From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org ([208.92.234.80] helo=lists.gentoo.org) by finch.gentoo.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NyMZw-0005AI-7X for garchives@archives.gentoo.org; Sun, 04 Apr 2010 09:57:16 +0000 Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8AD50E0B21; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:57:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (smtp.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7926E0AC1 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:57:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68AA41B409F for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:57:02 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at gentoo.org X-Spam-Score: -1.627 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.627 required=5.5 tests=[AWL=-0.887, BAYES_20=-0.74] Received: from smtp.gentoo.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp.gentoo.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rcGmpueoV7DT for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:56:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from lo.gmane.org (lo.gmane.org [80.91.229.12]) by smtp.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39D371B4036 for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:56:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NyMZU-0001OX-Q2 for gentoo-dev@gentoo.org; Sun, 04 Apr 2010 11:56:48 +0200 Received: from ip68-231-22-224.ph.ph.cox.net ([68.231.22.224]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 04 Apr 2010 11:56:48 +0200 Received: from 1i5t5.duncan by ip68-231-22-224.ph.ph.cox.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Sun, 04 Apr 2010 11:56:48 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org From: Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@cox.net> Subject: [gentoo-dev] Re: Is Gentoo dying? Date: Sun, 4 Apr 2010 09:56:39 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: References: <1270286192.18734.3.camel@homer.ob.libexec.de> <20100403184831.2525766f@angelstorm> <4BB85176.3090207@gentoo.org> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: ip68-231-22-224.ph.ph.cox.net User-Agent: Pan/0.133 (House of Butterflies) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Archives-Salt: d46f20b2-0e45-4094-b446-99bec2e03b3f X-Archives-Hash: c036cd380699951b36031031489bf15b Patrick Lauer posted on Sun, 04 Apr 2010 10:44:38 +0200 as excerpted: > On 04/04/10 03:48, Joshua Saddler wrote: >> On Sat, 03 Apr 2010 11:16:32 +0200 >> Tobias Scherbaum wrote: >> =20 >>> - Our formerly outstanding documentation still is somewhat maintained= , >>> but that's it. I haven't seen any new additions (both to our docs, bu= t >>> also to our docs-team) for years. People are constantly asking for a >>> documentation wiki, but ... >>=20 >> Thanks for sh**ting on my efforts. There are lots of visible changes, >> and I make a point of getting the word out when a new guide turns up i= n >> /doc/. >> Oh yes, and I spend hours each week constantly updating docs based on >> the inflow of bugs, forum reports, and I constantly re-read each one >> and improve stuff where I can on-the-fly. > See, that's the problem. > *You* are doing a good job. *We* as a team/community/ant colony aren't. >=20 > The visible rate of change has slowed down, and from your reply I get > the feeling that there are also fewer people working on docs than in th= e > past. So how do we improve the situation? What needs to be done so that > you could disappear for a month or two without affecting progress > because there are enough other motivated people sharing the workload? >=20 > My long-term goal is still to make me redundant. That way I can take a > break whenever I get frustrated and I can focus on new things whenever = I > find something new and shiny to attract my attention... Patrick's right, Nightmorph. I believe pretty much everyone here will=20 agree that you carry a pretty heavy load, almost a super-human load for=20 one person. But I've noticed in replies before as well as this one, you=20 do seem to be getting burned out. Which is only to be expected given tha= t=20 you ARE handling docs pretty much by yourself a lot of the time. And I know you've asked for help, and didn't get it, a couple times as=20 well. So you solder on... more and more frustrated and burnt out, but=20 afraid to stop, because after all, all of Gentoo's depending on you, and=20 it /does/ feel good to have users say how well things went, using the doc= s=20 you've been maintaining... but you're still burning out. The same thing more or less happened to Jakob. There were similar signs=20 of stress, but Gentoo /was/ relying on him, and all the work he did bug- wrangling. Then one day he pretty much dropped off the face of the=20 earth... or so it seemed. It shouldn't have to be that way. You do a great job; a super-human job=20 for one person. But you ARE just one person and unfortunately you AREN'T= =20 superhuman! It's catching up with you, and I know I'm not the only one=20 concerned about it. It's unhealthy for both you and Gentoo. So don't take this the wrong way and drive off the folks trying to help. = =20 Maybe, just maybe, this time you'll some of the help you asked for a year= =20 or whatever it was ago. Meanwhile, some of us really /do/ appreciate all you've done to hold down= =20 the fort, so to speak. I'm sure I don't know the half of it when I say=20 it's not been easy, and that I (and apparently others here) /do/=20 appreciate and recognized the almost super-human job you've been doing,=20 unfortunately, all too often pretty much single handedly. --=20 Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs. "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master -- and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman