[gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Hello,

I'm looking for an arm based router that easily runs
embedded gentoo with at least 3 (100 Mbps speed ok) ethernet
ports.

I'm going to get 3 to teach a couple of teenagers (oh boy)
how to build and maintain their own router. Sooooooo any
suggestions that simply this embedded gentoo effort, are
most welcome. Raw iptables is what I'm use to using.
A wireless port would be good but not required.



James

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ed W]

On 01/04/2010 13:57, wireless wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I'm looking for an arm based router that easily runs
> embedded gentoo with at least 3 (100 Mbps speed ok) ethernet
> ports.
>
> I'm going to get 3 to teach a couple of teenagers (oh boy)
> how to build and maintain their own router. Sooooooo any
> suggestions that simply this embedded gentoo effort, are
> most welcome. Raw iptables is what I'm use to using.
> A wireless port would be good but not required.
>
>    

It's not ARM based, but the Alix boards are incredibly cheap ($100) and 
come in a 3 port configuration.  Loads of horsepower and adequate RAM

I can't think of a 3 port ARM board off the top of my head, but without 
looking I think that the Linksys and DLink "linux friendly" routers are 
MIPS based?

Is the ARM choice optional?  Scan: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/

Ed W

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Ed W wrote:


> It's not ARM based, but the Alix boards are incredibly cheap ($100) and
> come in a 3 port configuration.  Loads of horsepower and adequate RAM
> 
> I can't think of a 3 port ARM board off the top of my head, but without
> looking I think that the Linksys and DLink "linux friendly" routers are
> MIPS based?
> 
> Is the ARM choice optional?  Scan: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/

Maybe, maybe not. No matter. ARM is the hardware platform
I'm looking for. It's just a choice that I like, not a
'better than' choice....

thanks,
James

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Janusz Syrytczyk]

> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking for an arm based router that easily runs
> embedded gentoo with at least 3 (100 Mbps speed ok) ethernet
> ports.
> 
> I'm going to get 3 to teach a couple of teenagers (oh boy)
> how to build and maintain their own router. Sooooooo any
> suggestions that simply this embedded gentoo effort, are
> most welcome. Raw iptables is what I'm use to using.
> A wireless port would be good but not required.
> 
> 
> 
> James
> 

Those routers are very famous in Europe, but also in AUstralia and now in 
China, my company uses dozens of them, know people who have thousands):

http://routerboard.com/pricelist.php?started_from_home=1

I would use Gentoo on them if I had a reason, but those routers are just fine  
(they include RouterOS, which is in many ways more advanced than many Cisco, 
belive or not, I know what I'm saying). It is possible to boot openWRT also, 
so Gentoo should be possible here too. They're based on Linux.

If you need 3 ports, just pick RB433 or RB433UAH - second has 680MHz, USB and 
3 mPCI slots  for WLAN or anything else.

JS

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ed W]

On 01/04/2010 21:20, Janusz Syrytczyk wrote:
>
> Those routers are very famous in Europe, but also in AUstralia and now in
> China, my company uses dozens of them, know people who have thousands):
>
> http://routerboard.com/pricelist.php?started_from_home=1
>
>    

There are some very cool boards there - however, to my eye it still 
highlights what a bargain the Alix boards are if the feature set matches 
your needs!

Ed W

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Janusz Syrytczyk]

> On 01/04/2010 21:20, Janusz Syrytczyk wrote:
> > Those routers are very famous in Europe, but also in AUstralia and now in
> > China, my company uses dozens of them, know people who have thousands):
> >
> > http://routerboard.com/pricelist.php?started_from_home=1
> 
> There are some very cool boards there - however, to my eye it still
> highlights what a bargain the Alix boards are if the feature set matches
> your needs!
> 
> Ed W
> 

Not a contest, just my three cents, we're not only on the list :-)

In my local store MikroTik is much cheaper (about 20-30% each) and its just 
here, handy, ready to rock.

JS

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Janusz Syrytczyk wrote:

>>> http://routerboard.com/pricelist.php?started_from_home=1

> In my local store MikroTik is much cheaper (about 20-30% each) and its just 
> here, handy, ready to rock.

Sorry, nothing wrong with MIPS or PPC, just not what I'm
looking for. ARM is the target architecture......


Any ARM processor based suggestions?


James

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ned Ludd]

On Mon, 2010-04-05 at 16:38 -0400, wireless wrote:
> Janusz Syrytczyk wrote:
> 
> >>> http://routerboard.com/pricelist.php?started_from_home=1
> 
> > In my local store MikroTik is much cheaper (about 20-30% each) and its just 
> > here, handy, ready to rock.
> 
> Sorry, nothing wrong with MIPS or PPC, just not what I'm
> looking for. ARM is the target architecture......
> 
> 
> Any ARM processor based suggestions?


