans for a web-based one that will<br>plug in to Scire nicely.<br><br>GLI will be refactored to become slightly more interactive. There<br>will probably be about four main steps/stopping points/actions that
<br>will occur.<br>1. Setup networking, logfiles, chroot_dir and such.. i.e. all the<br>client_configuration stuff. This already is done interactively from<br>the two main frontends. We can thus chuck the entire client_profile
<br>(yea!!!!)<br>2. Drop to cfdisk or diskdruid to let the user do partitioning and<br>probably filesystem formatting too. This lets the user deal with<br>partitioning themselves and thus we don't get the blame when they
<br>screw it up! :)<br>3. Define mountpoints.. these will replace the partition layout in the<br>install profile. Then we fetch/install the stage tarball and/or<br>portage. We will still keep the dynamic stage3 (as well as making
<br>command-line tools for its use), because the installer-livecd isn't<br>changing. Having this step separate lets us choose profiles and<br>gather updated info about things like USE flags.<br>4. Everything else. There really isn't much benefit to separate out
<br>the rest of the steps. We'll let people drop to a shell to make their<br>own kernel config, but I don't see much beyond that and I still like<br>the ability to configure at once and then let it go for a while.<br><br>
These changes will drastically simplify the partitioning code and make<br>GLI much easier to port to other architectures.<br><br>The plan is to release a version of GLI like it is now with bugfixes<br>only for 2007.0 and target the new GLI (god forbid, should we call it
<br>GLI 2.0? <cringe>) for 2007.1. If enough progress has been made, we<br>can try to put an experimental copy on the livecd and hide it (doesn't<br>make much sence to have an entirely different /experimental livecd
<br>just for that). The new GLI will be written first and foremost with<br>gli-dialog as the frontend. The GTK frontend is quite bloated and a<br>pain to change and maintain, so it may disappear entirely and that is<br>
ok by the installer devs.<br><br>That's about it, if you have any questions/comments, feel free to post<br>them. This list has like no traffic so it could use some discussion<br>every once and awhile.<br>Have a pleasant day,
<br><br>-Codeman<br>-Installer Project Co-Lead.<br>--<br><a href="mailto:gentoo-installer@gentoo.org">gentoo-installer@gentoo.org</a> mailing list<br><br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Andrew<br>
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