[gentoo-dev] Re: Abuse by gentoo developer

[Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@cox.net>]

Casey Allen Shobe posted <200507200132.30745.lists@seattleserver.com>,
excerpted below,  on Wed, 20 Jul 2005 01:32:30 +0000:

> Hello all, I'm sorry to bring this here, but I don't know where else to
> take it, and feel that I was treated really unfairly.
> 
> As you know, I recently inquired about ebuild development on this list,
> and mentioned vpopmail.  <developer> answered my mail and suggested that
> I submit a patch.
> 
> I then spent some time working on the ebuild, and in doing so,
> discovered that the postgres support in vpopmail was not very good at
> all, so I wrote back to <developer>, and said that I was going to hold
> off working on the ebuild since I am currently working with the vpopmail
> team to improve vpopmail itself.  <developer> wrote this rather rude
> reply:
> 
> -------------------
> Casey Allen Shobe wrote:
>> Well I patched the ebuild and got it working, but I'm so terribly
>> disappointed with vpopmail's horrible postgresql support that I don't
>> think I'll be using it at all until I rewrite it. :P
>> 
>> Ah well, thanks anyways.  I'll let you know when/if they let me fix
>> vpopmail (already posted about it on the list).
> 
> The will not allow it and I will not allow someone to go fooling in an
> ebuild I maintain. Not trying to be an ass here but we have something
> called respect for others when it comes to the tree and what they
> maintain.

snip/snip..

The following could be considered philosophical ramblings by some.  Those
who don't like that sort of thing.. skip on to the next message.

So as not to get too personal, I replaced the name with <developer>.  I
really wish this had been done in the original.  After all, for those
needing to know, it's not difficult to trace who <developer> might be,
especially since this was posted to a public list with the (ostensible)
goal of finding where to take it next, NOT to specifically point fingers,
and leaving names out of it can sometimes help ease tensions.

As others have stated, devrel is the place to take it.  However, there was
the question of what remark may have been taken wrongly.  I think I see
that, above.

<developer> likely took the "horrible ... support ... I won't be using at
all until I rewrite it" as a threat to his maintainership of the package,
not seeing that you meant working with upstream.  Else, perhaps he was
instrumental in creating the original upstream support you just called
"horrible", saying you were going to "rewrite" it, in which case yeah, I
can see someone getting a bit offended over that.

Yes, folks need to develop a rather thicker skin and take offense less
easily. However, the FLOSS community is unfortunately all too rich with
stories of rivalries and enemies made, for no reason other than offense
was taken where no offense was originally intended.

I've come to believe, due to a large degree to my own often humbling
experiences, that a good portion of the problem is that FLOSS community
developers often tend to be far better at what they do than most of their
real life peers, and are used to being considered /the/ reference
authority on their interests and often on computers or technology in
general.  In meatspace, they are usually 90th percentile and above, and so
used to "explaining" things in "normal people" terms that they do it as a
matter of course, simply assuming (usually correctly, in meatspace) they
have a better understanding of the topic than anyone else around.

Now, take this 90th plus percentile person, and change their peer group
from one of the general population to one where they are co-equal or even
at the LOW end of understanding of the tech involved, and it can be a VERY
humbling experience.  NO LONGER are they always right, or at least "right
enough" that no one else has the knowledge to question them!   Getting
used to being at the LOW end, having folks talk down to YOU, as you've
been used to talking down (not in a mean way, but just at a level that can
be understood) to others, NOT being the unquestioned authority on the
subject because no one else knows enough about it to question you, takes a
*LOT* of getting used to.

It is my belief that many of the misunderstandings in the community are
based on this problem.  Someone has a huge ego, because they are used to
being right, 99% of the time, and never having to say "I'm sorry", or "I
was wrong".  Get that someone interfacing with another someone with the
same problem, and there can be and often are fireworks!  Most in the
community eventually learn to deal with the problem, becoming rather more
humble in the process, but some never do.  One of the amazing things about
Linus, if you've watched him in action, is how well he seems to have
learned this lesson -- how incredibly well he defuses the situation (in
most cases, the bitkeeper thing was exceptional in that it was the
exception proving the general point) with his self deprecating humor.

So... I'd just consider this the growing pains of a developer, faced with
dealing with an environment where he is surrounded by mostly equals (or
better) for the first time, thus, STRONGLY reacting as if his legitimacy
was challenged, at the slightest suggestion that there might be a
different and possibly better solution to the issue.  That words like
"horrible" and "rewrite" were included only strengthened what was in his
view a serious challenge to his maintainership, and therefore, to his
legitimacy as a Gentoo developer.

I'd suggest apologies would be in order from both sides.  Unfortunately,
when one side has resorted to kill filing the other, it's very difficult
to get an apology through, and yes, then it's time to involve a third
party, the reason devrelations is there.  Ideally, both sides ultimately
learn from the situation, making the one less likely to take offense and
more "professional" in his reactions even when he /does/ take /personal/
offense, and the other more aware of the sensitivity of words such as
"horrible" and "rewrite", particularly for those somewhat insecure in
their position in the first place.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman in
http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/12/22/rms_interview.html


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