Sorry none. There exist no ARM based routers cuz ARM is not an ideal
arch for routing. Till recently there were no >1G interfaces most were
10/100 and really 10 at that (driver limitations).


I think you will have to design it vs being able to buy it.
Good luck.

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Arkadi Shishlov]

On 04/05/10 23:38, wireless wrote:
> Sorry, nothing wrong with MIPS or PPC, just not what I'm
> looking for. ARM is the target architecture......
> 
> 
> Any ARM processor based suggestions?

BeagleBoard + USB Ethernet?
or this http://www.olimex.com/dev/sam9-L9260.html

The first one might be a Linux device:
http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/wais1000g.htm
http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/WL-8000VPN.htm

Do you need 3 ports?
Use VLAN tagging or just trust the peers and use single port for all subnets.

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Arkadi Shishlov wrote:

>> Any ARM processor based suggestions?

> BeagleBoard + USB Ethernet?
> or this http://www.olimex.com/dev/sam9-L9260.html

> The first one might be a Linux device:
> http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/wais1000g.htm
> http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/WL-8000VPN.htm


Yea, they look cool. I could hack usb-ethernet (FTDI) or
such, but, I'm thinking more along the Cortex A9 family
of processors....

http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12843&contentId=53243


> Do you need 3 ports?
> Use VLAN tagging or just trust the peers and use single port for all subnets.


Well, I'm trying to combine several needs into one board
(H.264, routing, security and LOW POWER). Rf(ethernet) is
nice but not  necessary.  Being Lazy (old and slow), I was
hoping one of the younger (whipper_snappers) was working on
something like this.


I drop an email to the TI FAE and see what they have for
ready to go boards (dev) boards.

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ed W]

On 05/04/2010 23:45, wireless wrote:
> Arkadi Shishlov wrote:
>
>    
>>> Any ARM processor based suggestions?
>>>        
>    
>> BeagleBoard + USB Ethernet?
>> or this http://www.olimex.com/dev/sam9-L9260.html
>>      
>    
>> The first one might be a Linux device:
>> http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/wais1000g.htm
>> http://www.ovislinkcorp.co.uk/WL-8000VPN.htm
>>      
>
> Yea, they look cool. I could hack usb-ethernet (FTDI) or
> such, but, I'm thinking more along the Cortex A9 family
> of processors....
>
> http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12843&contentId=53243
>
>    

Sorry, back to intel boards again, but these guys I found while 
searching for something else and they have a bunch of interesting stuff, 
no prices though

http://www.computex.biz/lanner/default.aspx?PageType=NewsDetail&list_id=33359

Also did you scan the Linux Devices website I posted before?  Its very 
likely to be listed in a news article on there if it exists...

Good luck

Ed W

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ed W]

Sorry, wrong link before:

     http://www.lannerinc.com/FW-7530

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Ed W]

On 06/04/2010 14:04, Ed W wrote:
> Sorry, wrong link before:
>
>     http://www.lannerinc.com/FW-7530
>
>

Just a note, but I got a quote on a bunch of the LannerInc boards and 
they seem quite affordable for what you get.  You need to call them to 
get your own prices, but they seem to run about $300-400 depending on 
board and spec for the Atom devices with lots of network ports.

Obviously these are quite a lot more power hungry than some ARM device, 
but if you want to filter 8x gig E ports then I wonder if you need 
something a bit more beefy anyway?

Good luck

Ed W

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Ed W wrote:

> Just a note, but I got a quote on a bunch of the LannerInc boards and
> they seem quite affordable for what you get.  You need to call them to
> get your own prices, but they seem to run about $300-400 depending on
> board and spec for the Atom devices with lots of network ports.

> Obviously these are quite a lot more power hungry than some ARM device,
> but if you want to filter 8x gig E ports then I wonder if you need
> something a bit more beefy anyway?

> Ed W


Thanks Ed for the info. I use way less than 10 Mbps, so
these boards (atom & GigE)  are overkill. LOW POWER is the
quintessential goal, and I like ARM processors for a variety
of other reasons: cost, many suppliers, most JTAG setups are
excellent, assembler is very cool on ARM, embeddable on SOC
or FPGA, etc, etc.


James

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Arkadi Shishlov]

On 04/07/10 17:34, Ed W wrote:
> Obviously these are quite a lot more power hungry than some ARM device,
> but if you want to filter 8x gig E ports then I wonder if you need
> something a bit more beefy anyway?

If you want to do that, then you need a specialized hardware (for relatively low
power consumption) or Core2/Phenom class CPU, right?
These recent incarnations of small routers with GigE interfaces is of limited
use. Most even have no memory bandwidth to do the routing on full speed of one
1Gbps stream. I agree, it is better to have GigE, because (1) 100Mbps+ speeds
are attainable, or (2) if there is an ethernet switch chip built-in and actual
processing only happens on WAN port.
Sure, 1GHz PPC RouterBoard or Lanner system has the value, but is it better or
cheaper than a generic Atom/Nano board + multiport ethernet card?

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Arkadi Shishlov]

On 04/06/10 01:45, wireless wrote:
> such, but, I'm thinking more along the Cortex A9 family
> of processors....
>
http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12843&contentId=53243

Are they only available for professional developers of big companies right now?
Must wait for BeagleBoard to migrate to OMAP4.
BTW, if I want to hack on Tegra/Tegra2 or Snapdragon what is my option? Purchase
a consumer device, which one?

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Arkadi Shishlov wrote:
> On 04/06/10 01:45, wireless wrote:
>> such, but, I'm thinking more along the Cortex A9 family
>> of processors....
>>
> http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12843&contentId=53243
> 
> Are they only available for professional developers of big companies right now?
> Must wait for BeagleBoard to migrate to OMAP4.
> BTW, if I want to hack on Tegra/Tegra2 or Snapdragon what is my option? Purchase
> a consumer device, which one?
> 
> 


Once I get 'the sale pitch from TI' I'll post back, if you
like. I have a strong relationship with TI and they have not
dissapointed me in the past. I'm not sure what I'm after is
a dev board that is in the price range of the Beagle, but,
when I spin boards, the cost will approach the Beagle boards.


If other have an interest, we could combine our needs and
spin a common board, then folks that want one, just pay me
for (my) cost on the boards. No layout or design time
charge, just trying to get the quantity up to a dozen or so...

I put H.264 hardware solutions on the boards too, so that
runs up the costs. TI says it's very low now, but, I'm
waiting to hear my costs......

???


James

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Arkadi Shishlov]

On 04/07/10 21:22, wireless wrote:
> Arkadi Shishlov wrote:
>> On 04/06/10 01:45, wireless wrote:
>>> such, but, I'm thinking more along the Cortex A9 family
>>> of processors....
>>>
>> http://focus.ti.com/general/docs/wtbu/wtbuproductcontent.tsp?templateId=6123&navigationId=12843&contentId=53243
>>
>> Are they only available for professional developers of big companies right now?
>> Must wait for BeagleBoard to migrate to OMAP4.

>> BTW, if I want to hack on Tegra/Tegra2 or Snapdragon what is my option? Purchase
>> a consumer device, which one?

Any suggestions?

> Once I get 'the sale pitch from TI' I'll post back, if you
> like. I have a strong relationship with TI and they have not
> dissapointed me in the past. I'm not sure what I'm after is
> a dev board that is in the price range of the Beagle, but,
> when I spin boards, the cost will approach the Beagle boards.
> 
> If other have an interest, we could combine our needs and
> spin a common board, then folks that want one, just pay me
> for (my) cost on the boards. No layout or design time
> charge, just trying to get the quantity up to a dozen or so...

I'll keep that in mind, but I'm waiting for a more mainstream BB with A9. No
rush. :)
Please post your progress anyway.

> I put H.264 hardware solutions on the boards too, so that
> runs up the costs. TI says it's very low now, but, I'm
> waiting to hear my costs......

Isn't C64+ sufficient for H.264? Especially if its OMAP4?

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[Manuel Lauss]

On Thu, Apr 15, 2010 at 5:36 PM, Arkadi Shishlov
<arkadi.shishlov@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> BTW, if I want to hack on Tegra/Tegra2 or Snapdragon what is my option? Purchase
>>> a consumer device, which one?
>
> Any suggestions?

You could look for a nvidia devlite2 board,  very small, with USB and HDMI out;
and a german company introduced a Qseven form-factor module with Tegra2 at
Emedded World tradeshow in March.

On the other hand, you won't be doing much hacking since Nvidia's kernel sources
suck (they're full of useless abstractions hoisted 1:1 from their WinCE port and
mostly ignore established kernel frameworks) and their "documentation"
is woefully
incomplete.

Manuel

Re: [gentoo-embedded] arm router with 3 ports

[wireless]

Arkadi Shishlov wrote:


> Isn't C64+ sufficient for H.264? Especially if its OMAP4?

Yes.

However, if you include a chip from a vendor, such as TI,
then there are never every any royalties due. Much todo
about h.264 royalties buzzing on the net. Beside a h.264
chip and Arm is very low power and the h.264 chip solution
can be put to sleep, thus drawing nano-amps.....



James